What are you currently reading?

[Elgarian]

It looks like if the PR's best work is often found in the smaller gem-like pieces it will be neccessary to find a comprehensive artbook, perhaps one for each major artist, eventually. I doubt that a lot can be found online. Gives something fun to look forward to (and more to hunt for in second hand bookshops!).

Yes, the hunt is all part of the pleasure, isn't it? I think maybe the perfect Pre-Raphaelite Art book has yet to be published, but for a collection of nicely ordered reproductions of a generous size, Christopher Wood's book is OK and won't break the bank - it's been reprinted quite often:

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Pre-Raphaelites-Christopher-Wood/dp/1841881163/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1246352825&sr=1-1

Another one well worth looking out for is the big fat catalogue that accompanied the big blockbuster show at the Tate in 1984. My goodness, I read the print off my copy back then, and the show was terrific. It was reprinted with corrections in 1995, so it's not too hard to find these days (see below - there's a copy available at £12 secondhand at the moment which is a good bargain) - and it has your favourite picture on the cover!

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Pre-Raphaelites-Leslie-Parris/dp/1854371444/ref=sr_1_6?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1246353291&sr=1-6

I'll stop there. I don't want to be a steam-rollering enthusiast, flattening you in my headlong rush ....

[Elgarian]

How about Rosetti's poetry? Is it any good?

Pretty much what you might expect from his pictures:


The blessed damozel leaned out
From the gold bar of Heaven;
Her eyes were deeper than the depth
Of waters stilled at even;
She had three lilies in her hand,
And the stars in her hair were seven.

[Valentino]

Ring Resounding by John Culshaw.

It's good. But you know that.

[Haffner]

Re-reading:

Beethoven Lewis Lockwood

[Dr. Dread]

THE GOLDEN CAT by Max Brand

[Cato]

The Fall of the Roman Empire "A New History of Rome and the Barbarians" by Peter Heather.  (Oxford historian using the most recent archeological and textual discoveries.)

The author's thesis is that Christianity and/or corruption and/or incompetence (Gibbon's thesis) are over-rated as reasons for decline and fall: the Germanic tribes had experienced an agricultural revolution of sorts, according to new archeology, and their greater population and military successes caused the Empire to wobble and fade away.  There has been a thesis in the last decades that there was not so much a "fall" as a slow transition into the Middle Ages, with things gradually deteriorating as ever more unsophisticated barbarians emigrated into the empire and gained control from the inside, and did not understand how to keep civilization going.

Heather seems to indicate that a "fall" did indeed occur, rapidly, and that it was in fact because the Germanic (and later Hunnic i.e. Turkish) barbarians had become militarily and politically sophisticated.

So far the book shows that the barbarians were underestimated by the (too?) civilized Romans.  Of interest is that the Roman attempts to invite barbarians into the empire, including bringing the sons of Germanic chiefs to live at the various courts to enjoy the luxuries of Roman life, sometimes backfired.  The Goth remained unconvinced by everything he saw, and went back with knowledge of how the Roman mind operated, knowledge then used against the Romans.

Sounds like the 9-11 terrorists: remember how we scratched our heads and wondered how, after living here 5 years or longer, they still carried out their mission.  Didn't they see how wonderful we are?

Tribal loyalties sometimes trump economic and political logic.

[DavidRoss]

Of interest is that the Roman attempts to invite barbarians into the empire, including bringing the sons of Germanic chiefs to live at the various courts to enjoy the luxuries of Roman life, sometimes backfired.  The Goth remained unconvinced by everything he saw, and went back with knowledge of how the Roman mind operated, knowledge then used against the Romans.

Sounds like the 9-11 terrorists: remember how we scratched our heads and wondered how, after living here 5 years or longer, they still carried out their mission.  Didn't they see how wonderful we are?

Reminds me of the cross-cultural experience on the American frontier.  Years ago I read that, although there are countless documented accounts of Europeans in the New World who chose to become Indians, there are very few accounts of Indians who chose to live as Europeans (though one of my ancestors did, like most who "made that choice" he was raised by whites from the time he was a young child, so the extent to which it was a "choice" is questionable). 

How many would willingly leave Eden's garden if they were not cast out with the gate barred behind them?

[Florestan]

Thread duty: Orhan Pamuk's The White Castle.

The whole premise of this book is flawed: why would any sane person in the first half of the 17th century go from Venice to Florence by sea???  

[karlhenning]

How do you get to Florence by sea? 

[Dr. Dread]

The whole premise of this book is flawed: why would any sane person in the first half of the 17th century go from Venice to Florence by sea???  

And why to White Castle? There must have been better burgers elsewhere.  0:)

[Florestan]

How do you get to Florence by sea? 

Piece of cake: set sail in Venice, navigate alongside three quarters of Italy's coastline through Turkish-pirates-roamed waters, arrive at Pisa then take the coach to Florence.

Really, it's as absurd as it gets.

[Florestan]

And why to White Castle? There must have been better burgers elsewhere.  0:)

I'm halfway through the book and there's no mention of any castle, white or black. 

[CD]

[Lethevich]

Elgarian: re. early Rossetti being more interesting, these books have been helpful in introducing me to these works - the sketches as well, so oddly different to some of the later inflated-lady pictures. They look very medieval in their busyness and (lack of) perspective, there is more of an edge. I like Timothy Hilton's way of describing it:

"Stylistically, The Girlhood of the Virgin Mary is composed with a kind of simple-minded originality, in which it is difficult to distinguish the parts played by calculation and by sheer lack of ability."

I did end up ordering that large-format Tate book you linked, and the large images and capsule (but not too brief) descriptions are ideal companions to the other more biographical books. I also ran into a small one by John Nicoll in town, which demanded purchasing given its price of £1.50. That one seems more along the lines of the Timothy Hilton book - a general overview, but with seemingly almost exclusive focus on the original three.

[Elgarian]

Elgarian: re. early Rossetti being more interesting, these books have been helpful in introducing me to these works - the sketches as well, so oddly different to some of the later inflated-lady pictures. They look very medieval in their busyness and (lack of) perspective, there is more of an edge. I like Timothy Hilton's way of describing it:

"Stylistically, The Girlhood of the Virgin Mary is composed with a kind of simple-minded originality, in which it is difficult to distinguish the parts played by calculation and by sheer lack of ability."

Yes - Rossetti in the 1850s was a very different artist to the one he became later. (I like your expression 'more of an edge'.) And that's a characteristically insightful comment of Tim Hilton's - it's expressed so well that it drives you back to look at the picture to check on its truth, and smile at it.

I did end up ordering that large-format Tate book you linked, and the large images and capsule (but not too brief) descriptions are ideal companions to the other more biographical books.

I don't believe you'll regret that - it's not a reading-from-cover-to-cover book, but nonetheless an essential source of information.

I also ran into a small one by John Nicoll in town, which demanded purchasing given its price of £1.50. That one seems more along the lines of the Timothy Hilton book - a general overview, but with seemingly almost exclusive focus on the original three.

Yes, that's a little treasure by John Nicoll, with some interesting choices of illustrations, albeit mostly b/w: eg pp. 60-63; only one late Rossetti oil; p.136; p.160 - I could ramble on at considerable length about that Burne-Jones woodcut alone!

Warning: you'll know you're getting dangerously hooked when you start looking for a copy of the Moxon Tennyson. And if you start getting interested in Ruskin, the floodgates will really fly open.

[Lethevich]

Hehe, we have similar habits. When I become interested in something, I'll be damned if I am not going to venture into every avenue, square and corner of it... At some rapidly approaching point I am going to have to find a book or two just on Millais - partly to look into how supposedly horrible his later works were, but mainly because of the big three, he grabs me the most. Rossetti jumping up in my esteem has left Hunt quite exposed. He has more of a technical ability than Rossetti, but in most of his images I find something very wooly (pun regarding his numerous paintings of sheep not intended) about the style - quite uncomfortable. I can't pin down why because they don't appear uninspired or insipid, I simply long for more of the clarity of expression and clean edges of Millais, including the razor-sharp focus on composition.

I would also be interested in a lengthy book which focuses mainly or exclusively on the followers, as I can envisage a point where each book will simply recycle a lot of information from each other about the big three, but I doubt whether such a thing would be marketable.

[Elgarian]

Hehe, we have similar habits. When I become interested in something, I'll be damned if I am not going to venture into every avenue, square and corner of it... At some rapidly approaching point I am going to have to find a book or two just on Millais - partly to look into how supposedly horrible his later works were, but mainly because of the big three, he grabs me the most. Rossetti jumping up in my esteem has left Hunt quite exposed. He has more of a technical ability than Rossetti, but in most of his images I find something very wooly (pun regarding his numerous paintings of sheep not intended) about the style - quite uncomfortable. I can't pin down why because they don't appear uninspired or insipid, I simply long for more of the clarity of expression and clean edges of Millais, including the razor-sharp focus on composition.

I would also be interested in a lengthy book which focuses mainly or exclusively on the followers, as I can envisage a point where each book will simply recycle a lot of information from each other about the big three, but I doubt whether such a thing would be marketable.

Arthur Hughes:


See Amazon Marketplace sellers:
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Arthur-Hughes-His-Life-Works/dp/1851492623/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1246725513&sr=1-1

Fred Sandys:


http://www.amazon.co.uk/Frederick-Sandys-Catalogue-Betty-Elzea/dp/1851493972/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1246725644&sr=1-1

There was a scrumptious catalogue of a Millais exhibition at the Tate a few years ago, but it seems to be out of print now. On a smaller scale, this is a cracker, packed with letters and bristling with authenticity (Millais and the Ruskins):
http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/offer-listing/0719517001/ref=dp_olp_used?ie=UTF8&qid=1246725954&sr=1-28&condition=used

There's no shortage of stuff on Burne-Jones. Oh, I can spend your money for you in so many ways. And I just discovered this, which I didn't know existed till now:



http://www.amazon.co.uk/Millaiss-Collected-Illustrations-Everett-Millais/dp/1843680351/ref=sr_1_7?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1246725747&sr=1-7

[Lethevich]

Thanks for the links, although I phrased my comment poorly - but I would've inevitably ended up getting ones focusing on single artists as well. I meant the possibility of a book focusing on an overview of the followers as a whole, similar to how most focus on the brotherhood, leaving those who come after with rather less space. But it's a bit of a pipe dream I think

I am not sure what to make of Hughes. Probably like a lot of people, April Love was the first work of his that I had seen (in fact, before I went on this binge, it was probably the only one of his that I retained a memory of), and I was struck by the amazing expression of the figure, the interesting composition, and the richness of colour despite the darkness and limited palette. He has a superb technical ability, but I don't get the same feeling of "wow" from a lot of his other work. Although I suppose his skill with a brush is an ability that can be admired in its own right... Ack. I'm too good at spending money. Why am I not rich? I'd make so much better use of it than buying Ferraris.

I think I'll grab Millais and the Ruskins at some point soon, given its price, but as for the others... I'm a cheapskate and will have to wait until I run into lower prices! Thanks for putting up with my prattling, by the way!

[Elgarian]

Thanks for the links, although I phrased my comment poorly - but I would've inevitably ended up getting ones focusing on single artists as well. I meant the possibility of a book focusing on an overview of the followers as a whole, similar to how most focus on the brotherhood, leaving those who come after with rather less space. But it's a bit of a pipe dream I think

No you were clear; but I'm pretty sure there's no such volume, so I offered the next best thing.

I am not sure what to make of Hughes. Probably like a lot of people, April Love was the first work of his that I had seen (in fact, before I went on this binge, it was probably the only one of his that I retained a memory of), and I was struck by the amazing expression of the figure, the interesting composition, and the richness of colour despite the darkness and limited palette. He has a superb technical ability, but I don't get the same feeling of "wow" from a lot of his other work.

I think that's normal, and I have the same feeling too about his other work. April Love is so exceptional, not just in Hughes's oeuvre, but in the whole of PreRaphaelitism, that there's no following it. For some years it was Tate Britain's best-selling postcard; probably still is: one of the great images in the history of British art. It's a curious thing about Hughes, but just as he almost inadvertently painted that great picture, just once, so he almost inadvertently became one of the great children's book illustrators - for just a couple of books. He tuned in with extraordinary sensitivity to the writings of George MacDonald, and poured his soul into illustrating them when they were published in Good Words For the Young in the early 1870s. Bound volumes of the magazine still turn up now and then in secondhand bookshops for a few pounds - often battered and in pieces - and as you flip through the pages, there in among the typical undistinguished routine wood engravings are these wonderful little visions in black and white, lovingly crafted from the woodblocks by AH and his engraver.

Although I suppose his skill with a brush is an ability that can be admired in its own right...

We turn to that when the vision has failed, I suppose. It's not the real thing though, alas.

Ack. I'm too good at spending money. Why am I not rich? I'd make so much better use of it than buying Ferraris.

Oh gosh, so would I. We could make a far greater success of being rich than those incompetent bunglers who actually are.

I think I'll grab Millais and the Ruskins at some point soon, given its price

It all focuses, mostly through the actual letters written at the time, on Millais's painting of Ruskin's portrait by a stream in a remote wooded valley in Scotland, and on the affair that developed there between Millais and Mrs Ruskin. All very scandalous. It seems there was never a dull moment if you were a PreRaphaelite. It's very much an 'I was there' book, containing intimate details like the little sketches that Millais drew, and the letters he wrote to Hunt while they were staying in a little cottage in the valley.

Thanks for putting up with my prattling, by the way!

No - I thought you were doing a grand job of putting up with mine!

[Lethevich]

I'm going to be scouring secondhand stores over the coming weeks. Sherborne, Crewkerne and Dorchester won't know what hit them 0:)

BTW, anyone interested by Elgarian's passionate advocacy of the pre-Raphs should note that a recent BBC series on them is still available on iPlayer (the first episode expires in 3 days):

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b00l7qpy

You'll need a UK IP to be able to view it, so either... be from the UK or use a proxy!