Sir William Walton

[vandermolen]

I haven't spent a whole lot of time with the 2nd symphony, Jeffrey, so I don't really have anything to add other than I should get to know it better. I guess one reason why I feel the slow movement is weak in the 1st stems from what I believe could've been something emotionally earth-shattering, but it's almost like like Walton coped out and went for something that was in a way 'anti-climatic'. What would you say? Anyway, I just feel this movement meanders too much and simply doesn't deliver 'the goods' so to speak.

I rather agree with you John. Apparently Walton originally intended it or part of it as the opening movement. I think that it works within the Symphony but I don't find it as moving as the slow movement of the Second Symphony.

[Mirror Image]

I rather agree with you John. Apparently Walton originally intended it or part of it as the opening movement. I think that it works within the Symphony but I don't find it as moving as the slow movement of the Second Symphony.

I will say that I'm agreement with you that Walton's 1st is one of the great 20th Century symphonies and certainly one of the finest British symphonies ever written.

[Roasted Swan]

Trawling around YouTube (which is a remarkable resource for uploaded rare performances isn't it!) here is a live Previn/LSO Walton 1 from the 1970 Proms.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xr3WVje-C3o

The sound is fairly scrawny but this must be the most aggressive/brutal Walton 1.  Some rough edges to the playing but goodness me it blazes - in the hall it must have been simply overwhelming.......

[vandermolen]

Trawling around YouTube (which is a remarkable resource for uploaded rare performances isn't it!) here is a live Previn/LSO Walton 1 from the 1970 Proms.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xr3WVje-C3o

The sound is fairly scrawny but this must be the most aggressive/brutal Walton 1.  Some rough edges to the playing but goodness me it blazes - in the hall it must have been simply overwhelming.......

Sounds, from the first few minutes, like a fine performance and yet, at the start, that oboe passage is just as 'matter-of-fact' as in his famous recording. The fragility and vulnerability there is far better realised IMO by Boult, Sargent, Thomson, Harty and Brabbins in their recordings.

[Dry Brett Kavanaugh]

Sounds, from the first few minutes, like a fine performance and yet, at the start, that oboe passage is just as 'matter-of-fact' as in his famous recording. The fragility and vulnerability there is far better realised IMO by Boult, Sargent, Thomson, Harty and Brabbins in their recordings.

Do you mean sort of being ominous, prophetic, and/or ghostly? I will check the performance later. I am listening to the Judd disc every day and I love it.

[Roasted Swan]

Do you mean sort of being ominous, prophetic, and/or ghostly? I will check the performance later. I am listening to the Judd disc every day and I love it.

I suppose we all create a kind of personal narrative for a piece of music that helps articulate the 'meaning' we find in it.  Personally I do not conceive of the opening oboe theme as fragile.  Instead I think the whole movement as one enormous arc of driven certainty starting from quiet determination through to final exultant resolution.  There are obstacles and hindrances along the way but the ultimate goal in somehow never in doubt.  But the joy of any great piece is that it will respond to a variety of interpretations. 

Here's another(!) very fine YouTube live performance - this time in Gothenburg.  The recording here is very good indeed at revealing the inner complexities of Walton's astonishing contrapuntal writing.  Just a couple of moments when I think the conductor lets the emotional leash relax when it should get ever tighter.  That for me is the key - the sense of something racheting up from first bar to last........

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mWMV-fMZqT0

[Mirror Image]

Here's another(!) very fine YouTube live performance - this time in Gothenburg.  The recording here is very good indeed at revealing the inner complexities of Walton's astonishing contrapuntal writing.  Just a couple of moments when I think the conductor lets the emotional leash relax when it should get ever tighter.  That for me is the key - the sense of something racheting up from first bar to last........

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mWMV-fMZqT0

The first comment on this YouTube video are interesting:

Easily goes into my Top 3 of the greatest symphonies ever composed. The closing seconds of the 1st movement are mind-blowing. The 2nd movement so 'malicious', the third a profound meditation on loss, the 4th a triumphant surge of renewed faith in life and love.

[Mirror Image]

I'm going to have to revisit that Previn/LSO performance again. I do think it's an outstanding performance despite Jeffrey's own reservations about it.

[Mirror Image]

Cross-posted from the 'Listening' thread -

The 1st:





Such a scintillating performance. This newer Japan remaster sounds superb.

I have to say in this particular Previn/LSO performance that I feel the 'weak' slow movement is handled with passion and there's a real sense of resignation about this music that I didn't quite hear before. I'm appreciating this movement more right now than I ever have in the past. Also, the last movement doesn't feel 'tacked on' at all. It feels like a completely natural conclusion to what is a turbulent work, but this movement allows us to hear the joy and exuberance in Walton again. Anyway, the 1st is a masterpiece warts and all. I adore it.

[Mirror Image]

Cross-posted from the 'Listening' thread -

Violin Concerto



This is my first time listening to this Little/Litton performance of the VC. Sounds promising so far. I've always appreciated Little's musicianship, especially in British music. Again, I don't understand Jeffrey's opinion of this concerto. I think it's bloody marvelous!

Here's another Walton work that I just love. The thing about all of Walton's concerti is their unusual structuring, although I remember the Viola Concerto have a more traditional formal scheme. I'd say the only concerto I have trouble with is the Cello Concerto, but even now, I'm beginning to understand more than I have in the past. It's kind of a gnarly sounding work.

[Dry Brett Kavanaugh]

Cross-posted from the 'Listening' thread -

Here's another Walton work that I just love. The thing about all of Walton's concerti is their unusual structuring, although I remember the Viola Concerto have a more traditional formal scheme. I'd say the only concerto I have trouble with is the Cello Concerto, but even now, I'm beginning to understand more than I have in the past. It's kind of a gnarly sounding work.

Good set with elegant performances. Thank you for the recommendation.

[Dry Brett Kavanaugh]

Sounds, from the first few minutes, like a fine performance and yet, at the start, that oboe passage is just as 'matter-of-fact' as in his famous recording. The fragility and vulnerability there is far better realised IMO by Boult, Sargent, Thomson, Harty and Brabbins in their recordings.

It seems to me that the rhythmic foundation of Thomson's rendition is fabulous and consistent.

[Irons]

I'm going to have to revisit that Previn/LSO performance again. I do think it's an outstanding performance despite Jeffrey's own reservations about it.

Jeffrey doesn't need me me in his corner but I do agree up to a point. Previn is an exciting performance as he gives it both barrels, but in a way that is the weakness. Sargent - my favourite recording - is far better in the opening. To my (cloth) ears Previn is building tension - hold on this is going to be good, which it is. Sargent's opening is a cry of anguish.

https://youtu.be/ZDEjY_84ROM

[Mirror Image]

Jeffrey doesn't need me me in his corner but I do agree up to a point. Previn is an exciting performance as he gives it both barrels, but in a way that is the weakness. Sargent - my favourite recording - is far better in the opening. To my (cloth) ears Previn is building tension - hold on this is going to be good, which it is. Sargent's opening is a cry of anguish.

https://youtu.be/ZDEjY_84ROM

I've heard a lot of Walton 1st performances. Many of them have a lot of merit. What I like about Previn isn't necessarily the individual moments (and I'm sure there are many that one could point out), but his vision in understanding the entire arc of the symphony, which is something many conductors have lost sight of. Previn makes everything sound coherent and purposeful. Like for example, I don't think I've ever responded to the slow movement like I have in Previn's performance. Sometimes I feel that some conductors by the time they reach the last movement have kind of lost their way, but with Previn, I didn't feel this at all.

[Irons]

I've heard a lot of Walton 1st performances. Many of them have a lot of merit. What I like about Previn isn't necessarily the individual moments (and I'm sure there are many that one could point out), but his vision in understanding the entire arc of the symphony, which is something many conductors have lost sight of. Previn makes everything sound coherent and purposeful. Like for example, I don't think I've ever responded to the slow movement like I have in Previn's performance. Sometimes I feel that some conductors by the time they reach the last movement have kind of lost their way, but with Previn, I didn't feel this at all.

Good comments, well put and you are right Previn gets me out of my listening chair in the last movement. Unlike you I have not heard lots of other recordings of this great symphony, just Previn and Sargent. There was another on ASV which I didn't like at all, *I have forgotten by whom. Listen if you have spare time to the way Sargent builds to the climax of the first movement. Very impressive.

*Handley

[Roasted Swan]

I've heard a lot of Walton 1st performances. Many of them have a lot of merit. What I like about Previn isn't necessarily the individual moments (and I'm sure there are many that one could point out), but his vision in understanding the entire arc of the symphony, which is something many conductors have lost sight of. Previn makes everything sound coherent and purposeful. Like for example, I don't think I've ever responded to the slow movement like I have in Previn's performance. Sometimes I feel that some conductors by the time they reach the last movement have kind of lost their way, but with Previn, I didn't feel this at all.

I'm with you liking Previn's control of the arc of the work - I mentioned a similar thing in an earlier post.  In Malcolm Hayes' book "The selected letters of William Walton" he quotes the composer writing to Walter Legge re Sargent & Previn which were both released at the same time although the Previn was recorded a couple of months earlier; "... both recordings are very good, naturally in parts one is better than the other, but on the whole [Previn] is the best.  What a "pasticcio" after all those years to bring out both at the same time."

[Dry Brett Kavanaugh]

I suppose we all create a kind of personal narrative for a piece of music that helps articulate the 'meaning' we find in it.  Personally I do not conceive of the opening oboe theme as fragile.  Instead I think the whole movement as one enormous arc of driven certainty starting from quiet determination through to final exultant resolution.  There are obstacles and hindrances along the way but the ultimate goal in somehow never in doubt.  But the joy of any great piece is that it will respond to a variety of interpretations. 

Here's another(!) very fine YouTube live performance - this time in Gothenburg.  The recording here is very good indeed at revealing the inner complexities of Walton's astonishing contrapuntal writing.  Just a couple of moments when I think the conductor lets the emotional leash relax when it should get ever tighter.  That for me is the key - the sense of something racheting up from first bar to last........

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mWMV-fMZqT0

Both the two performances are fine, but the Previn live is exceptional. The performance is electrifying and dynamic. It's astonishing. I will look for his Telarc issue.

The below is The Guardian's review on the No. 1:

https://www.theguardian.com/music/tomserviceblog/2014/apr/01/symphony-guide-william-walton-first?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

[Mirror Image]

Both the two performances are fine, but the Previn live is exceptional. The performance is electrifying and dynamic. It's astonishing. I will look for his Telarc issue.

The below is The Guardian's review on the No. 1:

https://www.theguardian.com/music/tomserviceblog/2014/apr/01/symphony-guide-william-walton-first?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

I wouldn't waste you time with Previn's remake on Telarc. I felt that performance to be rather lackluster compared to his earlier one on RCA.

[Mirror Image]

Good comments, well put and you are right Previn gets me out of my listening chair in the last movement. Unlike you I have not heard lots of other recordings of this great symphony, just Previn and Sargent. There was another on ASV which I didn't like at all, *I have forgotten by whom. Listen if you have spare time to the way Sargent builds to the climax of the first movement. Very impressive.

*Handley

Thanks. I would definitely try to hear more performanaces if you can. The Thomson is quite good (I recall Jeffrey liking this one rather well). I'm also a fan of the Colin Davis LSO Live performance and I'm not a huge fan of his conducting in general, but I think this performance was rather good.

I'm with you liking Previn's control of the arc of the work - I mentioned a similar thing in an earlier post.  In Malcolm Hayes' book "The selected letters of William Walton" he quotes the composer writing to Walter Legge re Sargent & Previn which were both released at the same time although the Previn was recorded a couple of months earlier; "... both recordings are very good, naturally in parts one is better than the other, but on the whole [Previn] is the best.  What a "pasticcio" after all those years to bring out both at the same time."

I haven't heard Sargent's performance of the 1st. I own it, but I haven't got around to it. I should rectify that.

[vandermolen]

This nice boxed set restored Sargent's recording of Symphony No.1 after many years of absence. If I say so myself, and at the risk of seeming more of a big head that usual, it was partly due to me. I pestered my nice contact at EMI to reissue the Sargent and also suggested some other music for the boxed set, including Fremaux's great disc of the marches, Gloria, Te Deum etc and the Nigel Kennedy Violin and Viola concertos. He even very kindly gave me a credit in the booklet. The only release by a major company that I have had anything to do with: