Which Shostakovich 11 ("The year 1905")?

Tapio Dmitriyevich · July 21, 2011, 06:24:36 AM

Bought and listened to Shostakovich 11 Berglund/Bournemouth the other day. The whole Symphony, especially the Haitink interpretation, is amongst my most loved symphonies. First question: Which of both 11th do you prefer?

Haitink/Concertgebouw?

(the same as:)

Berglund/Bournemouth SO?

From timing and tempi I'm pretty used to Haitink. I love that recording. Berglund is more variable, often a bit slower. The Tocsin finale in mvmt 4 is alright, the more silent passages are often played a bit slower. For instance the part before the big struggle in movement two. Maybe I'll like it.
But the Bournemouth sound is very impressive, very explosive when it comes to the loud parts, but also very clear: very good sound.

You prefer...?

Other interpretations?

Michael

EDIT: As non-native english speaker, I never understood the importance of the banana, but I added one to this poll.
EDIT2 [2011-07-27] I removed the Poll, because it's useless. Result: Haitink 7, Berglund 0, Banana 3.

DavidW · July 21, 2011, 06:37:40 AM

Haven't heard either. I know of Haitink (since his DSCH is highly praised), but haven't listened yet. Berglund DSCH, I have not been very impressed with his conducting efforts, seems very left field to me.

I like Kondrashin and Barshai. I want to listen to Petrenko since he is the man!

springrite · July 21, 2011, 06:40:05 AM

For me, the one that stands out head and shoulder above every other candidate is Stokowski's recording with Houston. No one else comes close. I lost that CD to a friend who borrowed but never returned the disc. I tried about half a dozen others but none satisfies. Then I found my new copy last year. The urgency, eerieness, bluntness and the constant pull on your emotions is unparalleled. Get it if you got a chance!

PaulR · July 21, 2011, 06:42:57 AM

My favorite recording of the 11th comes from Rostropovich and the LSO. I think the slow tempos he takes in couple of the movements works well.

I also like the Petrenko version, just not as much as the Rostropovich

I probably should get the Haitink version, though

DavidW · July 21, 2011, 06:44:59 AM

Quote from: springrite on July 21, 2011, 06:40:05 AM
For me, the one that stands out head and shoulder above every other candidate is Stokowski's recording with Houston. No one else comes close. I lost that CD to a friend who borrowed but never returned the disc. I tried about half a dozen others but none satisfies. Then I found my new copy last year. The urgency, eerieness, bluntness and the constant pull on your emotions is unparalleled. Get it if you got a chance!

Yes that recording is awesome!! I also like Stokowski's recording of the Rach 3rd, in both of these he is on fire!

Brahmsian · July 21, 2011, 06:48:21 AM

In order of the one's I've heard, I like these:

Karabits/Bournemouth SO

Petrenko/RLPO

Barshai/WDR

mc ukrneal · July 21, 2011, 06:56:04 AM

Quote from: springrite on July 21, 2011, 06:40:05 AM
For me, the one that stands out head and shoulder above every other candidate is Stokowski's recording with Houston. No one else comes close. I lost that CD to a friend who borrowed but never returned the disc. I tried about half a dozen others but none satisfies. Then I found my new copy last year. The urgency, eerieness, bluntness and the constant pull on your emotions is unparalleled. Get it if you got a chance!

How is the sound?

springrite · July 21, 2011, 07:02:30 AM

Quote from: mc ukrneal on July 21, 2011, 06:56:04 AM
How is the sound?

Wonderful!

BTW, originally on ANGEL (EMI) but now available from BRO, DTO label.

kishnevi · July 21, 2011, 07:10:32 AM

I have the Rostropovich LSO, David Montgomery with the Jena Philharmonic (on Arte Nova), the Haitink, and the relatively new one from Gergiev/Mariinsky (ex-Kirov). I'd rank them Rostropovich first, with Gergiev very close behind, Haitink close but unquestionably not as good, and Montgomery as decent but ultimately forgettable.
For me it boils down to liking the tempo choices that Rostropovich and Gergiev make.

techniquest · July 21, 2011, 09:10:06 AM

I have the Bournemouth SO / Berglund recording on both vinyl and CD, so I've grown up with it as my reference recording. I'd suggest it's excellent bet all round: it has depth, it has savagery, it has been well recorded with plenty of big percussion essential in this symphony, and it is a very good reading. But I cannot compare it to the Haitink because (would you believe) I have never heard any Haitink Shostakovich.
Another very good recording (if you can find it) is the BBC Symphony Orchestra / Sir John Pritchard on IMP/BBC Radio Classics from a live performance in 1985

Tapio Dmitriyevich · July 21, 2011, 09:54:56 AM

I listened to some key points in the Stokowski CD recording - very very convincing, a perfect interpretation as far as I can judge, ... BUT: Seems like the sound engineers couldn't handle the dynamics? The loud passage in movement 2 (extremely) and also the Tocsin finale sound VEERY loudness compressed.

EDIT: It's not just me. Some reviewers on Amazon also mention the bad dynamics compression. What a terribly bad job the sound engineer did. OMFG.

Springrite, what's the BRO/DTO label?

springrite · July 21, 2011, 10:05:22 AM

Quote from: Tapio Dmitriyevich Shostakovich on July 21, 2011, 09:54:56 AM
I listened to some key points in the Stokowski CD recording - very very convincing, a perfect interpretation as far as I can judge, ... BUT: Seems like the sound engineers couldn't handle the dynamics? The loud passage in movement 2 (extremely) and also the Tocsin finale sound VEERY loudness compressed.

EDIT: It's not just me. Some reviewers on Amazon also mention the bad dynamics compression. What a terribly bad job the sound engineer did. OMFG.

Well, maybe a bit in parts but, overall, it didn't bother me at all.

Tapio Dmitriyevich · July 21, 2011, 10:13:51 AM

I'm referring to the EMI recording. Really, no no no. E.g. when the brass at Mvmt. IV@3:35 pull down the whole volume level is just out of question. It's everywhere where loud parts follow more silent parts. Also 5:47 ff. - disgusting. They destroyed a probably great performance.

Drasko · July 21, 2011, 11:16:35 AM

If you want sonic spectacular try Pletnev with Russian National Orchestra on Pentatone.

Of the ones I have (Haitink, Barshai, Kondrashin, Mravinsky, Pletnev, Stokowski, Cluytens) Haitink is still my big overall favorite.

vandermolen · July 21, 2011, 12:41:45 PM

Quote from: springrite on July 21, 2011, 06:40:05 AM
For me, the one that stands out head and shoulder above every other candidate is Stokowski's recording with Houston. No one else comes close. I lost that CD to a friend who borrowed but never returned the disc. I tried about half a dozen others but none satisfies. Then I found my new copy last year. The urgency, eerieness, bluntness and the constant pull on your emotions is unparalleled. Get it if you got a chance!

YES, YES, YES - It has just been reissued too.

[asin]B004YDW9GM[/asin]

The other version I like very much is on a long deleted CD (BBC Radio Classics) with Sir John Pritchard conducting the BBC SO at a concert I was at (Royal Festival Hall 12th April 1985) - I remember sitting in the cheaper choir seats just behind the timpani and that concert was quite an experience. I hope that the performance re-surfaces - maybe on Testament one day.

Tapio Dmitriyevich · July 22, 2011, 02:54:59 AM

Quote from: vandermolen on July 21, 2011, 12:41:45 PM
YES, YES, YES - It has just been reissued too.[asin]B004YDW9GM[/asin]

The question is, if it is as badly remastered as the EMI release? ->

[asin]B000002S5Q[/asin]

vandermolen · July 22, 2011, 05:32:15 AM

Quote from: Tapio Dmitriyevich Shostakovich on July 22, 2011, 02:54:59 AM
The question is, if it is as badly remastered as the EMI release? ->

[asin]B000002S5Q[/asin]

It arrived today - I'm away for a week but will listen and report back when I return.

Tapio Dmitriyevich · July 22, 2011, 07:07:19 AM

Quote from: vandermolen on July 22, 2011, 05:32:15 AMIt arrived today - I'm away for a week but will listen and report back when I return.

The Urania release? Oooh, I was too impatient: Ordered that CD as well today from Amazon (a reseller)

Listened again to Stokowski/Houston/EMI. They completely failed. The loudness level of the frightening violins after the massacre scene is almost the same as the massacre itself. What complete i***ts that sound engineers were. But anyway, Haitink wins, Concertgebouw rocks, Decca rocks, they did it

vandermolen · July 22, 2011, 08:10:42 AM

Quote from: Tapio Dmitriyevich Shostakovich on July 22, 2011, 07:07:19 AM
The Urania release? Oooh, I was too impatient: Ordered that CD as well today from Amazon (a reseller)

Listened again to Stokowski/Houston/EMI. They completely failed. The loudness level of the frightening violins after the massacre scene is almost the same as the massacre itself. What complete i***ts that sound engineers were. But anyway, Haitink wins, Concertgebouw rocks, Decca rocks, they did it

Let us know what you think - I like the Khachaturian Second Symphony too.

snyprrr · July 22, 2011, 08:41:24 AM

Quote from: springrite on July 21, 2011, 06:40:05 AM
For me, the one that stands out head and shoulder above every other candidate is Stokowski's recording with Houston. No one else comes close. I lost that CD to a friend who borrowed but never returned the disc. I tried about half a dozen others but none satisfies. Then I found my new copy last year. The urgency, eerieness, bluntness and the constant pull on your emotions is unparalleled. Get it if you got a chance!

mmm,... Stokowski, and no other!! It's 'The One'. No other recording brings off the crucial Very-First-Note,... maddening, isn't it?

Which Shostakovich 11 ("The year 1905")?

DavidW

DavidW

Brahmsian

kishnevi

Drasko

snyprrr