Haydn's Haus

[Leon]

That seems like a very fair assessment, Arnold. I also have the McCabe, and it was also my first complete traversal. I like McCabe because he makes a modern piano not sound like a modern piano. Much like Ingrid Haebler does in Mozart;



While both of these artists are able to bring it off, most modern pianists in either of these cycles of work tend to turn me off with overly reverberant sound. Stylistically, the commonly used (today) legato that was aspired to by the early Romantics and most pianists since then simply doesn't work that well in these works. So overall, I'll probably give most of the moderns a miss (especially Gould! ), but as I always do, I say again that one should go with whatever pleases him, since the music is the thing.

Interesting that you mention Ingrid Haebler, I too enjoy her Mozart, I have her on maybe six concertos.  I also like Casadeus.  There's no need to invest in Bavouzet if your interest is primarily for period recordings and especially since you already have McCabe.  I just like hearing Haydn under a wide variety of settings and find it hard to resist the keyboard sonatas labeled with Vol. 1, Vol. 2, etc.

[Gurn Blanston]

Interesting that you mention Ingrid Haebler, I too enjoy her Mozart, I have her on maybe six concertos.  I also like Casadeus.  There's no need to invest in Bavouzet if your interest is primarily for period recordings and especially since you already have McCabe.  I just like hearing Haydn under a wide variety of settings and find it hard to resist the keyboard sonatas labeled with Vol. 1, Vol. 2, etc.

  Yes, you must develop inner stiffness, Arnold. Else you will succumb to CDCDCD!   

Unusually enough, I have Haebler playing Haydn (5 sonatas) on a fortepiano (unidentified model), recorded in 1968, it is the oldest fortepiano recording I've ever seen. And it is excellent besides. Clearly raised her even higher in my estimation!

[Leo K.]

Arnold, I agree on the Brendel Haydn set, I love his sound in Haydn (as well as his Mozart and Schubert). I'm still exploring his Haydn but it fits right with my sensibilities.

I had forgotten how great the sound of a modern grand can be. It took a recent journey with Bach's WTC on the piano for me to have this revelation!

[Sergeant Rock]

I am thrilled to see Haydn as high as #3! His stock value is improving every day.

But how long can this Haydn bubble last?

With Haydn's Army aboard, FOREVER!   Hit me, Sarge!

First Sergeant Haydn




Sarge

[Karl Henning]

This here oratorio, The Creation, hath utterly gobsmacked me.

[chasmaniac]

This here oratorio, The Creation, hath utterly gobsmacked me.

Vollendet ist das gobsmacking Werk!

[Gurn Blanston]

First Sergeant Haydn




Sarge

That is a very rare picture from when Sergeant Haydn led the charge at the Battle of Lodi. From Wikipedia Commons:

The Battle of Lodi was fought on May 10, 1796 between French forces under General Napoleon Bonaparte and an Austrian rear guard led by Sergeant Franz Joseph Haydn at Lodi, Lombardy. Despite playing the March for the Society of Royal Musicians at full volume, the rear guard was eventually defeated, but the main body of Johann Peter Beaulieu's Austrian Army had time to retreat.

Thanks for reminding us all of the valiant aspect of Haydn that is too often overlooked when speaking of his music!   

[Scion7]

First sergeant Haydn!

[Sergeant Rock]

That is a very rare picture from when Sergeant Haydn led the charge at the Battle of Lodi. From Wikipedia Commons:

Thanks for reminding us all of the valiant aspect of Haydn that is too often overlooked when speaking of his music!   

What would we do without Wiki? So much history would be lost 

Sarge

[Gurn Blanston]

What would we do without Wiki? So much history would be lost 

Sarge

Well, Wiki plus your picture album! You have some amazing things stored there, Sarge.

[Scion7]

. . .Op.20 quartets

Ok - I traded some precious life essence for the Opus 20 set by the Mosaic Quartet (not their french name) - are you satisfied???
You have seriously compromised my CDCDCD.   

[DavidW]

Ok - I traded some precious life essence for the Opus 20 set by the Mosaic Quartet (not their french name) - are you satisfied???
You have seriously compromised my CDCDCD.   

That will be the cd set that triggers the avalanche that buries you under vinyl and plastic!

[Leo K.]

Oh, yes I like the Beghin set quite a lot, and generally prefer period instrument recordings, especially of the keyboard works.  However, there are some recordings on piano which I also enjoy.  I've had the John McCabe set for ages, I think it was my first complete set - and it holds up.  There's the 4-disc Brendel set that is really fantastic. There are others, but I've never focused on modern recordings so I don't have Hamelin, and wish I didn't have Gould. 

Now we come to Jean-Efflam Bavouzet who seems to be embarking on a complete set of the Haydn sonatas.  I've liked his playing in Debussy, and even Gershwin - but had not heard him in Classical era works.   I know of three volumes of Haydn so far, and took the plunge.  These are not indulgent performances, no unstylistic over-pedaling, or other pianistic elements which I find distracting when used on Haydn, or other pre-piano composers.  Some reviews have complained of a loss of focus after the first disc, but I have not lived with them long enough to confirm that judgement.

Not overly reverberant, and his playing is not uncharacteristic for these works.  If that sounds like faint praise, it's not - it is just that I am not prone to indepth analysis of recordings and only want to convey a general impression.  Also, as I said, I haven't lived with these very long and am still listening to them for the first time.  So far I like them at least as much as the McCabe.

Recommended but not for doctrinaire PIons.

[asin]B003627OMG[/asin]

Arnold, I got these new recordings on your recommendation, and can say the first disk is truely wonderful, I'm loving the tone of the piano ( I believe it is a Yamaha) and the performances!

[Gurn Blanston]

Continuing my effort to revise the early essays in the series, I have just finished with Parts 2 & 3 (they are combined into one long part). Please feel free to check them out, I hope you find it worth your time. And certainly feedback is nice, always looking to improve.



Parts 2 & 3 (1751-53)

[Mandryka]

Someone has uploaded onto symphonyshare  the  Australian Chamber Orchestra  and Richard Tognetti playing Symphony 88 in Vienna on November 30, 2011.

It's well worth hearing.

[kentel]

Part 1

1749-50 and before...

We start off here with the Missa brevis, which I am opting to go with Burdick here. His version is the most fundamental, he uses the actual original instrumentation while nearly everyone else uses the 1805 re-orchestration that Haydn himself did for publication in Breitkopf & Härtel's 'Complete Works'.

For the Missa 'rorate coeli desuper', an Advent mass with an uncertain origin, I have chosen Hickox and Co.. Not least because they have deigned to record it and let you hear it for yourself. This is a very simple mass, written in the style of the time, which was having all 4 lines written simultaneously so that extended parts of the Gloria and Credo come out on just a page. The current scholarship, after years of fretting over it, is that Haydn composed the 2 violin parts and the vocal melodies, all of which are less polished, over the perfect figured bass that was probably composed by his teacher, Rütter. So a student work, clearly, but one which is still interesting to listen to if you have the chance.

Finally to 1750, where we find 4 Motets of the Holy Sacrament. From a 13th century text, Lauda Sion! (Praise Sion!) is a series of 4 motets performed at a procession to 4 different altars at the church. In Vienna it was part of the Corpus Christi Day worship. Haydn set it twice; this extremely early version, all 4 in C major, and again in 1765 when he set the texts in the contrasting keys of Bb, d, A & Ab. This is his earliest essay into the Viennese tradition of jubilant, triumphant C major with trumpets and all. I really like the job that Weil and the Tafelmusiker did with this, it smacks of Old Vienna.

So there it is, the beginning of a long, long road. The Baroque is still around, and the road doesn't end until the Romantic (so-called) is in full swing. Haydn spanned the entire age, and in fact, it's name and symbolism, "The Classical Era" derive from the music of this one source. I hope you will enjoy it as much as I do.

Thank you very much for sharing your experience and enthusiasm about Haydn's music. I suddenly realize that he's a composer that I don't really know. We have him at hand all the time, but we just know a few symphonies, a few string quartets and the Creation...

I've read your biographical notes and listened to the 3 first works you mentioned. The Missa Brevis is awesome : I expected some kind of boring choral work written by a young prodigy, technically beyond critics but deprived of density and inspiration. In fact it is an outstanding piece, thematically splendid from the beginning to the end, with beautiful choir and instrumental textures.

I was not very fond of the two others : the 4 Motets and the Mass "Rorate coeli desuper", which are fine piece without the thematical and instrumental inspiration of the Missa Brevis.

I listened to Burdick and Hickox, and I noticed that the numbering of the masses is quite disconcerting : the first mass ("Missa Brevis") has the nr.2 while its Hoboken nr. is XXII-1, which suggests that it should be the first. Moreover, the Mass "Rorate coeli desuper" (Hob XXIII-3) has the nr. 3 in Hickox's, but in Burdick the Mass nr. 3 is the "Cacilienmesse" (Hob XXIII-5)... That's puzzling : is there an explanation to that ?

I couldn't find the Brilliant recording for the 4 Motets, but found it on a choir compilation :

[Gurn Blanston]

Thank you very much for sharing your experience and enthusiasm about Haydn's music. I suddenly realize that he's a composer that I don't really know. We have him at hand all the time, but we just know a few symphonies, a few string quartets and the Creation...

I've read your biographical notes and listened to the 3 first works you mentioned. The Missa Brevis is awesome : I expected some kind of boring choral work written by a young prodigy, technically beyond critics but deprived of density and inspiration. In fact it is an outstanding piece, thematically splendid from the beginning to the end, with beautiful choir and instrumental textures.

I was not very fond of the two others : the 4 Motets and the Mass "Rorate coeli desuper", which are fine piece without the thematical and instrumental inspiration of the Missa Brevis.

I listened to Burdick and Hickox, and I noticed that the numbering of the masses is quite disconcerting : the first mass ("Missa Brevis") has the nr.2 while its Hoboken nr. is XXII-1, which suggests that it should be the first. Moreover, the Mass "Rorate coeli desuper" (Hob XXIII-3) has the nr. 3 in Hickox's, but in Burdick the Mass nr. 3 is the "Cacilienmesse" (Hob XXIII-5)... That's puzzling : is there an explanation to that ?

I couldn't find the Brilliant recording for the 4 Motets, but found it on a choir compilation :

kentel,
Thank you for your visit; hope you will be back for more.

Here is a list of the masses in their correct order;

Year   Hob 22 #   Title
1749      1        Missa brevis
1749      3        Missa 'Rorate coeli desuper'
1768      2        Missa sunt 'bona mixta malis'
1768      4        'Grosseorgelsolomesse'
1772      6        Missa Sancti Nicolai
1773      5        Cäcilienmesse'
1775      7        'Kleine Orgelsolomesse'
1782      8        Mariazellermesse'
1796      9        Paukenmesse'
1796      10        Heiligmesse'
1798      11        Nelsonmesse'
1799      12        Theresienmesse
1801      13        Schöpfungsmesse
1802      14        Harmoniemesse

The problem of numbering arose because Hoboken then, and in many cases, us now, simply didn't know the correct dating of a lot of works. More recent scholarship has nailed down the masses fairly certainly, but other genres still have some ambiguities, or in the case of those which have been resolved, some numbering which is at best a puzzle.    If you go to the table of contents you can find a link to the (hopefully) correct chronology of the symphonies. Comparing the 'new' numbers with the Hoboken numbers gives you the dual revelation that so many were so wrong, but oppositely, many of them were correct also, a big surprise.

That Brilliant recording is a very rare piece, no surprise you were unable to find it. It was licensed from Sony, but sale was allowed only in the Benelux countries. Fortunately for me, I have some very dear friends there who gifted me with both that box and the Hickox. Life is good sometimes.

[Leon]

Arnold, I got these new recordings on your recommendation, and can say the first disk is truely wonderful, I'm loving the tone of the piano ( I believe it is a Yamaha) and the performances!

That's good to hear, Leo; I am happy these recordings, so far, are enjoyable for you.

I also liked the sound of the piano, it seemed somehow lighter than a large concert grand.  While I still prefer the period instruments I will also hear some Haydn performed on a modern piano, from time to time, that merits recommending.  I hope your enjoyment continues through the other volumes.  I've gone back and listened to my McCabe set and and am finding his interpretations a bit less interesting, although not bad by any stretch, it is just that Bavouzet seems to play with a some more verve.  Of course, that very thing may turn off others.

[Gurn Blanston]

Now I've completed this update;  Part 4 - 1754-55

I hope you enjoy it, clearly I couldn't add any music to it, but I did add quite a bit of biography, for those of you who are following that aspect. Enjoy!

[Leo K.]

That's good to hear, Leo; I am happy these recordings, so far, are enjoyable for you.

I also liked the sound of the piano, it seemed somehow lighter than a large concert grand.  While I still prefer the period instruments I will also hear some Haydn performed on a modern piano, from time to time, that merits recommending.  I hope your enjoyment continues through the other volumes.  I've gone back and listened to my McCabe set and and am finding his interpretations a bit less interesting, although not bad by any stretch, it is just that Bavouzet seems to play with a some more verve.  Of course, that very thing may turn off others.

Bavouzet definitely plays with verve, and with wit. I'm still listening to the first disk, and I'm thinking Haydn's keyboard literature is so vast and all encompassing that its difficult to comprehend such a sublime feat!