The Most Important LvB Piano Sonata Cycle Comparison in the History of the World

[AnotherSpin]

Do you mean obvious after the first few rankings, or obvious before the results even started coming in?

I have wondered whether the relative dominance of newer artists marks a natural progression in skill or interpretation, or whether it shows a matching evolution in Todd's taste objective ranking criteria.

Both.

In the second phrase, the word objective should be replaced with the word subjective. Of course, subjective assessment or ranking is perfectly valid. Yesterday one interpretation was liked, today a different one, tomorrow a third. @Mandryka's post a bit above is most illustrative.

[prémont]

The disadvantage of the physical Annie Fischer set for me is that the sonatas aren't in the right order.

Listening to music in chronological order isn't always necessary or even ideal. However, the seemingly random arrangement of sonatas in Annie's set might impair the overall experience. If this bothers me enough, I'll create a personal CDR copy with the sonatas arranged in my preferred sequence.

[AnotherSpin]

Only you feel some strange impulsion to give it a name you like.

As you rightly pointed out, English is a foreign language to me. However, it seems to me that you quite understand what I mean.

[prémont]

In the second phrase, the word objective should be replaced with the word subjective. Of course, subjective assessment or ranking is perfectly valid. Yesterday one interpretation was liked, today a different one, tomorrow a third. @Mandryka's post a bit above is most illustrative.

No one, perhaps except for Todd himself, has ever questioned that his scientific approach is entirely subjective, and the results he obtains sufficiently demonstrate this.

[Todd]

No one, perhaps except for Todd himself, has ever questioned that his scientific approach is entirely subjective, and the results he obtains sufficiently demonstrate this.

Just as you previously misinterpreted my tiering, you misinterpret my posts in this thread.

[prémont]

Just as you previously misinterpreted my tiering, you misinterpret my posts in this thread.

I find many of your observations on the recordings, which I am quite familiar with, to be intriguing. However, the ranking you've placed beneath the commentary for each sonata seems at best completely subjective, and at worst nonsensical. Is there another way to interpret this?

[Todd]

Is there another way to interpret this?

You think too much about it.

[San Antone]

I find many of your observations on the recordings, which I am quite familiar with, to be intriguing. However, the ranking you've placed beneath the commentary for each sonata seems at best completely subjective, and at worst nonsensical. Is there another way to interpret this?

Yes - hint, "tongue in cheek".  Todd is making grandiose claims of "scientific objectivity" to make it obvious that these are the opposite, i.e. subjective rankings.

[(poco) Sforzando]

Yes - hint, "tongue in cheek".  Todd is making grandiose claims of "scientific objectivity" to make it obvious that these are the opposite, i.e. subjective rankings.

I would go along with that.

[(poco) Sforzando]

Please, can we bring on op. 26?

[Todd]

I would go along with that.

One would think the thread title alone would give away the game.

Please, can we bring on op. 26?

It will be posted tomorrow morning.

[DavidW]

The complete Fischer cycle comes up from time to time on eBay, where you can now get a copy for about $225. Expensive? well maybe, but the individual CDs are pricey too, and if it matters to you the sonatas are not issued in chronological order. If I'm willing to pay $100 or more for a live concert, paying $225 for 9 CDs does not seem that unreasonable. What I especially like about Fischer, particularly in slow movements, is the almost operatic freedom she brings to her phrasing, almost opposite to the stiffness I hear in Gulda.

But in comparison, you can buy the digital downloads of the ENTIRE Fischer cycle for only $9.

[prémont]

Yes - hint, "tongue in cheek".  Todd is making grandiose claims of "scientific objectivity" to make it obvious that these are the opposite, i.e. subjective rankings.

I truly value your unrestricted sense of logic. 

[Spotted Horses]

But in comparison, you can buy the digital downloads of the ENTIRE Fischer cycle for only $9.

Where? I only saw the full set as a cd set on presto. I only found the pricey individual sub-sets for download on presto and qobuz. Did I miss something?

[DavidW]

Where? I only saw the full set as a cd set on presto. I only found the pricey individual sub-sets for download on presto and qobuz. Did I miss something?

7digital, I bought it as flac a few years ago. Now it is only mp3/m4a but at 320k.

https://us.7digital.com/artist/annie-fischer-(1)/release/ludwig-van-beethoven-the-complete-piano-sonatas-32052708

[(poco) Sforzando]

But in comparison, you can buy the digital downloads of the ENTIRE Fischer cycle for only $9.

What fun is that?

[AnotherSpin]

Pienaar's recording of the Sonata No. 11 is ugly. Of the versions at the top of the list Heidsieck's version is more preferable. Even Sohn's recording is better.

[Mandryka]

@Todd @AnotherSpin   Have you heard Pogorelich play the adagio of op 22? It is very beautiful IMO, and interesting to compare with Pienaar of course. The aria quality of the music in Pogorelich is really impressive - like something out of Verdi - one of those arias for Desdemona - for piano.

I can let you have a rip of the sound

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Ivo-Pogorelich-Recital-DVD/dp/B0007P357I/ref=sr_1_1?crid=7TGJ1CS9F1QU&dib=eyJ2IjoiMSJ9.1pvvzO5Z3CQ5IJJ1uGUViM6meAx4ZQ5Xc85IjRuSDkzVaqFGXeMCcFfFEsto0dF9q5KtFnmcyhbxlzsF2iLSOcGJvSvFtZa8m7Ukm3UMkRhWSaOtNQtqW86uY6e954D5pa-4l_yJckEP7uL-tDhyubD-DMloxAeB97i5Kglvee0.fWhLbLRaZtVgY2ndgpXIImebzOq03yPP1FG3PxOeOzM&dib_tag=se&keywords=Pogorelich+dvd&qid=1723453259&sprefix=pogorelich+dvd+%2Caps%2C91&sr=8-1

This comment on amazon has a little insight into one of Pogorelich's strengths, about treble beauty.

イギリス組曲が好きで購入。テンポが速めで硬いタッチの演奏です。スカルラッティーのアルバムでもそうでしたが、高音域の音の美しさが好きなピアニストです。

[AnotherSpin]

@Todd @AnotherSpin   Have you heard Pogorelich play the adagio of op 22? It is very beautiful IMO, and interesting to compare with Pienaar of course. The aria quality of the music in Pogorelich is really impressive - like something out of Verdi - one of those arias for Desdemona - for piano.

I can let you have a rip of the sound

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Ivo-Pogorelich-Recital-DVD/dp/B0007P357I/ref=sr_1_1?crid=7TGJ1CS9F1QU&dib=eyJ2IjoiMSJ9.1pvvzO5Z3CQ5IJJ1uGUViM6meAx4ZQ5Xc85IjRuSDkzVaqFGXeMCcFfFEsto0dF9q5KtFnmcyhbxlzsF2iLSOcGJvSvFtZa8m7Ukm3UMkRhWSaOtNQtqW86uY6e954D5pa-4l_yJckEP7uL-tDhyubD-DMloxAeB97i5Kglvee0.fWhLbLRaZtVgY2ndgpXIImebzOq03yPP1FG3PxOeOzM&dib_tag=se&keywords=Pogorelich+dvd&qid=1723453259&sprefix=pogorelich+dvd+%2Caps%2C91&sr=8-1

This comment on amazon has a little insight into one of Pogorelich's strengths, about treble beauty.

イギリス組曲が好きで購入。テンポが速めで硬いタッチの演奏です。スカルラッティーのアルバムでもそうでしたが、高音域の音の美しさが好きなピアニストです。

I haven't listened to this Pogorelich recording. I would be glad, thank you. I've been listening to all available Pogorelich recordings starting with LPs in the 80s with great interest.

[Todd]

.