Topic: The Carter Corner

[Joe Barron]

Great. It's also been posted at The Boston Freaking Globe.

[Guido]

Great joke!

I'm glad that you have been remembering Mr. Ives for as long as you have been! I love his works more with each passing day! Also Carter's cello works get better the more one listens to them, and they were pretty damned good to start off with. I'm currently trying to tackle the string quartets (I have the first and fourth), but am finding them pretty tough going.

What are your thoughts on the piano concerto or double concerto? I like both of these works very much, but are they really fathomable? - it seems that no matter how many times I listen they don't seem to become any more familiar - perhaps they are forever distant, and that is a feature of them?

[karlhenning]

Joe, you're a celebrity, dude!

[Joe Barron]

Joe, you're a celebrity, dude!

I never dreamed I'd be the author of a genuine hoax, if you'll forgive the oxymoron. As long as the piece makes the rounds anonymously, though, I don't mind being famous.

Guido, thanks for your thoughts. I have to say it took me a long, long time to really get into the Piano Concerto, but contrary to your impression, I did not find it  "forever distant." Today I can follow it note for note, and for me, it is one of Carter.s most compelling works. Listen especially for the violin and wind solos (flute, English horn, bass clarinet) in the second movement. They go by quickly, but they provide  signposts to the action. There is also, near the end, the repeated "F" from the piano as the strings build up into a dense tone cluster.  As I have said in an online review, this is a brutal, tragic, heartbreaking work, but it's unlike anything anyone else has ever written, which means it takes some getting used to.  I'd recommend, too, that you invest in the New World disk with Oppens and Gielen conducting the Cincinnati Symphony, if you have not already. It's the most gripping performance available.

The Double Concerto is quieter, more lyrical, and --- dare I say it? --- prettier than the Piano Concerto. It seems less coherent, less forward-directed, but it has many lovely moments. I am particularly fond of the harpsichord cadenza near the beginning, and the adagio. There's a beautiful moment when the lower woodwinds seem to open up like a stop-action film of a blooming flower.

I'm sorry if I can't give you a key that will automatically unlock the treasures in these works. All I can say is, keep listening. They do become apparent eventually. 

[karlhenning]

The Double Concerto is quieter, more lyrical, and --- dare I say it? --- prettier than the Piano Concerto. It seems less coherent, or less directed, but it has many lovely moments.

By all means, dare to say it!

[greg]

  My God, what have I done?

That innocent little April Fool's joke has ended up posted at Google. Have I opened a Pandora's Box? And who is this Lora Creighton?

I fear a Seinfeld moment coming on. Mr. Carter sees this. The worst happens, and I'm stuck explaining to everyone for the rest of my life, "For heaven's sake, it was a joke."

that's some really funny stuff

maybe God is just keeping Elliott Carter alive so long to make up for his unforgivable atonal sins 

[Joe Barron]

that's some really funny stuff

maybe God is just keeping Elliott Carter alive so long to make up for his unforgivable atonal sins 

No, He is keeping him alive so that he (Mr.Carter) may continue to enrich our lives with his great, lovely, late-period work. It sort of makes up for all the random suffering He (God) dishes out on a regular basis.

As I've said before, the piece was meant to twit anti-Carterites by putting some of their sillier statements into the composer's mouth — such as the belief that nobody likes the music, and that people who say they do are just being pretentious. But anti-Carterites seem to like it, too, since they think it confirms their opinions.

I am now letting my child go into the wide world to fend for itself. I shall say no more about it.  Fly, my pretty!

[Brewski]

I am now letting my child go into the wide world to fend for itself. I shall say no more about it.  Fly, my pretty!

I think the whole thing is hilarious, and I wish your child a long and happy life.  Hey, I'm not surprised that something as well-written and funny as that piece is being circulated.  Kudos!

--Bruce

[Joe Barron]

Exciting item from an online article about the choreographer Peter Quanz:

The new year (2008) will include his staging of Kaleidoscope for Les Grands Ballets Canadiens de Montréal.  That will be followed by Peter creating a new work for the Pennsylvania Ballet to a score by Elliott Carter, Symphony No. 1.  This will be the first time this score of the 98 year old Mr. Carter has been set for a ballet. 

And right here in Philadelphia, too, in time for Mr. Carer's centenntial. Of course, it's an early piece, but any Carter is better than no Carter. My only hope is they use live music and not a recording.

[Brewski]

Two outstanding Carter performances yesterday, with James Levine and the MET Orchestra concert at Carnegie Hall.  First, his Three Illusions (2002, 2004), which I heard Levine premiere with the BSO awhile back.  What a marvelous nine minutes or so!  Very transparent, light scoring, with lots of orchestral color. 

And ditto Dialogues for Piano and Chamber Orchestra (2003), that followed, with pianist Nicolas Hodges.  Another masterly score, one that I'd like to get to know better.  The exchanges between the piano and the orchestra reach a climax near the end (as I heard it) with each in dramatic chords, alternating back and forth.  Hodges was electrifying in the solo part, and the orchestra was its usual brilliant self in both pieces. 

--Bruce

[edward]

And ditto Dialogues for Piano and Chamber Orchestra (2003), that followed, with pianist Nicolas Hodges.  Another masterly score, one that I'd like to get to know better.

Problem solved (and one of the best Carter discs out there).

[Brewski]

Problem solved (and one of the best Carter discs out there).

Heh-heh...thanks for the reminder!  That's the one that Joe has been "pestering" me to buy!  (Not that it would be a trial, of course!  )   I didn't realize that Hodges is on the recording...he seems to know the piece incredibly well.

--Bruce

[Joe Barron]

You don' t have that recording yet!? What in heaven's name are you waiting for?!?!?!?!?!!?

Now that's out of my system. I'm sorry I wasn't able to get to NYC for the concert, Bruce. I can listen to Dialogues any time, of course (some of us have the %#&$@! recording, after all ), but I would like to get to know he Illusions better. I've heard it once, and I remember the music was very atractive, but that's about all at this point. We're due for a recording. But then, we're due for a lot of things.

[Brewski]

You don' t have that recording yet!? What in heaven's name are you waiting for?!?!?!?!?!!?

Now that's out of my system. I'm sorry I wasn't able to get to NYC for the concert, Bruce. I can listen to Dialogues any time, of course (some of us have the %#&$@! recording, after all ), but I would like to get to know he Illusions better. I've heard it once, and I remember the music was very atractive, but that's about all at this point. We're due for a recording. But then, we're due for a lot of things.

 

I suspect you would have loved the concert yesterday, and yes, lets hope Illusions gets recorded soon, maybe even with the Met Orchestra?  That's probably too much to hope for. 

PS, Carter was there of course, came up onstage (with some help from Nic Hodges) and got his "usual" standing ovation from the crowd.  He, Levine and Hodges were up there for a good minute or two, smiling and nodding as the bravos continued. 

--Bruce

[Joe Barron]

From today's Times, an article on James Levine:

Mr. Levine offered a persuasive argument for challenging contemporary fare. That a composer of Mr. Carter’s stature is still producing ingenious works in his late 90s is a “unique situation in music history,” Mr. Levine said, and he intends to take advantage of it. Holding up a score Mr. Carter had just sent him — “Interventions,” a new work for piano and orchestra —Mr. Levine described himself as “like a kid in a candy store.” The plan is to perform the piece at Carnegie Hall on Dec. 11, 2008, Mr. Carter’s 100th birthday, with Mr. Levine conducting the Boston Symphony and Daniel Barenboim as soloist.

Yet another premiere (and a third piano concerto!). I guess this is the piece based on the Irish folk tune

[edward]

From today's Times, an article on James Levine:

Mr. Levine offered a persuasive argument for challenging contemporary fare. That a composer of Mr. Carter’s stature is still producing ingenious works in his late 90s is a “unique situation in music history,” Mr. Levine said, and he intends to take advantage of it. Holding up a score Mr. Carter had just sent him — “Interventions,” a new work for piano and orchestra —Mr. Levine described himself as “like a kid in a candy store.” The plan is to perform the piece at Carnegie Hall on Dec. 11, 2008, Mr. Carter’s 100th birthday, with Mr. Levine conducting the Boston Symphony and Daniel Barenboim as soloist.

Yet another premiere (and a third piano concerto!). I guess this is the piece based on the Irish folk tune

I saw that too, and when I saw you posting in this thread I made a mental bet you'd been reading the Times today.

I hope it's a more substantial work than Soundings: Carter writes so well for piano and orchestra that a medium-to-large-scale piano and orchestra work would be a real treat.

[Joe Barron]

The article also said Levine and the MTt's performances of Dialogues and Three Illusions were "remarkable."

Edward, I think Mr. Carter may be past writing large-scale, substantial, longish works. I recall that Levine was trying to get another Symphonia out of him when he wrote Three Illusions --- a total of nine minutes. He told Levine he didn't think he had another big piece in him, I believe. I doubt Interventions will give you what you're looking for, unless it's got more than one movement.

According to the Boosey Web site, the new Horn Concerto clocks in at 15 minutes, which is as long as A Symphony of Three Orchestras. I'm looking forward to that.

I'm still waiting for that Sixth Quartet, and I'm waiting for someone to plan an all-Carter centennial orchestral concert.

[edward]

I was kind of assuming we won't see anything much over 20 minutes, but obviously Carter's written plenty weighty pieces under that length: A Symphony of Three Orchestras, Dialogues the Boston Concerto and so on. Given his age, anything of that sort of weight would be wonderful.

I'm still looking into finding a reason to be in Boston in mid-November, though.

[Joe Barron]

I'm still looking into finding a reason to be in Boston in mid-November, though.

I would think the Horn Concerto and the opportunity to meet Philadelphia's leading expert on Carter would be reason enough ... 

[Brewski]

Here's my review of the Carter works (Three Illusions and Dialogues) on that program by Levine and the Met Orchestra.

--Bruce