A benchmark Pergolesi Stabat Mater?

[knight66]

Mark, I have listened to the track you hyperlinked and I agree, it sounds excellent. While we are on a Hogwood binge, he produced a simply superb Mozart great Mass in C, Arleen Auger is well to the fore. It is as good as any recording that I know. It is on Decca, it keeps changing its spots and pairings. It does not seem to be generally available just now, the only sign of it on Amazon is for a fancy price.

Mike

[Que]

Mark, I have listened to the track you hyperlinked and I agree, it sounds excellent. While we are on a Hogwood binge, he produced a simply superb Mozart great Mass in C, Arleen Auger is well to the fore. It is as good as any recording that I know. It is on Decca, it keeps changing its spots and pairings. It does not seem to be generally available just now, the only sign of it on Amazon is for a fancy price.

Mike

Hear, hear! Even better than the Requiem, Mark! Strongly recommended.



(click for link - and go for it! )

Q

[knight66]

Q, Well done, I only tried the UK site plus CDconnection.com

I urge this recording on anyone who might be tempted.

Mike

[Mark]

Que, Mike - the Great Mass in C is also readily available on Amazon.co.uk:

Hogwood - Mozart Mass in C.

Good price, too.

[FideLeo]

Hear, hear! Even better than the Requiem, Mark! Strongly recommended.
Q

Q, do you mean the music or the interpretation?  I am inclined to agree with you more
if it's the music.  For c minor mass I think I will urge people to hear the more recent
Langree recording with Dessay and Gens on the high parts who have purer voices
than Auger in particular.  (I might like it more if H. had Kirkby here like in the
Requiem.)  That Hogwood also employs a boy-and-men's choir in this recording adds a few
points, but most people listen to this work for the soprano fireworks arias and duet

[Que]

Q, do you mean the music or the interpretation?  I am inclined to agree with you more
if it's the music.  For c minor mass I think I will urge people to hear the more recent
Langree recording with Dessay and Gens on the high parts who have a purer voice
than Auger in particular.  (I might like it more if he had Kirkby here as he does in the
Requiem.)  That Hogwood has a boy-and-men's choir in this recording adds a few
points, but...

Both, but I don't know the recording by Langrée with Dessay and Gens, which is quite recent - no?
I particularly like Auger in the Hogwood btw. Though I like Dessay and Gens too - would love to check out the Langrée!

Q

[FideLeo]

Both, but I don't know the recording by Langrée with Dessay and Gens, which is quite recent - no?
I particularly like Auger in the Hogwood btw. Though I like Dessay and Gens too - would love to check out the Langrée!

Q

Langree recording out last year I believe.  I prefer Dawson's contribution in the Hogwood mass in c, even though I think Auger may have a more perfect technique (in this recording anyway).  For some reason, I tend to hear more maturity and experience than elan in Auger's voice.  Sorry to use this analogy, but she sometimes sounds more like a grandma (or at least a madame) rather than a mademoiselle to me, and Mozart's Konstanze couldn't have been much older than 20 when she gave the world-premiere () of these vocal fireworks.

[Expresso]

The Stabat Mater is a work Mrs. Rock and I both love to distraction. We currently own on CD Dutoit/Anderson/Bartoli and Gracis/Freni/Berganzi. We want a HIP version or two but have the same problem here as we did with acquiring a HIP Messiah (some may remember the thread at the old forum): we can't stand male altos. The only composer who wrote well for the bargain-counter tenor was, in my opinion, P.D.Q. Bach.

I don't understand why every HIP set we've sampled has a male alto. Why is that considered authentic? I mean, they use an adult woman to sing the soprano part. I haven't heard one that uses a boy. So why not a woman in the alto part too? Why this peculiar obsession with a highly artificial, and to me, silly sounding voice?

So my question is: can anyone recommend a good HIP version that employs two women?

Sarge

Harnoncourt uses a female cast of singers.

Eva Mei (Soprano)
Marjana Lipovsek (Mezzo Soprano)

[FideLeo]

Harnoncourt uses a female cast of singers.

Eva Mei (Soprano)
Marjana Lipovsek (Mezzo Soprano)

How well does Harnoncourt handle the bitter-sweet mood of this music? 

[Papy Oli]

Alessandrini's version on Naive is one of the first classical CDs i bought, simply on a recommendation of a friend who adored that piece....i must say that is quite excellent indeed, and that version is very minimalist and with a stunning sound quality.

As Masolino mentionned it already, i quite like the revisited version by Bach too (Psalm 51, BWV1083). I only have the version in Bach Brilliant complete edition. Would someone care to recommend a good version of this work too please ?

Thanks 

[FideLeo]

Alessandrini's version on Naive is one of the first classical CDs i bought, simply on a recommendation of a friend who adored that piece....i must say that is quite excellent indeed, and that version is very minimalist and with a stunning sound quality.

As Masolino mentionned it already, i quite like the revisited version by Bach too (Psalm 51, BWV1083). I only have the version in Bach Brilliant complete edition. Would someone care to recommend a good version of this work too please ?

Thanks 

Do you also request two female voices in this recommendation?   Even the most recent SACD version of this music has a male alto...but an excellent one nevertheless, Daniel Taylor.  The filler is likely the soprano version of BWV 82.

BACH: Psalm 51 (After Pergolesi's Stabat Mater); Cantata 82 "Ich habe genug" - Karina Gauvin, soprano/Daniel Taylor, countertenor/Les Violons du Roy/Bernard Labadie - ATMA Multichannel SACD



However, as I stated above, it is far from unlikely for Bach to have staged his Pergolesi revision with a female soprano and a male alto.  Perhaps when the Bach version becomes as well known as the Pergolesi original, we will see recordings with two (sometimes very lush) female voices. 

[Papy Oli]

Hi Masolino,

Thanks for the recommendation.

I was so used to the alessandrini version, that hearing the bach one with male/female was a surprise initially, but i like both versions. Had to check for the bach/brilliant version, but yes, it is a male alto.... it is...   



http://www.sytsebuwalda.eu/site.html

[Expresso]

How well does Harnoncourt handle the bitter-sweet mood of this music? 

Very good... his version is a bit more dramatic and operatic than most versions of Stabat Mater mentioned here.

[Sergeant Rock]

The answer is yes.  Handel used both falsettists and female alto voices for solos in his oratorios... 

Alessandrini writes in the booklet with his recording that the original performances were almost certainly done by castrati...

Masolino, Que, thank you both very much for your replies.

Sarge

[FideLeo]

Very good... his version is a bit more dramatic and operatic than most versions of Stabat Mater mentioned here.

That is good to know! (Harnoncourt also recorded Haydn's Stabat Mater, and he may have chosen to play it similarly there.)  But it is not a "romantic soup" like the Abbado/Marshall/whatshername DG recording mentioned above, I hope?   

[FideLeo]

Masolino, Que, thank you both very much for your replies.

Sarge

Hi Sarge you are welcome.  I actually learned a bit from trying to answer your question properly.   

[Steve]

Q, do you mean the music or the interpretation?  I am inclined to agree with you more
if it's the music.  For c minor mass I think I will urge people to hear the more recent
Langree recording with Dessay and Gens on the high parts who have purer voices
than Auger in particular.  (I might like it more if H. had Kirkby here like in the
Requiem.)  That Hogwood also employs a boy-and-men's choir in this recording adds a few
points, but most people listen to this work for the soprano fireworks arias and duet

Having listened to both of these recordings, I can say that I consistently prefer the Hogwood. In fact, the superlative voice of Auger is a great reason why. I have many of her other recordings, and Hogwood goes with out saying. I don't know what 'purer' is supposed to me, or how it could ever be used to describe the quality of a voice, but I have very few gripes with this recording. Hogwood is one of Mozart's most consistently faithful interpreters, and he seems less likely to strip the piece of Mozart, as others do.

[Expresso]

That is good to know! (Harnoncourt also recorded Haydn's Stabat Mater, and he may have chosen to play it similarly there.)  But it is not a "romantic soup" like the Abbado/Marshall/whatshername DG recording mentioned above, I hope?   

I think it's typical Harnoncourt... with authentic instruments, but without trying to be 100% HIP.
It's nowhere near Abbado, he doesn't transform Pergolesi's work into a romantic opera 

[FideLeo]

Having listened to both of these recordings, I can say that I consistently prefer the Hogwood. In fact, the superlative voice of Auger is a great reason why. I have many of her other recordings, and Hogwood goes with out saying. I don't know what 'purer' is supposed to me, or how it could ever be used to describe the quality of a voice, but I have very few gripes with this recording. Hogwood is one of Mozart's most consistently faithful interpreters, and he seems less likely to strip the piece of Mozart, as others do.

Yes you may like Auger's voice, but do observe the differences between her voice and say that of Dessay, for example.      BTW what do you mean by saying someone "strips" the piece of Mozart?  Really I find H's interpretation of the c-minor mass a bit too ceremonious and foursquared for the work.

[FideLeo]

I think it's typical Harnoncourt... with authentic instruments, but without trying to be 100% HIP.
It's nowhere near Abbado, he doesn't transform Pergolesi's work into a romantic opera 

Great again, because Harnoncourt can occasionally overdo his "slasher shock" bits in baroque music and then the music would start to sound...contrived (for lack of a better term) to just any listener.