sorry, i'll cancel this

[coffee]

though good luck ever visiting 8000 places, start doing some math about that one

Actually one of the main benefits of it for me is giving me urgency to get things done sooner. It also helps me appreciate the urgency of prioritization. People my age (even without my health issues) are dying every day.

But I regard this list as one of my accomplishments in life. I'm proud to know that some people have benefited from it (or claim to have done so) and I hope that if something renders me no longer able to keep making it better, someone somewhere will take it as a starting point for their own project.

[Florestan]

I appreciate the dialogue.

Then why do you take so personally any and all criticism of your project, to the point of interpreting it in terms of, what, class war? Frankly, it's ridiculous.

[Madiel]

Of course that's exactly what you're trying to do. Which is fine. It will be fine in a year's time.

I'm not sure how many ways to tell you that if you don't want to participate, don't participate. Other people were willing to. Why couldn't you let us do so in peace?

I have not said a single thing about what music you do or don't listen to.

[coffee]

I have not said a single thing about what music you do or don't listen to.

Of course that's not the point. 

[Madiel]

I appreciate the dialogue.

I see no evidence of you being interested in dialogue. Both this time and your previous visits, you have shown zero interest in modifying the design of your project in any way.

As I've already said, there are plenty of examples of how to effectively to design classical music lists. But you show no interest in actually discussing those models.

[Madiel]

Of course that's not the point. 

You keep claiming people are trying to act as gate keepers to classical music and somehow stopping you from listening to it. We're not. In fact people here are really keen to discuss classical music. But you never participate in any of those threads.

I won't keep replying from here on. Thanks.

[71 dB]

What a strange thread this is! 

[coffee]

I see no evidence of you being interested in dialogue. Both this time and your previous visits, you have shown zero interest in modifying the design of your project in any way.

As I've already said, there are plenty of examples of how to effectively to design classical music lists. But you show no interest in actually discussing those models.

All I see is criticism that it exists or has been created.

[coffee]

You keep claiming people are trying to act as gate keepers to classical music and somehow stopping you from listening to it. We're not. In fact people here are really keen to discuss classical music. But you never participate in any of those threads.

I won't keep replying from here on. Thanks.

You're welcome, I suppose. It's easy for me to see that I'm not welcome here. I'm not going to venture further out than this.

[ritter]

You're welcome, I suppose. It's easy for me to see that I'm not welcome here. I'm not going to venture further out than this.

The attitudes of isolated members should not lead other members to conclude that they are not welcome on the forum.

In any case, the discussion on this thread, apart from strange —as aptly described by a member a couple of messages up—, is unnecessary and only leads to bitternesses.

I will therefore temporarily lock this thread.

[ritter]

Was all this really necessary? 

[Florestan]

As one directly involved in the whole kerfuffle, I have three comments to make.

1. Every now and then someone appears on GMG who uses this forum exclusively as a tool to promote their personal agenda. They are interested in and participate to no other topics or discussions save those of their own making, and even in those topics they act exclusively on their own terms, accepting no different opinions and rejecting any and all criticism, more often than not interpreting such opinions and criticism as their being persecuted. Do you remember W.A. Mozart's crusade on behalf of film music? Or the guy who started countless topics titled "How do you rate this piece"?

2. The capacity to accept different opinions and to withstand criticism without taking them personally is a prerequisite for a successful, long time internet boards membership --- beside being a mark of a mature person. Small wonder that people who lack it come and go.

3. The departure of a member who has made valuable contributions in multiple threads is always to be lamented --- but this is far from being the case here.

[ritter]

OTOH, the attitude shown by a couple of members towards the departed OP could be seen almost as bullying. The points you make in your explanation, @Florestan , may be valid, as were some of the arguments exposed in the discussion in the thread. I can even share some of them (TBH, I never quite understood that ranking game's —or whatever it was— objectives were, or how it worked).

And yet, some other members engaged in the game. So what you (and probably I as well) thought useless and simply posted to promote a personal agenda, was perceived as having at least some value by other members.

The case of Coffee is IMHO not comparable to that of W.A. Mozart, as the former was not spamming the forum as the latter did. He just started a "game" which we could like or not, but that other members reacted to in good faith.

The point is, Andrei, that if we start judging members by the quality of their posts, or the maturity of their behaviour, then we're really in trouble. You wisely ignore my enthusiastic ramblings about Boulez (as they add little value to you), and I don't really engage (apart from the occasional "che noia!"  ) when you go on about your disregard for any intellectualised approach to music, but we wouldn't dream of "forcing" each other out of the forum because of the contents of our posts. Well, that's exactly what has been done in this thread. Instead of letting the OP's arcane game stand or fall on its own merits (or lack thereof), members were intent on proving him wrong and themselves right, something we all know is impossible and futile in the internet. So the member left. A pity.

[Florestan]

we wouldn't dream of "forcing" each other out of the forum because of the contents of our posts. Well, that's exactly what has been done in this thread.

I beg to differ, Rafael. Nobody forced him out of the forum. Nobody even forced him not to go ahead with his project (I, for one, explicitly told him to do just that). His insistence that I (or anyone else, for that matter) was trying to prevent him from "infiltrating my class" and "learning about my music" (exact quotes, those) was pure nonsense and imho strongly indicative of persecution mania.

[ritter]

Yes, that comment on "class" was odd...

[prémont]

It is frustrating that there is always someone alert to ruin the harmless fun of threads like this when the OP isn't his cup of tea (or coffee).

[Madiel]

It is frustrating that there is always someone alert to ruin the harmless fun of threads like this when the OP isn't his cup of tea (or coffee).

It wasn't presented as harmless fun. That's the point. If someone announced they wanted to play an enormous game that's going to take a couple of years, I would ignore it.

[Madiel]

Let me put it another way: if I'm trying to sell you a hat with flashing lights on it, I think it matters quite a bit whether I try to sell it by saying it will liven up your Christmas party, or try to sell the exact same hat by listing its supposed medical benefits.

When someone claims that their polling has a purpose beyond harmless fun, I make no apology for assessing that claim, or for trying to engage with them to come up with a design that might actually achieve the claimed purpose.

Now, go enjoy your flashing hat.

[prémont]

My point is that you might feel free to ignore a poll you don't like. No one in this forum is obligated to read and react upon all posts, except of course the moderators.

[steve ridgway]

Sorry to lose a whole series of discussions I was enjoying taking part in . At least there are a number of people happily contributing on TC so I guess the project will continue there.