Is the composer obsolete?

[Ten thumbs]

The question seems to have been answered. The composer is still required for film music. I really will have to start visiting the cinema!

[Karl Henning]

No one really cares about what composers have to offer today as evidenced by the fact that orchestras don't rely on them to bring in audiences.

The substance of classical radio and performance is dominated by music that was composed before the first world war, with some notable exceptions, of course.

While many modern composers comfort themselves with the idea that they are artists who are unjustifiably ignored, the reality might be that they are just irrelevant and obsolete because they are incapable of writing music that can please audiences.

Let me quote a pathetic "modern" composer rationalizing his insignificance:

Drawing such a distinction between "art" and "entertainment" allows Wourinen to convince himself that his insignificance stems from the unwillingness of classical audiences to "grapple" with his work. Under this paradigm, his works can never be judged as "bad" by audiences, because then, they are just being lazy!

Of course the truly funny thing is that most of the standard repertoire arose at a time when audiences could freely express disgust at what they perceived to be bad music--and composers aimed to please them.

This was all a joke, right?

[(poco) Sforzando]

This was all a joke, right?

It's taken you seven years to arrive at this conclusion?

[Karl Henning]

Not sure just how I chanced on this today.

[Karl Henning]

Always assuming that there ever was a point where music took a turn for the worse.

I would have hoped that THAT would have been the first thing to have been called into question....

[Ken B]

Your second quote misses or ignores -abe-'s point. There certainly DID come a time when the attitude  amongst composers and critics changed, and when some started to attribute a lack of success to the audience's failure, not the composer's.  I don't think that's a joke at all.

[(poco) Sforzando]

Your second quote misses or ignores -abe-'s point. There certainly DID come a time when the attitude  amongst composers and critics changed, and when some started to attribute a lack of success to the audience's failure, not the composer's.  I don't think that's a joke at all.

You mean when Beethoven called the Viennese public "cattle and asses" for not getting the Grosse Fuge, or when he blamed them for preferring the 7th to the 8th symphony because the latter was "so much better," or when he said they had no use for his music and wanted only to hear the operas of Rossini?

Or perhaps Mozart's response when the emperor told him there were "too many notes" in The Abduction? "Exactly as many, excellency, as necessary."

[Karl Henning]

It's taken you seven years to arrive at this conclusion?

Looking for a post of mine, I did a search with I forget just what keyword . . . scrolling with parenthetical interest through the search results, I thought, "To what conversation did I pipe in with that remark?..."

[Ken B]

You mean when Beethoven called the Viennese public "cattle and asses" for not getting the Grosse Fuge, or when he blamed them for preferring the 7th to the 8th symphony because the latter was "so much better," or when he said they had no use for his music and wanted only to hear the operas of Rossini?

Or perhaps Mozart's response when the emperor told him there were "too many notes" in The Abduction? "Exactly as many, excellency, as necessary."

I think I meant when composers made a large part of their living from composing, rather than selling insurance or running a government agency. I believe that was the substance of abe's point after all.

[Monsieur Croche]

  No, not at all.

What there is a spate of beyond which any marketplace has a want or need of is staggering numbers of Lumpen postings which are virtual verbatim duplicates of the OP.

It is easily the 500,000th of its kind, virtually interchangeable with all others like it seen on the internet within the last seven and a half months.

If it were more amusing in its Lumpen-ness, one might think the person who will make that future virtually identical Millionth post should get some sort of distinctive prize... Maybe a beer mug with 24 carat writing in High German Gothic font, saying,

"No One Will Ever Be As Good As The Old Boys.

But... sigh. Like the poor, it seems the Lumpen will be forever with us. At least one can laugh at the Lumpen, where it is mean to laugh at the poor. On the other hand, as evidenced in the OP, Lumpen is a kind of poverty also to be pitied.

[North Star]

Well, thank you for raising this topic (again... I mustn't forget Karl contribution )

[ComposerOfAvantGarde]

Typical M. Croche for bringing a topic like this up again LOL

I remember once reading some 458392959 other places on the internet that today's classical music is unmitigated shite. Well, actually that figure should be much lower because barely any of those people choose to pay any attention to it.

[Monsieur Croche]

Typical M. Croche for bringing a topic like this up again LOL

I remember once reading some 458392959 other places on the internet that today's classical music is unmitigated shite. Well, actually that figure should be much lower because barely any of those people choose to pay any attention to it.

Lol. That was a sort of both exercise and exorcising. Sometimes, after approximately "458392959" exposures to seeing "other places on the internet that today's classical music is unmitigated shite" one can come up with a highly suitable one-size-fits-all response to these more generic of Lumpen posts.

If I was smart, I'd save that response and have it handy to copy and paste as the perfect generic auto-response to the next virtually identical 458392959 Lumpen 'no one like the old boys' posts which will inevitably come up.

Anyone is completely welcome to use my text entire whenever an occasion calls for it.
Feel free to copy and paste it to a word doc saved to your computer.

Because we know there will come another such Lumpen post in moments;
they run as regularly as buses.

[ComposerOfAvantGarde]

CLASSICAL MUSIC IS DEAD CONTEMPORARY COMPOSERS ARE ALL CHARLATANS PEOPLE ONLY PRETEND TO LIKE THIS MUSIC TO LOOK INTELLECTUAL

[Karl Henning]

Well, thank you for raising this topic (again... I mustn't forget Karl contribution )

The inadvertent exhumation, you mean? 

Happy Monday, Karlo!

[Monsieur Croche]

Once you guys have finished feeling good and fuzzy about yourselves (take your time, by all means), i'd like to present a proposition: name one single contemporary composer that is as great as Beethoven, or Bach. No second runners allowed.

News Flash: "the only great composers are dead German composers."

If you believe that, I have a sure-fire plan to conquer all of Europe, starting with first invading Poland, that I'd like to sell you.

[Florestan]

News Flash: "the only great composers are dead German composers."

Ummm, no. They are actually Austrian (either by birth or by adoption). 

[ComposerOfAvantGarde]

Ummm, no. They are actually Austrian (either by birth or by adoption). 

Right you are, sir: Schoenberg, Berg, Webern, Wellesz, Krenek, Cerha, Furrer, Haas, Neuwirth

[Monsieur Croche]

Right you are, sir: Schoenberg, Berg, Webern, Wellesz, Krenek, Cerha, Furrer, Haas, Neuwirth

...must be something in that pure and rarified Alpen water they drink.
Hmmm, marketing idea!

[Ten thumbs]

As with all the arts, composers today have to compete with an ever increasing body of music from the past. To create something that is at least distinguishable therefore becomes ever more difficult and it is easy to be tempted into experimental fields that have no appeal whatsoever to the listener. We see this also in the visual arts, where artists imagine that if they display something 'new' they have achieved something. Sadly, most of the time, this is not the case but, fortunately, there are exceptions. I don't think the difficulty of the task should put off those who feel the cause from continuing the search.