Preferred version of Brahms Symphony #1

[Todd]

You cannot win this conversation, even by invoking Schumann, so I suggest you stop trying.

Schumann is not remembered because he was a critic.

[prémont]

When I'm in the mood for a Brahms symphony, what I rarely am, I turn to (in casual order):

Klemperer, Walter (Stereo), Boult (Mono) and van Beinum.

[Brian]

I'm sure my fellow longtime GMG regulars are equally amused that Todd has been called left-wing 

[Madiel]

Schumann is not remembered because he was a critic.

And yet here we are in a thread where someone remembered that he was.

Anyway I have no intention of discussing critics with you. My comment wasn't addressed TO you. It was addressed to the person who was trying to discuss critics with you.

[Todd]

And yet here we are in a thread where someone remembered that he was.

Self-styled cultural elites often mention immaterial factoids.  Berlioz would have been a better rhetorical choice.

My comment wasn't addressed TO you.

So?

[(poco) Sforzando]

Schumann is not remembered because he was a critic.

He is in part, as for example his early advocacy of Schubert, Chopin, and Brahms.

[(poco) Sforzando]

And yet here we are in a thread where someone remembered that he was.

Anyway I have no intention of discussing critics with you. My comment wasn't addressed TO you. It was addressed to the person who was trying to discuss critics with you.

Public forum. Anyone can jump in.

[prémont]

I'm sure my fellow longtime GMG regulars are equally amused that Todd has been called left-wing 

Yes, that's not right.

[Todd]

He is in part, as for example his early advocacy of Schubert, Chopin, and Brahms.

He is in part for a small niche within the already niche classical music world.  Were he not a great composer, his professional criticism would not be quite so noteworthy.

[Mandryka]

I'm sure my fellow longtime GMG regulars are equally amused that Todd has been called left-wing 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Horseshoe_theory

[Spotted Horses]

Brahms is so familiar to me that when I listen to his symphonies I usually go for something I have not heard before, and something which is off the beaten path. Thinking of recent favorites, Barbirolli/WPO, Kertesz/WPO, Ansermet/OSR, Fischer/Budapest. Seems like I haven't listened to a Brahms Symphony since 2024

[Mandryka]

Thanks for these tips;  I'll check out YT.  I've found the 1943 Mengelberg and am listening as I write this.  Wow, that dramatic opening with the timpani;  that's what I'm talking about - drama in spades, followed by contrast and highlighting of polyphonic complexity.  Now we're gettin' warm (Louis Armstrong, "High Society").

I'd not heard it for years to be honest, and after making that list  I listened to the  again - not the 1943 in fact, but the 1940. It's astonishing, wild. Thanks for reminding me about Brahms! @Spotted Horses  - just listen to the Mengelberg and genuflect.

[Todd]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Horseshoe_theory

That theory is only potentially useful when assessing application of state power.  Also, it veers into politics too much, or would, if anyone took it seriously today.

[Belle]

I'd not heard it for years to be honest, and after making that list  I listened to the  again - not the 1943 in fact, but the 1940. It's astonishing, wild. Thanks for reminding me about Brahms! @Spotted Horses  - just listen to the Mengelberg and genuflect.

I think I've endured too many anodyne performances of the Brahms #1 in the past, ergo this thread.  Those historic performances are often very enlightening, whilst our modern ones can often be the opposite - outstanding though some of the playing undoubtedly is!!

[Belle]

My usual gotos for the symphonies are Klemperer, Walter (stereo), Sanderling/Dresden, Jochum/LPO (stereo), Levine/Chicago (I'm not familiar with Levine/Vienna).  I would supplement with some "historical" recordings like Walter/New York (mono) and Furtwangler/Hamburg.  And also sample recordings with reduced forces like Mackerras or Dausgaard.

[Fixed the link to go to Symphony No. 1]

I generally find Klemperer's versions (of anything) too leaden and way too slow, but thanks for posting this.

[nakulanb]

I agree with those who state critics aren't as important as first personal evaluations.

Comparing your conclusions to others is far more intellectual than deriving your ideas from others, that's like sheep mentality.

[Daverz]

I generally find Klemperer's versions (of anything) too leaden and way too slow, but thanks for posting this.

Is this Klemperer recording of the Brahms Symphony No. 1 too leaden and slow?

I finally had a chance to listen to the Levine/Vienna recording, and it's a real banger of a performance in the Toscanini mold, but with much better sonics.  I have not had a chance to compare it to the Chicago recording.

[Madiel]

Public forum. Anyone can jump in.

Certainly they can. I'm just indicating that I wouldn't engage further with him on the topic of critics, when the whole point of my original comment was that engaging with him on that would be fruitless.

[Madiel]

I agree with those who state critics aren't as important as first personal evaluations.

Comparing your conclusions to others is far more intellectual than deriving your ideas from others, that's like sheep mentality.

Reviews exist to save time.

It really is as simple as that. Whether those reviews come from professional critics, or just from your acquaintance, the whole purpose is to deal with the fact that nobody has time to watch every film, read every book or listen to every recording.

I kind of find it weird how many people don't seem to understand that. Of course your own opinion is more important, but forming your opinion takes hours. The opinions of others are a shortcut. If you've got time to form your own opinion of 57 recordings, knock yourself out. I'd rather find an efficient way to whittle that down to 2 or 3 of particular interest and then still have time to do something else, including listening to the NEXT piece of music.

[nakulanb]

Reviews exist to save time.

It really is as simple as that. Whether those reviews come from professional critics, or just from your acquaintance, the whole purpose is to deal with the fact that nobody has time to watch every film, read every book or listen to every recording.

I kind of find it weird how many people don't seem to understand that. Of course your own opinion is more important, but forming your opinion takes hours. The opinions of others are a shortcut. If you've got time to form your own opinion of 57 recordings, knock yourself out. I'd rather find an efficient way to whittle that down to 2 or 3 of particular interest and then still have time to do something else, including listening to the NEXT piece of music.

There's nothing wrong with suggestions, it's only problematic if you accept the review at the cost of divergent thoughts, for whatever motivation.