Shostakovich String Quartets

[Karl Henning]

WINNERS:

2, 5, 8, 10, 11, 12, 14, 15

LOSERS:

13, maybe 6, maybe 3, maybe 9

NO REAL OPINION:

1, 7, maybe 3, 6, 9,... maybe 4

Observation:  You've got 3, 6 & 9 as both "maybe LOSERS," and "maybe NO REAL OPINION."  That almost suggests that you are suffering from some confusion.  (We all know better.)

My question is:  How can 4 be NO REAL OPINION, "maybe"?  Is a real opinion lurking there? MAKE IT COUNT (even as a maybe) 

[snyprrr]

Observation:  You've got 3, 6 & 9 as both "maybe LOSERS," and "maybe NO REAL OPINION."  That almost suggests that you are suffering from some confusion.  (We all know better.)

My question is:  How can 4 be NO REAL OPINION, "maybe"?  Is a real opinion lurking there? MAKE IT COUNT (even as a maybe) 

you're right

This was a bit hasty. I'd amend, and say only 13 disappointed me. 3, 6, & 9 would probably be N.O. I think the point of all them was that there were movements that hampered total pleasure... In 3 it was the faster movements, as with 9,

6 simply was a little bit aggressive in the 1st, but had one of the most deeply felt slow movements...(I've become very attuned to feelings of aggression in the 1st of 6- so many make the music more dramatic than it needs to be)

4 had a blazing 1st, a curiously unemotional slow movement, a great 'Waltz', and a middling finale


Just, basically, in 3 4 6 9 there are other versions that just blot out the Fittzies from general consideration--- none of these criticisms are a death blow, though- the Fittzies are never less than extremely good, it's just that there is a glut of goodness in the most popular works...

same with 7- the Fittzies are firmly in the middle of the pack here- it would be hard to pick them out of a line-up- nothing totally distinctive---- not in any way bad, just not head and antler above the competition in terms of interpretive touches (whereas in other places, the Fittzies are #1 in interpretive touches, such as the opening to 12)



Well, yea, karl, I am pretty desperate to GetMoreStuff here, but, as I troll the Amazon listing, I just can't find anything I'm really interested in checking out.... or, the stuff I'm interedsted in is just waaay too expensive for consideration.


Take the Coull (Nos. 4 8 11), or Duke (No. CDs. Maybe worth checking out, maybe not, who know, who cares?

I might have to disagree with you that this is an endless rabbit hole

BUUUT- did you hear my rave of the Jerusalem's BBC 8th? 'live' in concert? maaan, it's pretty heavy, rivalling the Sorrel's massive account... that was latest "find",... for pennies... but, that's really the end of the line in revelations here, ......

[Karl Henning]

I might have to disagree with you that this is an endless rabbit hole

Five years from now, you'll revisit the Emersons, and see light 

I've heard the Jerusalem Qt, though not playing ДШ;  they are excellent, so yes, I may look into them at some point 

[kishnevi]

Five years from now, you'll revisit the Emersons, and see light 

I've heard the Jerusalem Qt, though not playing ДШ;  they are excellent, so yes, I may look into them at some point 

The main reason the JQ recordings are not preferable to the Borodin Cow cycle is the simple fact that it is only a partial cycle.  I would very much urge to you to make that "some point" in the near future.

I finished my listen to the Emerson cycle yesterday. True they do not wear their heart on their sleeve in the manner of the Borodins, but I find the claims they are too cool and unemotional to be unfounded.

It is in fact the Fitzwilliams whom I found to be too uninvolved.  If I can remember which shelf they are consigned to, I will bring them out and give a relisten to see if my ears retain that opinion.

[Karl Henning]

The main reason the JQ recordings are not preferable to the Borodin Cow cycle is the simple fact that it is only a partial cycle.  I would very much urge to you to make that "some point" in the near future.

I take your urging to heart, sir.

[snyprrr]

I take your urging to heart, sir.

The main reason the JQ recordings are not preferable to the Borodin Cow cycle is the simple fact that it is only a partial cycle.  I would very much urge to you to make that "some point" in the near future.

I finished my listen to the Emerson cycle yesterday. True they do not wear their heart on their sleeve in the manner of the Borodins, but I find the claims they are too cool and unemotional to be unfounded.

It is in fact the Fitzwilliams whom I found to be too uninvolved.  If I can remember which shelf they are consigned to, I will bring them out and give a relisten to see if my ears retain that opinion.

I was talking about the Jerusalem's SQ's Op.110 on the BBC Magazine CD, NOT the HarmoniaMundi CD. This one is 'live' and also contains Haydn and LvB. Right?




Why don't you simply compare the Fittzies-Emerson-'Bovine' in Op.110 alone? I'm thinking the Fittzies win that one hands down. Even so, it's still shaping up that this Axis-of-DSCH is the daddy of all future DSCH comparisons,... errrr, as it haaas been already anyhow,... now it's just more obvious than ever. I guess I just wish that a Cycle would come along to silence all the Emerson lovers forever- even if that meant a STUDIO Emerson Cycle- yea, the Emerson's just seem like the 'White Privilege' Choice, the Frat Party Choice, and since they came out, there has always been an undercurrent of- resentment???- for them "imposing" themselves upon this music. For me, they are simply there to be bettered by someone else- though, even the Great and Powerful snyprrr has had to come around on, say, Op.68, or Op.93, or Op.101.- of course there's good things here, but, oy, I simply cannot countenance a conversation where my colleagues cannot seem to bring themselves to critique not a note of their whole Cycle,... I mean, c'mon guys, I could take this EmersonFest from you more readily if you offered any balancing criticism- which I never hear. I guess I'm saying that if you compare Fittzies-Emerson-'Bovine' in Op.110, and choose the Emerson, I will just have to UnFriend you!!




sorry- my typing sounds mean today- I'm not being mean, it just typed out that way...





I am lamenting that the St.Petersburg/SONY 1/3 Cycle didn't have at least another volume. I think thaaat full Cycle would have been a monster!

[kishnevi]

I was talking about the Jerusalem's SQ's Op.110 on the BBC Magazine CD, NOT the HarmoniaMundi CD. This one is 'live' and also contains Haydn and LvB. Right?




Why don't you simply compare the Fittzies-Emerson-'Bovine' in Op.110 alone? I'm thinking the Fittzies win that one hands down. Even so, it's still shaping up that this Axis-of-DSCH is the daddy of all future DSCH comparisons,... errrr, as it haaas been already anyhow,... now it's just more obvious than ever. I guess I just wish that a Cycle would come along to silence all the Emerson lovers forever- even if that meant a STUDIO Emerson Cycle- yea, the Emerson's just seem like the 'White Privilege' Choice, the Frat Party Choice, and since they came out, there has always been an undercurrent of- resentment???- for them "imposing" themselves upon this music. For me, they are simply there to be bettered by someone else- though, even the Great and Powerful snyprrr has had to come around on, say, Op.68, or Op.93, or Op.101.- of course there's good things here, but, oy, I simply cannot countenance a conversation where my colleagues cannot seem to bring themselves to critique not a note of their whole Cycle,... I mean, c'mon guys, I could take this EmersonFest from you more readily if you offered any balancing criticism- which I never hear. I guess I'm saying that if you compare Fittzies-Emerson-'Bovine' in Op.110, and choose the Emerson, I will just have to UnFriend you!!




sorry- my typing sounds mean today- I'm not being mean, it just typed out that way...





I am lamenting that the St.Petersburg/SONY 1/3 Cycle didn't have at least another volume. I think thaaat full Cycle would have been a monster!

Re:  Jerusalem Qt.  I have the CD you refer to....but I was promoting to Karl the two Harmonia Mundi CDs.

I have, I am pretty sure, every CD the Jerusalem Quartet has released.

My overall favorite DSCH cycle is the Bovine.  Emerson and Pacifica duke it out for second place.I found my copy of the Williamovitch cycle and will give it a relisten.  Previously I found it to have all the flaws you find in the Emersons.  We will see what happens now.

[Camphy]

A possible new recording of the complete cycle by the Brodsky Quartet:

We have been reveling in the quartets of Shostakovich throughout our
43 year existence. No.11 was among the initial handful of pieces we
chose to learn. In the absence of parts back in the 70s we
painstakingly wrote out the parts to No.13 by listening to a recording
over and over again. In the late 80s we were asked to play the whole
cycle in the QEH London, this subsequently led to Teldec inviting us
to make the 1st complete digital recording of the set. Since then we
have played the cycle countless times all over the world from Sydney
Opera House to remote churches on Norwegian Fjords. Now, 25
years after that original recording we feel ready and excited by the
prospect of capturing our latest thoughts on these masterpieces. In an
effort to get as spontaneous a reading as possible we are going to
record them all ʻliveʼ from the Musiekgebouw in Amsterdam in
February 2016 to be released on the Chandos label. This process will
cost us £40,000 (this does not include a fee of any description!). One
extremely generous donor has already given us half this amount,
leaving £20,000 outstanding. Please help us realise this dream of
what amounts to a lifetimeʼs work by making a donation to our fund.
Every penny counts and we thank you in advance.

http://www.brodskyquartet.co.uk/brodsky-quartet-new-shostakovich-recording.pdf

[Karl Henning]

. . . the Williamovitch cycle . . . .

Nice!

[snyprrr]

A possible new recording of the complete cycle by the Brodsky Quartet:

http://www.brodskyquartet.co.uk/brodsky-quartet-new-shostakovich-recording.pdf

well now- thaaat's interesting news. Thanks for mitigating against the peanut gallery and actually posting some useful information... a-heeeeem ...

It seems with everyone being oh so satisfied with just one or two, albeit essential, Cycles, the Brodsky have gotten precious little love in this Thread.  No... wait... I fear I'll be on a 3PageRant if I continue... lol... carry on...



I would be holding extremely high expectations for a New Brodsky Cycle,... I think we may be heading into the Super Quartet Era,... maybe 10-12 new Cycles will be released, all of them absolutely essential...


NOOOOOOOT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[kishnevi]

Listening to CD 4 of the "Fitzies" (SQs 8,9,10) now, and my previous opinion holds.  Not as emotionally intense, sometimes merely fussy, overall too restrained.  They are at their best in the more lyrical passages, but even there the Emersons often sing better.

[kishnevi]

Listening to CD 4 of the "Fitzies" (SQs 8,9,10) now, and my previous opinion holds.  Not as emotionally intense, sometimes merely fussy, overall too restrained.  They are at their best in the more lyrical passages, but even there the Emersons often sing better.

Addendum after listening to the last CD of the Fitzwilliam cycle.  Their performance of Op. 144 is superlative.
But that is, IMO, the only gem of this cycle.

[snyprrr]

Listening to CD 4 of the "Fitzies" (SQs 8,9,10) now, and my previous opinion holds.  Not as emotionally intense, sometimes merely fussy, overall too restrained.  They are at their best in the more lyrical passages, but even there the Emersons often sing better.

I'm shocked! Socked, I tell you!!



I have been going through a Op.101-a-thon, and, whew, that repeated figure in the 1st movement gets sooo annoying in so many performances,... I was starting to dislike the music. So many have the violin be soooo insistent here, grating. So, I was going through, and being very critical, and I have come away with maybe the Emerson's being my fav here. Their 'Classical' approach minimizes the annoyance of the repeated note, and everything is more matter-of-fact, which seems to suit this overtly programmatic music (it's obviously about the ups-and-downs of a courting couple). The 'live' Borodin 1981 recording could be considered a 'Romantic' antipode And the St.P's Hyperion recording rounds outmy Top3,... though I may prefer it in some instances.


Still, I's have to sit in the same room with you going through that Op.110,...

[Karl Henning]

Hm, it's been a bit quiet 'round here . . . .

[Karl Henning]

This can bring our snypsss only pain . . . .

[snyprrr]

This can bring our snypsss only pain . . . .

he has been dealt with

[snyprrr]

Just a random Thread Post,...

I've moved into the Concertos all of a sudden, and found it difficult to get back into the SQs. Orchestral colour has stolen me from the tyranny of strings. Also, I have been craving to buyBuyBUY!!! something here, but, again, I know what's out there, and am not interested in, say, the Sofia SQs Gega recording of 8/10/11,... or,... mm,... the mulling over of the eventual (ie "never") essential purchases of the Fitzwilliam and Borodin 'Bovine' Cycles,... the post-parting depression of believing I've heard most all that I will ever hear of these Compositions.

Lately, I've been fantasizing about the "missing" St.Petersburg/SONY recordings of Nos. 6 & 8. They didn't make it onto either CD, and there's no evidence they were recorded, but, based on their approach, I've played these through in my head and use this fantasy to soothe my desire.

Perhaps there's a couple of strays that I haven't bothered with, that, surely I would buyBuyBUY!!! if I could care about the expenditure, but, again, I feel like I can already play these in my head, and I still seek out My Perfect Op.73, though, at this point, the Borodin 1984, yes, even with the slooow finale, has to be TheOne. I only await the 'New' Borodin here, but hold no expectation, either way.


Here is a thumbnail, current listing of what's been on my mind:


Op.49: Sorrel (just for the lushness), 'New' Borodin, Borodin'95, Taneyev 'live' 1966


Op.68: Zapolski & Verlaine, Fitzwilliam,... Sorrel... Emerson 'live'


Op.73: St.Petersburg/SONY, Taneyev 'live' 1966, Borodin'84


Op.83: Kreutzer, META-4, Taneyev 'live' 1963 & Taneyev'72, Borodin'83, St.P/SONY,... Sorrel,...


Op.92: Atrium, Acies, St.P/SONY & Eder (both for speed), Emerson 'live', maybe Borodin'84


Op.101: St.P/Hyperion, Emerson 'live', Borodin 'live' 1981, Manhattan/Centaur


Op.108: Borodin'67, St.P/SONY, Hagen, Kreutzer, Brodsky,...


Op.110: Jerusalem 'live' BBC, Sorrel, Borodin'67, St.P/Hyperion, Fitzwilliam


Op.117: Gosteleradio, St.P/Hyperion, Brodsky, Borodin 'live' 1981


Op.118: Fitzwilliam, St.P/Hyperion


Op.122: Vogler, Hagen, Borodin'67, St.P/Hyperion, Brodsky


Op.133: Fitzwilliam, Sorrel, Shostakovich, Amati, Emerson 'live'


Op.138: Kremer/ECM 'live', St.P/Hyperion, Brodsky, Sorrel, Shostakovich


Op.142: Kremer/ECM 'live', Fitzwilliam, Glinka 'live' @1976, 'New' Borodin, Sorrel*,...


Op.144: Kogan 'live' 1984, Borodin'95, Fitzwilliam, St.P/Hyperion*/ Sorrel*,...


Notice that there is a 'live' option for most listings,... interesting...

[snyprrr]

Sibelius Academy String Quartet 3-4, 2 & 6


I finally heard some samples here, and, mm, I'm glad I didn't plunk down the cash. First, the acoustic is just too tight for DSCH, especially in these earlier works. Then, there are some interpretive issues, like the slowness of the 2nd in Op.73 (though, the last two mvmts. here were more enjoyable). And, Op.101 wasn't as "essential" sounding as I might have hoped for, so, in all, I found all four works to be somewhat MOR- they could easily have been from any of the post-2000 Cycles, or not.

So, yes, another quest has been laid to rest. We can all sleep a little more soundly tonight!

I certainly haven't listened to a single DSCH SQ note since this Thread died, but, I'm still waaay in Nordic Territory, so, not much dif...

[The new erato]

I certainly haven't listened to a single DSCH SQ note since this Thread died, but, I'm still waaay in Nordic Territory, so, not much dif...

You have done sterling work, my dear snyprrr !

[Karl Henning]

I certainly haven't listened to a single DSCH SQ note since this Thread died

You Khrennikov-enabler, you.