Learning a new language - have you ever actually cracked it? Tips required.

[yashin]

Thanks to you all for your comments so far.  Special thanks to Papy for the websites.

What i meant by 'crack it' was that i always felt that a new language was something other people were able to do-not me. Although i had several years of teaching i never really felt i understood it or could converse in it.

I agree in many ways that learning in a classroom would be beneficial but when i was learning Dutch -this method was a disaster because of a very poor teacher and teaching methods. It actually put me off rather than got me interested.  Living in the country in which you are trying to learn the language works in some places and not others.  Try speaking Dutch in Holland and you often find they reply in English!! Or worse, they cut in and say it in English.  I could imagine the same in many big European cities.  My sister moved to a small Spanish Island-she had to learn Spanish quickly because at the time, there were few tourists and not many English speakers.

[Mozart]

Make some tee shirts that say speak to me in Dutch 

[greg]

Like someone said, movies with subtitles might be good (helped me learn English). 

yep, subtitles are also really useful, especially for just regular, everyday speech. The only thing is, I found this doesn't completely work because usually the subtitles are approximations of the actual speech. Also, here in America the foreign subtitles are almost always in only Spanish or French. Imported anime DVDs might have Japanese audio, but no Japanese subtitles.... i even read that DVDs in Japan hardly ever have subtitles anyways, so if you're deaf there, you're totally screwed.

[greg]

Well, I have been learning some Esperanto yesterday and today. But I don't think I'll continue it, of course because almost no one speaks it. Estimates say up to 2 million worldwide, but it's not of much use. There is the fact that it can help you learn other languages quicker, and I definitely see why, but nah......


anyways, it's really interesting. I've covered all the main grammar points and have said various sentences throughout the day just to get the feel for it. It's strange, sometimes sentences flow, sometimes they don't. Sometimes they sound Italian, sometimes English, sometimes Polish, usually a mix. I do have to admit, it's fun, though. Spelling, grammar, it's all regular and easy though I find it hard to pronounce the j (y sound) at the end of words to form plurals. Say "knabo", then "knaboj". Actually, it's not hard, just awkward. But it's really logical and can help you understand concepts that seem hard, but are actually simple and logical in Esperanto.

I wonder why they decided not to teach something like this throughout the world? You know, create a universal 2nd language? Sure, they teach English almost everywhere but it's obviously too hard for certain places, specifically Asia. hmmmmmmmmm

anyways, a really interesting read 

[M forever]

I had a good bash at learning French, and might return to it possibly for employment reasons like yourself.

Do you have to know French to be a bus driver in England?

I think to some extent you need to be a certain kind of person to learn a language- when you're not immersed in an environment where it's spoken.

Indeed you do, the kind of person that is interested in and able to really communicate with other people and understand what they are actually saying, not just read into them whatever he/she wants to see or hear.

[S709]

Well, I have been learning some Esperanto yesterday and today. But I don't think I'll continue it, of course because almost no one speaks it. Estimates say up to 2 million worldwide, but it's not of much use. There is the fact that it can help you learn other languages quicker, and I definitely see why, but nah......

That is cool, I have never tried to read any Esperanto; I have heard it sung (!) in Lou Harrison's "La Koro Sutro" though!  

As for the initial question: yes, I have successfully (to whatever degree) learned English through the 'live in a country which uses it' approach. I am learning French now and a little Spanish, and the non-immersive approaches are really not as effective. Natural language acqusition (as opposed to computer languages!) requires huge amounts of information and the term 'immersion' really is accurate... it probably takes several years of being constantly 'bombarded' with language data (vocabulary, phrases, idioms, ...) to become fluent.

(I guess that has already been said probably.  )

[Steve]

I've been studying German for a great number of years. Initially, I attended a private language academy as a child, and then studyed further in grammar, and later high-school. I would say that by the age of 10, I was capable of carrying normal, fluent conversations, but it wasn't until my high-school years did I really begin to grasp the nuances of dialects, accents, and grammar. Now, I can just about read anything I like, including, recently, Kant's Critique on Pure Reason.

[Novi]

I've been studying German for a great number of years. Initially, I attended a private language academy as a child, and then studyed further in grammar, and later high-school. I would say that by the age of 10, I was capable of carrying normal, fluent conversations, but it wasn't until my high-school years did I really begin to grasp the nuances of dialects, accents, and grammar. Now, I can just about read anything I like, including, recently, Kant's Critique on Pure Reason.

Holy crap - that's bad enough in translation .

[Steve]

Holy crap - that's bad enough in translation .

In the original German it's no less tough, dry, and incredibly monochromatic... Still, it's absolutely foundational. 

[M forever]

I have studied German for many years, too. But I never really had much of a choice. Nobody asked me if I wanted to.

[Steve]

I have studied German for many years, too. But I never really had much of a choice. Nobody asked me if I wanted to.

I began lessons at the age of 9! On Saturday Mornings! Trust me, in those early years, I did not study of my own volition.

[M forever]

I began when I was 0 years old. On a Sunday morning, actually.

[greg]

I began when I was 0 years old. On a Sunday morning, actually.

lol!

[Michel]

I'm learning french and it is going very well - I have no doubt I will crack it. Just don't get frustrated and enjoy and you will carry on learning sucessfully.

[Steve]

I'm learning french and it is going very well - I have no doubt I will crack it. Just don't get frustrated and enjoy and you will carry on learning sucessfully.

What method are you using to learn French? Classroom instruction, CDs, immersion....

[greg]

i don't know if i brought this up yet:

http://www.mylanguageexchange.com/

if you want to practice with a penpal (or chat) there's tons on this site.
I should say this.... in the future, I'm thinking about not going on GMG anymore but spending more time on the computer possibly on this site, to practice Japanese with some penpals. Hopefully I can get people from a few different cities, Tokyo (of course), Osaka, Kyoto, Nagoya, etc. since I wanna learn all the different dialects, too. If you become good friends with them you can hang out with them, too.
i'm not doing it now for various reasons, but it looks very promising....... can't wait to "meet" my friends in Japan. 

[Michel]

What method are you using to learn French? Classroom instruction, CDs, immersion....

Initially Michel Thomas CD's, I found them to be really great, and most importantly enjoyable. I then also, although Michel says I shouldn't, practise writing interesting things I feel like in french, and I talk to a french friend I have in french.

I've yet to try immersion and as a result, my aural recognition is at this point poor.

[Steve]

Michel Thomas Cds? Where might one find those? I'll be starting classroom instruction soon, but I've heard many good things about Cds. Especially if immersion is difficult. You can hear real people having simple, but real, conversations.

[greg]

look at this guy:

http://www.michelthomas.com/

uhhhhhhhhh hm

[Steve]

look at this guy:

http://www.michelthomas.com/

uhhhhhhhhh hm

Thanks for the hyperlink. Unforuntaly, the each of the links on the page that direct to an online merchant don't work. They all direct to Barnes and Noble, where it seems, they are no longer carried.