The Nielsen Nexus

Started by BachQ, April 12, 2007, 10:10:00 AM

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Symphonic Addict

To be released on 5 September:



I haven't heard any disc of this cycle yet. Has it been any good so far?
The current annihilation of a people on this planet (you know which one it is) is the most documented and at the same time the most preposterously denied.

Daverz

Quote from: Symphonic Addict on June 30, 2025, 11:35:20 AMTo be released on 5 September:



I haven't heard any disc of this cycle yet. Has it been any good so far?

Pretty good, but probably not essential.

prémont

Quote from: Daverz on June 30, 2025, 12:56:22 PMPretty good, but probably not essential.

I've only heard Gardner's Espansiva. I would call it essential supplementary listening.
Reality trumps our fantasy far beyond imagination.

Symphonic Addict

The current annihilation of a people on this planet (you know which one it is) is the most documented and at the same time the most preposterously denied.

DavidW

Quote from: Daverz on June 30, 2025, 12:56:22 PMPretty good, but probably not essential.

That is Gardner in a nutshell for anything IMO.

Roasted Swan

Its not that long since the last Chandos Nielsen cycle with the BBC PO - and then they had Rohzdestvensky before that and Bryden Thomson before that!  They had a fine Gibson 4&5 AS WELL. What's with Chandos and the Nielsen Symphonies!!??

vandermolen

Quote from: Symphonic Addict on June 30, 2025, 11:35:20 AMTo be released on 5 September:



I haven't heard any disc of this cycle yet. Has it been any good so far?
Great combination of works!
"Courage is going from failure to failure without losing enthusiasm" (Churchill).

'The test of a work of art is, in the end, our affection for it, not our ability to explain why it is good' (Stanley Kubrick).

Der lächelnde Schatten

#1307
Quote from: DavidW on July 01, 2025, 05:33:17 AMThat is Gardner in a nutshell for anything IMO.

Gardner's Britten, Lutosławski and Szymanowski recordings are excellent. But these are exceptions. He's heading the London Philharmonic now, so we'll see how he does, but I won't lie and have to admit that Vladimir Jurowski was the conductor that brought them out of a slump they previously experienced under Franz Welser-Möst. Jurowski is one of my favorite contemporaneous conductors.
"To send light into the darkness of men's hearts - such is the duty of the artist." ― Robert Schumann

Roasted Swan

Quote from: Der lächelnde Schatten on July 01, 2025, 08:03:49 AMGardner's Britten, Lutosławski and Szymanowski have been excellent. But these are exceptions. He's heading the London Philharmonic now, so we'll see how he does, but I won't lie and have to admit that Vladimir Jurowski was the conductor that brought them out of a slump they previously experienced under Franz Welser-Möst. Jurowski is one of my favorite contemporaneous conductors.

I saw Gardner with the LPO recently doing a "staged" version of Daphnis and Chloe in the Royal Festival Hall.  It was not the ballet but a kind of cirque de soleil presentation.  The audience loved it but I did not.  However, the LPO played really really well and Gardner was clearly absolutely on top of the score - clear and authoritative.  BUT as an interpretation it was very unremarkable.  Everything was in its place and there was nothing to offend but on the other hand there were no moments of revelation either.  So the earlier comment of "perfectly good but not essential" probably applied there too.  My observation with Chandos is that over the years they have used "house conductors" to record just about anything and I'm not always convinced there is an effective synergy between conductor and repertoire.  ALthough I guess a conductor could always say "no" if they felt they had nothing so say in that music......

Der lächelnde Schatten

Quote from: Roasted Swan on July 01, 2025, 08:21:13 AMI saw Gardner with the LPO recently doing a "staged" version of Daphnis and Chloe in the Royal Festival Hall.  It was not the ballet but a kind of cirque de soleil presentation.  The audience loved it but I did not.  However, the LPO played really really well and Gardner was clearly absolutely on top of the score - clear and authoritative.  BUT as an interpretation it was very unremarkable.  Everything was in its place and there was nothing to offend but on the other hand there were no moments of revelation either.  So the earlier comment of "perfectly good but not essential" probably applied there too.  My observation with Chandos is that over the years they have used "house conductors" to record just about anything and I'm not always convinced there is an effective synergy between conductor and repertoire.  ALthough I guess a conductor could always say "no" if they felt they had nothing so say in that music......

I don't think Chandos has had any noteworthy conductors since the passing of Andrew Davis.
"To send light into the darkness of men's hearts - such is the duty of the artist." ― Robert Schumann

Brian

Add me to the column on Gardner being extremely competent, a good leader, but not an innovator on interpretation. Three things I appreciate, however: (1) just as he doesn't bring a lot of brilliant new ideas, so he also doesn't impose a lot of terrible new ideas; (2) he likes a lot of interesting repertoire; and (3) he gets exciting playing from orchestras.

I've seen him live once and am excited to see him live again this winter in a program of Walton, a MacMillan premiere concerto, and the Planets. Last time, he added the nice touch of a short speech before Petrushka, pointing out to us some musical details that depict specific moments in the ballet. Since I've never seen the ballet danced, this was the first time I listened out for the bear dancing, for example. The audience really appreciated this, and his speaking manner was friendly, funny, and not too long.

Karl Henning

Quote from: Roasted Swan on July 01, 2025, 08:21:13 AMI saw Gardner with the LPO recently doing a "staged" version of Daphnis and Chloe in the Royal Festival Hall.  It was not the ballet but a kind of cirque de soleil presentation.  The audience loved it but I did not.  However, the LPO played really really well and Gardner was clearly absolutely on top of the score - clear and authoritative.  BUT as an interpretation it was very unremarkable.  Everything was in its place and there was nothing to offend but on the other hand there were no moments of revelation either.  So the earlier comment of "perfectly good but not essential" probably applied there too.  My observation with Chandos is that over the years they have used "house conductors" to record just about anything and I'm not always convinced there is an effective synergy between conductor and repertoire.  ALthough I guess a conductor could always say "no" if they felt they had nothing so say in that music......
A couple of thoughts, not quarreling with any of the observations here, just chiming in.
"[P]erfectly good but not essential" is truly helpful, even allowing for varying assessments of the essential.
Myself, I feel very well served w/r/t the orchestral works, and I am apt to regard Chandos (any label, really) rolling out a fresh Nielsen cycle as artistically unimaginative and commercially cynical/calculating. In general defense of Gardner (speaking in the abstract, as I do not know any of his work) the difficult path of the living conductor is made yet more difficult if the benchmark is, Is it super-extraordinary?
Which, again is not to say that any listener's experience at any evaluative level is to be denied.
Karl Henning, Ph.D.
Composer & Clarinetist
Boston MA
http://www.karlhenning.com/
[Matisse] was interested neither in fending off opposition,
nor in competing for the favor of wayward friends.
His only competition was with himself. — Françoise Gilot

Der lächelnde Schatten

Quote from: Karl Henning on July 01, 2025, 09:26:23 AMA couple of thoughts, not quarreling with any of the observations here, just chiming in.
"[P]erfectly good but not essential" is truly helpful, even allowing for varying assessments of the essential.
Myself, I feel very well served w/r/t the orchestral works, and I am apt to regard Chandos (any label, really) rolling out a fresh Nielsen cycle as artistically unimaginative and commercially cynical/calculating. In general defense of Gardner (speaking in the abstract, as I do not know any of his work) the difficult path of the living conductor is made yet more difficult if the benchmark is, Is it super-extraordinary?
Which, again is not to say that any listener's experience at any evaluative level is to be denied.

This is a great point, Karl. We, as listeners, have such a vast discography of so many different composers that it's difficult for a conductor of today to wedge their way into the consciousness of listeners without being compared to what came before.

I'm completely guilty of this more often than not and I'm trying to break the pattern. I'll think "Why am I listening to this new recording of Bruckner's 8th when I could be listening to Karajan or Günter Wand?" By doing this, I've automatically shut the door on the possibility of enjoying the music as it is happening in the current moment. Only concerning oneself with what has already happened will ultimately be the undoing of not only my own growth as a listener, but someone who will never truly be at one with the current time.
"To send light into the darkness of men's hearts - such is the duty of the artist." ― Robert Schumann

DavidW

Quote from: Der lächelnde Schatten on July 01, 2025, 08:03:49 AMGardner's Britten, Lutosławski and Szymanowski recordings are excellent.

Yep, that is what I like by him.

Daverz

Quote from: Der lächelnde Schatten on July 01, 2025, 08:03:49 AMGardner's Britten, Lutosławski and Szymanowski recordings are excellent. But these are exceptions. He's heading the London Philharmonic now, so we'll see how he does, but I won't lie and have to admit that Vladimir Jurowski was the conductor that brought them out of a slump they previously experienced under Franz Welser-Möst. Jurowski is one of my favorite contemporaneous conductors.

Of the Gardner recordings I've heard, I'd single out the Tippet disc as not merely supplementary.


Also, his Peter Grimes is spectacular.  He's certainly a conductor I look out for.

Der lächelnde Schatten

Quote from: Daverz on July 01, 2025, 02:20:47 PMOf the Gardner recordings I've heard, I'd single out the Tippet disc as not merely supplementary.


Also, his Peter Grimes is spectacular.  He's certainly a conductor I look out for.

Oh yeah, I mentioned his Britten recordings being particularly excellent. I haven't heard his Tippett, although I need to get around to his recording of The Midsummer Marriage, which I have but is still sealed in its cellophane wrapper. And, yes, that Peter Grimes recording is excellent!
"To send light into the darkness of men's hearts - such is the duty of the artist." ― Robert Schumann

Symphonic Addict

Quote from: vandermolen on July 01, 2025, 07:34:24 AMGreat combination of works!

Most definitely! Three scintillating masterpieces gathered together.
The current annihilation of a people on this planet (you know which one it is) is the most documented and at the same time the most preposterously denied.

Madiel

Quote from: Roasted Swan on July 01, 2025, 07:04:56 AMIts not that long since the last Chandos Nielsen cycle with the BBC PO - and then they had Rohzdestvensky before that and Bryden Thomson before that!  They had a fine Gibson 4&5 AS WELL. What's with Chandos and the Nielsen Symphonies!!??

Someone will keep authorising Nielsen symphony recordings until the wider world truly recognises Nielsen as one of the great symphonists.

Which he is, I think. He was my pick on a recent poll about the most consistent cycles.
Every single post on the forum is unnecessary. Including the ones that are interesting or useful.