Pierre Boulez (1925-2016)

[Karl Henning]

But Bruckner's influence is surprising, since Bruckner wasn't part of French musical culture – at least not while you were growing up.

Boulez: Bruckner wasn't even performed at all, and even as late as when Karajan brought along a symphony by Bruckner when he came on tour with the Berlin Philharmonic, the reaction in some of the papers was, "why did he bring this monster?" And even Messiaen – though you can imagine that there are some very strange ties between the universe of Messiaen and the universe of Bruckner – Messiaen said, "oh, Bruckner, that's a lot of bridges." Now in French, when you have a transition from one section to another one, you call that a bridge. And for Messiaen, Bruckner's music was simply one of transition after transition after transition. And that's very strange, and the French are indeed sometimes complete strangers to ways of musical thinking that are not native to their own practice. Even in the case of Mahler: now he's very popular, but France was that last country to rediscover him. England and the States were much more open to the influence of Mahler [than] the French were.

[ritter]

Happy 90th birthday! Joyeux anniversaire! Alles Gute zum Geburtstag!


With deep gratitude for all the joy Pierre Boulez has given to many of us for many, many years.

[San Antone]

I could say something like "20th century is just too easy at this point .. and everything usually is weighted toward the 1st half of the century give or take a year. I don't think [Pierre Boulez] has assimilated the masters of the 2nd half much."

But I won't.

[Karl Henning]

I could say something like "20th century is just too easy at this point .. and everything usually is weighted toward the 1st half of the century give or take a year. I don't think [Pierre Boulez] has assimilated the masters of the 2nd half much."

But I won't.

It's a notion worth considering, though 

Happy birthday, maître! (Put that marteau down ....)

[Karl Henning]

Christ .. I saw that one coming last week.

Was it at a very early age that you had your sense of humor removed?

[springrite]

It's a notion worth considering, though

Happy birthday, maître! (Put that marteau down ....)

Well, happy birthday, with a marteau-shaped birthday cake!

[San Antone]

It's a notion worth considering, though

Happy birthday, maître! (Put that marteau down ....)

Hear, hear!  Happy Birthday. 

Another notion worth considering is how Euro-centric is his list. 

[North Star]

Happy birthday to Boulez

Another notion worth considering is how Euro-centric is his list.

And the only living composer on the list is Boulez. . .
But it's not a list of the ten greatest pieces, just ten great pieces. And it's all music he knows intimately, has performed, and comes or is part of the tradition he comes from.

[San Antone]

Come on! You know your stuff or what?

First, that is the birth place of western art music/composition, it was imported to the States much, much later.

Second, his oft stated favorite American composer was Elliott Carter.

I think it shows how trivial these kinds of lists are.  Boulez is an important composer/musician, but his list is just another pointless list of works that are fetishized at the expense of all the other well crafted and worthwhile music that has been written in the vast amount of space not included in any list of ten works.

[Karl Henning]

I think it shows how trivial these kinds of lists are.  Boulez is an important composer/musician, but his list is just another pointless list of works that are fetishized at the expense of all the other well crafted and worthwhile music that has been written in the vast amount of space not included in any list of ten works.

Why, you almost talk as if Boulez had merely human limitations and prejudices!

[Christo]

Pointless? Central-Europe is the cultural center of classical music and it's birth place, wake up please.

Central-Europe is nowadays generally defined as 'Poland, Slovakia, Czech Republic, Hungary, Romania' and a few neighbours. So, I tend to agree with your Central-European preferences.

[San Antone]

Pointless? Central-Europe is the cultural center of classical music and it's birth place, wake up please.

And I'd say that is a pretty damn great list. Like you know any better!

It is a arguably a very good list.  However, you missed my point entirely, which was not that I had a problem with his specific choices.  Rather my criticism was towards the idea of compiling a list in the first place.  It is akin, IMO, to attempting to capture the entire history of the 20th century with ten headlines.  And for Boulez, only European newspapers at that.

[Karl Henning]

There's something wonderfully (if only mildly) amusing about a native speaker of English, in this "Cultural Policing" context, employing both a superfluous hyphen and the wrong form of its:

Central-Europe is the cultural center of classical music and it's birth place, wake up please.

[Karl Henning]

I suppose the eradication of the fallacies only begins with . . . at this point, does Classical Music have a "center"?

[North Star]

I suppose the eradication of the fallacies only begins with . . . at this point, does Classical Music have a "center"?

When did it have? I have a feeling that this is always posthumous creation, the winners writing the history of the cultural wars. . .

[Karl Henning]

When did it have? I have a feeling that this is always posthumous creation, the winners writing the history of the cultural wars. . .

Exactly.

[EigenUser]

Guys, it's PB's birthday! Stop arguing! Go and listen to Eclat or something...

*In a scolding tone* Karl, stop firing up James! James, stop catching on fire!

[Ken B]

Guys, it's PB's birthday! Stop arguing! Go and listen to Eclat or something...

*In a scolding tone* Karl, stop firing up James! James, stop catching on fire!

I will honor his birthday in the most appropriate way. I will try to have other composers' music suppressed.

[Karl Henning]

I wonder if Boulez enjoys The Simpsons . . . .

I will honor his birthday in the most appropriate way. I will try to have other composers' music suppressed.

(* dries a tear of chauvinistic pride *)

[EigenUser]

I wonder if Boulez enjoys The Simpsons . . . .

I'm sure he does. They made fun of Philip Glass in an episode (the one when Springfield got a concert hall and orchestra). People start leaving after the first 8 notes of Beethoven's 5th (because "that's the important part!") and Marge yells out "Wait -- don't go! Next up we have Philip Glass!" They all run out screaming (including the musicians).