Alfred Schnittke (1934-1998)

[Mirror Image]

Listened to Polyansky's performance of the 2nd today and I'm very impressed with it. I like a lot better than Segerstam's. I think much of it had to do with how it was conducted (tempi, overall pacing) and the atmospheric sound of the recording. It really brought the whole piece into a new light for me. It's still a strange brew to be certain, but through this performance I have a better understanding of the structure of the work.

[Mirror Image]

Finished Schnittke's Symphony No. 4 awhile ago and I have never been so disappointed with a piece of music in my life. I mean if it was half the length then it might have been more interesting but this symphony is 45 minutes! I won't be wasting my time with this one again. I did like the 2nd a good bit but as I wrote above I've heard it before and even enjoyed it then. I don't plan on giving these Chandos recordings away, but it's not looking good for me and Schnittke right now or at least with his symphonies anyway. I do like his ballet Peer Gynt a good bit but it had some rhythmic drive to it which helped it considerably. I don't think I'll ever understand this fourth symphony at all, but, then again, I don't think I want to understand it. I'm not a listener who likes everything to fall into his lap but I am a listener who likes some kind of forward momentum happening in piece of music.

[TheGSMoeller]

Finished Schnittke's Symphony No. 4 awhile ago and I have never been so disappointed with a piece of music in my life. I mean if it was half the length, then it might have been more interesting but this symphony is 45 minutes! I won't be wasting my time with this one again. I did like the 2nd a good bit but as I wrote above I've heard it before and even enjoyed it then. I don't plan on giving these Chandos recordings away, but it's not looking good for me and Schnittke right now or at least with his symphonies anyway. I do like his ballet Peer Gynt a good bit but it had some rhythmic drive to it which helped it considerably. I don't think I'll ever understand this fourth symphony at all, but, then again, I don't think I want to understand it. I'm not a listener who likes everything to fall into his lap but I am a listener who likes some kind of forward momentum happening in piece of music.

Ouch, his 4th made my short list of recordings I am considering from Schnittke. 

[Mirror Image]

Ouch, his 4th made my short list of recordings I am considering from Schnittke. 

Yeah, I just thought it was a colossal mess. I mean the music went nowhere. It makes me appreciate a composer like Ligeti even more. That guy was freakin' amazing! There was nothing happening in Schnittke's music to where I took notice. It just all flew by me and nothing stuck out at all. Not a snippet of a melody, rhythm, or harmony. Time to go back to Shostakovich. That was a nice little break.

[eyeresist]

Yes, MI, the 4th is a pretty dreery experience.

To be honest, I am getting bored with Schnittke now. Not sure how much repeat value he has.

[Karl Henning]

I cannot believe I'm reading this: the Fourth — "dreary"? Not to my ears at all.

Sheesh, reminds me of times I've heard people dismiss Russian Orthodox liturgical music as "dreary," because their idea of "sacred music" is "He's Got the Whole World in His Hands."

[Mirror Image]

Yes, MI, the 4th is a pretty dreery experience.

To be honest, I am getting bored with Schnittke now. Not sure how much repeat value he has.

I just don't think I'm brave enough to continue with Schnittke's music.

[Karl Henning]

Ouch, his 4th made my short list of recordings I am considering from Schnittke. 

Greg, if you enjoyed my Passion, I have every confidence that the Schnittke Fourth will meet your ears' favor.

[lescamil]

I just don't think I'm brave enough to continue with Schnittke's music.

Did you at least listen to the first piano concerto? His Shostakovich-like works should be enough for you.

[Mirror Image]

Did you at least listen to the first piano concerto? His Shostakovich-like works should be enough for you.

I'm definitely going to listen to it.

[eyeresist]

I cannot believe I'm reading this: the Fourth — "dreary"? Not to my ears at all.

Sheesh, reminds me of times I've heard people dismiss Russian Orthodox liturgical music as "dreary," because their idea of "sacred music" is "He's Got the Whole World in His Hands."

Actually, I have a CD of Russian liturgy (with clanging bells and everything) which I think is pretty awesome. You can almost smell the incense.

[TheGSMoeller]

Greg, if you enjoyed my Passion, I have every confidence that the Schnittke Fourth will meet your ears' favor.

That's all the proof I need to continue with my Schnittke plunge. Thanks, Karl. 

[Mirror Image]

That's all the proof I need to continue with my Schnittke plunge. Thanks, Karl. 

I wish I could like the 4th, but it's completely directionless. I mean I realize this kind of compositional writing is apart of the musical avant-garde or whatever, but I'm almost appalled by the lack of rhythm, melody, and harmony. I hear all of these things and more in Ligeti's music. Schnittke just seemed like he was after shock value instead of trying to make meaningful music. I know he's said he is grateful to anyone that listens and performs his music, but I guess if I composed the way he did, I would be too. Greg, proceed with caution. That's all I'll say.

[eyeresist]

I know he's said he is grateful to anyone that listens and performs his music, but I guess if I composed the way he did, I would be too.

Oh, that is WICKED! 

[Mirror Image]

Oh, that is WICKED! 

[Mirror Image]

Greg, you've got mail.

[Karl Henning]

 Quote from: Mirror Image on March 11, 2012, 11:58:52 PM

Schnittke just seemed like he was after shock value instead of trying to make meaningful music.

 
What a peculiar thing for you to say in a discussion about the Fourth.

[not edward]

Quote from: Mirror Image on March 11, 2012, 11:58:52 PM

Schnittke just seemed like he was after shock value instead of trying to make meaningful music.

 
What a peculiar thing for you to say in a discussion about the Fourth.

Agreed...unless the Polyansky performance is drastically different from the BIS version. (I owned it once, but had it stolen almost as soon as I bought it. Now I'm thinking I should look for another copy; his performances are so different that maybe MI's hearing something unrelated to what I got used to with the BIS recording.)

Certainly in the BIS reading it's perhaps the most shock-free of all of his symphonies; only the brief Vivo section* disturbing the mood of the work--which is much the same to me as that of the Penitential Psalms or Concerto for Male Chorus, if somewhat more harmonically ambivalent--and it came off much the same when I heard Alexander Lazarev conduct the RSNO in it in Glasgow about a decade ago.

* Actually, this passage is about the only part of the work that feels unsuccessful to me; I know it remains within the same kind of harmonic stasis that fills the rest of the work, but it doesn't to me feel like it grows organically out of the preceding music in the way that the rest of the symphony does. (Other than this, I think the overall form is most satisfying despite its uniformity of mood--the end's reflection of the beginning is I think a very effective example of a simple cyclic form, and the use of the counter-tenor and chorus I find very telling in its spareness, but also very naturally growing out of what came before.)

[ibanezmonster]

Well, here's the BIS:
http://www.youtube.com/v/GlZrJqPrdNQ

Listened to this again, since it's been a while, and enjoyed it. I really like the atmosphere of this symphony. I'm not sure how to describe it, but it kind of reminds me of the atmosphere in an area of my favorite game where time stands still (there's a large bell in this area, too).

I don't hear anything shocking in it, so I'm wondering, too, if it's the recording.

[TheGSMoeller]

Listened to this again, since it's been a while, and enjoyed it. I really like the atmosphere of this symphony. I'm not sure how to describe it, but it kind of reminds me of the atmosphere in an area of my favorite game where time stands still (there's a large bell in this area, too).

Ooo, elaborate please.    I'm always interested in video game music.