Most difficult pieces?

[rappy]

What do you think are the most difficult pieces for listeners? Which pieces to you have to listen to 20 times with 1 month breaks in-between before you'll get them?
Pieces which are just difficult for the sake of being difficult don't count.

[Norbeone]

Eine Kleine Nachtmusik and The Nutcracker Suite would have to be on such a list.

[rappy]

Of course. + Für Elise

[hornteacher]

Eine Kleine Nachtmusik and The Nutcracker Suite would have to be on such a list.

No, those are pieces you need a 20 month break after listening to them once.

[carlos]

Busoni'2 Fantasia Contrapuntistica on a Bach's theme. What an obscure, complicate and f...piece!

[Bonehelm]

Canon in D immediately comes to mind. Next I thought of Elgar's entire output.

[m_gigena]

Busoni'2 Fantasia Contrapuntistica on a Bach's theme. What an obscure, complicate and f...piece!

I was either bored or overwhelmed. I could never listen to the complete thing anyway.

[Ephemerid]

What do you think are the most difficult pieces for listeners? Which pieces to you have to listen to 20 times with 1 month breaks in-between before you'll get them?
Pieces which are just difficult for the sake of being difficult don't count.

Speaking only for myself, from my own limitations:

Bach: The Art of Fugue - this is still tough sledding for me &  can only handle it in very small doses.  I adore Bach, but with this piece, I feel "contrapuntally challenged" 

Anything by Lizst and most things by Mahler I have a very hard time with.  To me, its just overly melodramatic music -- I know that is VERY unfair of me to say-- they may be great composers, but I still find them both difficult to relate to.   

Strauss: Metamorphosen - downloaded this a few weeks ago & I simply cannot work my way into this piece - maybe its the performance, but to my ears it just meanders on and on at (seemingly) the same level of tension.  It just sounds like a maze of chromaticism to me, even a bit neurotic.

Debussy: Jeux - Debussy and Bach are my two very favourite composers, but I do think Jeux is a tough nut to crack still.

Stravinsky: Petroushka - The middle sections I find hard to keep my attention on still (the outer sections are marvellous though).  The Rite of Spring, on the other hand, I find very approachable & immediate.

Copland's Piano Variations - newcomers used to Appalachian Spring & Billy the Kid might be a bit shocked with this earlier work - I had a hard time of it, though now I consider it one of Copland's best pieces.  As a teenager just beginning to explore modern music, this one took me a long time to get into (I find it very hummable now LOL).

Messiaen: Vignt Regards - I recently *clicked* with Messiaen after many repeated attempts over the years, but this one I still don't quite get (many beautiful moments, but there are still certain movements that really puzzle me).

Most Philip Glass post-1979 (there are a few exceptions).  I find it hard to keep my attention with his stuff-- ironically, his more extreme, longer works from the 70s I find thrilling & spellbinding (like Einstein on the Beach which is a four hour long rush!).  I simply get bored with most of Glass' work since 1980 within the first 120 seconds.  I find muzak more interesting. 

[Steve]

Mahler, Symphonies 1, 3, 8 - While, I have become a bit of a Mahlerite, it took many listens (often a few minutes at a time), to finally appreciate several of his symphonies.

Tchaikovsky, Piano Concerto No. 1. I consider his music to be among the most approachable of his contemporaties, and yet, there are still moments, such as his Piano Concerto No. 1, which weren't immediate. In that famous piece, the opening two-minutes excite, only to level off soon thereafter.

Debussy, Works for Solo Piano. I confess having a great difficulty with Debussy. Minimalist piano, for that matter...

Stravinsky, Petroushka. Opening few minutes presented the greatest challenge. Lacking much of the full, lush sounds of his other works.

Elgar, Symphonies. Or rather, any of his output.

[The fatgoat]

Any Mahler symphony. I'll fall asleep halfway through them. Pieces by Penderecki are also quite difficult at first. Some of the more dissonant parts of Prokofiev's Romeo and Juliet are hard too. Many pieces by Schoenberg and Webern are probably way out there for most. Maybe Shostakovich's 4th Symphony is hard. I'll think of more...

[Bonehelm]

Any Mahler symphony. I'll fall asleep halfway through them. Pieces by Penderecki are also quite difficult at first. Some of the more dissonant parts of Prokofiev's Romeo and Juliet are hard too. Many pieces by Schoenberg and Webern are probably way out there for most. Maybe Shostakovich's 4th Symphony is hard. I'll think of more...

x 100...

Maybe you haven't heard "Resurrection" at full blast yet?

[12tone.]

x 100...

Maybe you haven't heard "Resurrection" at full blast yet?

WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!

[Symphonien]

Mahler's 9th.

I still don't fully understand it, yet I enjoy listening to it. And if you want a real challenge, try his 10th.

And then, when you're feeling extremely brave, you can try Lachenmann.

[val]

SCHÖNBERG:  Pélleas et Mélisande: I never understood it. And I love most of Schönberg's works.

Other very difficult works:
BARRAQUÉ:  Piano Sonata (but the 2nd part always impressed me)
NONO:   Diotima Quartet

[m_gigena]

Anything by Lizst

Try the Consolation #3.

[Lethevich]

Elgar, Symphonies. Or rather, any of his output.

I can't think of many things more immediately engaging than Sospiri, the serenade, or the string quartet, to name just a few...

[springrite]

I can't think of many things more immediately engaging than Sospiri, the serenade, or the string quartet, to name just a few...

You realise that the mentioning of Elgar is mandatory in a thread like this and Steve is merely obliging.

[Ephemerid]

Try the Consolation #3.

Thanks, Manuel.  I'll add this to my list.   

[paulb]

What do you think are the most difficult pieces for listeners? Which pieces to you have to listen to 20 times with 1 month breaks in-between before you'll get them?
Pieces which are just difficult for the sake of being difficult don't count.

   Used to be Schonberg, Berg, Webern. Now its some Carter and most of Schnittke.

[Kullervo]

Any work by Feldman reminds me of Carl Maria von Weber's witty aperçu of one of Beethoven's symphonies: "A sound every half-hour or so."

Schoenberg's 3rd and 4th quartets — I'm completely at a loss as to how to listen to these.

Nørgård's 5th symphony — I must have listened to this at least ten times and can't make heads nor tails of it. Strange, because I feel I've come to grips with all his other symphonies. It just sounds like party favors and dog whistles with orchestral glissandi added for no reason.