Beethoven Violin Sonatas

[Antoine Marchand]

... as an example: Sonata for Violin and Piano N°7, 1st Mov. Allegro con brio

Terakado/Vodenitcharov

http://www.goear.com/listen.php?v=35f1c45

[Bunny]

[snip]

Well, thanks to a fellow member I've been able to sample a sonata from the Huvé/Fleezanis set and frankly: it sounded very fine. Some minor intonation problems in the first mvt, but the stylistic approach seems spot on IMO. Very much in the right spirit of the music: swift and expressive.

Very little comment to be found on line, but here's a brief quote from Strings Magazine:

The Beethoven Sonatas are technically and stylistically impeccable. Both players make their meticulous observance of Beethoven's markings sound musically and emotionally natural. The most startling element is the pianoforte sound: dry, crisp, transparent, with a brittle, rattling quality, especially since Beethoven indicates pedal only in the last two sonatas. Fleezanis plays the early sonatas in a semiperiod style, with delayed, sparing vibrato, swells, and abruptly short notes, though her tone is unfailingly beautiful. Some fast tempos are breathlessly hectic, but most are well suited to the mood, character, and expression of the music, allowing for elegant phrasing, poised changes, and transitions within a flexible but rock-steady rhythm. Among the highlights are the two perhaps most elusive sonatas, Nos. 6 and 10, but listeners will find their own favorites.

- Edith Eisler, stringmagazine.com

Will try to sample the new Japanese as well.

PS The description of the sound of the 1815 Schantz fortepiano as "brittle" and "rattling" is to be taken with a pinch (heap) of salt.... Maybe to the ears of someone not used to the sound of a fortepiano, but in truth the Schantz has a nice, firm, soft grained, "woody" sound without edginess..

Q

The quote you have posted doesn't mention that Fleezanis used her own violin -- a late 18th century Storioni which had been rebuilt to modern performance standards which she uses in modern orchestra performance (she is concert master of the Minnesota Symphony) -- for these recordings.  She did change her steel strings for gut and used a 19th century English bow as well, but I wonder, are they true "period instrument" performances?  Violin volume and tone are affected by such rebuilding.  I think the performances are more of a hybrid, which doesn't faze me at all, however others looking to buy a set of strict period instrument recordings may be disappointed if they buy these. 

I also tend to agree with Rod about the sound, which is too close for my comfort.  However, I'm not an enthusiastic fan of the Schroeder - Immerseel sonatas either (I'm not a great fan of Jaap Schroeder), I keep hoping that Daniel Sepec and Andreas Staier will record the rest of the sonatas.

The Denon recording is not new - it dates from about 1999 and is no longer available from Amazon US.  It is available from Amazon Japan or HMV Japan, but I'm not sure I'll be happy with the recording after I see the bill - about 6000 Yen plus s&h.   

[Rod Corkin]

... as an example: Sonata for Violin and Piano N°7, 1st Mov. Allegro con brio

Terakado/Vodenitcharov

http://www.goear.com/listen.php?v=35f1c45

I'll listen to this tonight thanks. What make of fortepiano is used (or copy thereof)? If it is English or French then that is an immediate write-off as far as I am concerned.

You can hear extracts from the Schroeder set (Op.12) at my site...
http://classicalmusicmayhem.freeforums.org/beethoven-3-violin-sonatas-op-12-t909.html
You'll have to log in to see the extracts however.

[Bunny]

For anyone who wishes to sample the Shröder/Immerseel Beethoven sonatas, a single cd with the Spring and Kreutzer sonatas is available at Amazon USA at prices under $1.00.  That will give a very fair idea of the quality of this set.  If this tickles your fancy, then by all means go for the whole set.  If you find it wanting, then you are only out about $4 or $5.

[adamdavid80]

For anyone who wishes to sample the Shröder/Immerseel Beethoven sonatas, a single cd with the Spring and Kreutzer sonatas is available at Amazon USA at prices under $1.00.  That will give a very fair idea of the quality of this set.  If this tickles your fancy, then by all means go for the whole set.  If you find it wanting, then you are only out about $4 or $5.

I can't see how this would be anything less than amazing, unless one or both of them had the flu or food poisoning on the date of recording.

[Bunny]

Depends on what you want/expect to hear.  Also, the musicians aren't the only people who make the cd.

[Holden]

A pity these guys didn't go any further. I'm not a great fan of HIP but this is excellent.

[adamdavid80]

Depends on what you want/expect to hear.  Also, the musicians aren't the only people who make the cd.

I expect to hear Prince's "Little Red Corvette", along with a sample of the latest riff from Guns'n'Roses.  Knowing Imerseel and the engineers who were working in the studio two doors down to where this was recorded, I'm sure not to be disappointed!

[PerfectWagnerite]

A pity these guys didn't go any further. I'm not a great fan of HIP but this is excellent.

What does "analytically indexed" mean?

And sorry, I can't help it but is your last name McGroin ?

[Bunny]

What does "analytically indexed" mean?

And sorry, I can't help it but is your last name McGroin ?

lol

[Bulldog]

What does "analytically indexed" mean?

I think that the disc is one of those older ones where there are index points within each movement.

[Que]

The quote you have posted doesn't mention that Fleezanis used her own violin -- a late 18th century Storioni which had been rebuilt to modern performance standards which she uses in modern orchestra performance (she is concert master of the Minnesota Symphony) -- for these recordings.  She did change her steel strings for gut and used a 19th century English bow as well, but I wonder, are they true "period instrument" performances?  Violin volume and tone are affected by such rebuilding.  I think the performances are more of a hybrid, which doesn't faze me at all, however others looking to buy a set of strict period instrument recordings may be disappointed if they buy these. 

I also tend to agree with Rod about the sound, which is too close for my comfort.  However, I'm not an enthusiastic fan of the Schroeder - Immerseel sonatas either (I'm not a great fan of Jaap Schroeder), I keep hoping that Daniel Sepec and Andreas Staier will record the rest of the sonatas.

Generally not a fan of Jaap Schröder either, but very much a fan of Immerseel. I should try that single CD selection. 

Interesting comment on the violin used by Fleezanis!
Well, on the subject of "quasi-HIP"!  Below a bit of a repost with alterations from the HIP Beethoven thread. About my favourite recording next to the conventional Suk/ Panenka (Supraphon), which I failed to mention before:

Not a fortepiano is used but a piano, yet not a modern piano but a Viennese instrument built in 1845 by Peter Rosenberger. And it sounds absolutely gorgeous. Leertouwer plays a violin from 1663 by Jacobus Stainer btw (not an instrument from the "right" period either.... ).

What's important for me in respect to this choice of instruments: it works. The result is very convincing to me: the balance between the instruments is much better than in recordings with modern instruments, as is the blending of the sound. Rhythmic elements in the music for the keyboard are much better served on this instrument with a "Viennese action" - as I understand it, the hammers do not strike the string frontally, but "brush" them.

All this is topped by wonderful performances by Joannes Leertouwer and Julian Reynolds.
I couldn't find any trace of a review - I just stumbled upon volume 1 as a bargain and was intrigued by the keyboard on the cover, and Leertouwer has a good domestic reputation. These recordings are quite different from conventional recordings: much more "Classical" in conception, but the subtler sonorities also bring out the "Romantic" elements in the later sonatas. Found these hugely rewarding - strongly recommended.



Q

[Bunny]

Que, they do say that it is a "pianoforte" that is used right on the cover.  As Beethoven lived and died just as the fortepiano evolved into the pianoforte, perhaps these are not so far afield as long as there is no sostenuto pedal (or pedaling).  As for the violin, it clearly has been modified to more modern performance standards: The chin rest is very visible on the cover photo as is the more raised bridge and narrower neck.  The rebuilding may even date to the mid 19th century which would make the pairing of this pianoforte and violin sound very natural.  I don't doubt that Leertouwer has used gut strings and a 19th century bow as well. 

[adamdavid80]

And sorry, I can't help it but is your last name McGroin ?

"Holden McGroin"?  Well, if that's not YOU holding it, whose hand IS on my groin???

[Holden]

"Holden McGroin"?  Well, if that's not YOU holding it, whose hand IS on my groin???

Holden McGroin - hadn't thought of that one - it's a classic!

it's a bit deeper though - Holden Fourth

[PerfectWagnerite]

Holden McGroin - hadn't thought of that one - it's a classic!

it's a bit deeper though - Holden Fourth

Actually if you ever watch the show Friends, Holden McGroin is a name Joey used for one of his acting auditions so I didn't make it up.

Que, they do say that it is a "pianoforte" that is used right on the cover.  As Beethoven lived and died just as the fortepiano evolved into the pianoforte, perhaps these are not so far afield as long as there is no sostenuto pedal (or pedaling).  As for the violin, it clearly has been modified to more modern performance standards: The chin rest is very visible on the cover photo as is the more raised bridge and narrower neck.  The rebuilding may even date to the mid 19th century which would make the pairing of this pianoforte and violin sound very natural.  I don't doubt that Leertouwer has used gut strings and a 19th century bow as well. 

You can pretty much tell that other than the fortepiano the recording is not "HIP" as what you usually associate HIP with. The violin sound is much closer to the modern violin and the playing, phrasing, vibrato wholely point to a Romantic reading than classical.  It is an excellent reading though.

[Antoine Marchand]

I'll listen to this tonight thanks. What make of fortepiano is used (or copy thereof)? If it is English or French then that is an immediate write-off as far as I am concerned.

You can hear extracts from the Schroeder set (Op.12) at my site...
http://classicalmusicmayhem.freeforums.org/beethoven-3-violin-sonatas-op-12-t909.html
You'll have to log in to see the extracts however.

Hi, Rod, only Viennese fortepianos were used in these recordings as you can read in my previous post: a copy (after Anton Walter, ca. 1795) and two originals (Rosenberger ca. 1802, and Lagrassa ca. 1806).  BTW, you have an interesting site, congratulations... Let me Know if you want to listen to something else.

[Rod Corkin]

Hi, Rod, only Viennese fortepianos were used in these recordings as you can read in my previous post: a copy (after Anton Walter, ca. 1795) and two originals (Rosenberger ca. 1802, and Lagrassa ca. 1806).  BTW, you have an interesting site, congratulations... Let me Know if you want to listen to something else.

Thanks Antoine. Actually I think Schroeder/Immerseel do a better job on the whole than Terakado/Vodenitcharov in your track from the Sonata N°7, Allegro con brio. It sounds a bit tame in comparison. My site is a whole lot more interesting if you register and log in, a lot of nice things are invisible to guests.

[FredT]

Rosand on Vox is the real deal and a real steal to boot. The man is an exceptional musician and seriously underrated. Love his Sarasate!

[Zhiliang]

Hi,

I am looking for a complete recording of the Beethoven Violin Sonatas and the Mozart Violin Sonatas.

Any great ones to recommend?

I particularly enjoyed the Gidon Kremer and Martha Argerich recordings of the Beethoven Sonatas.

Thanks.