Nighttime vs. daytime listening

[Bogey]

On some days, not all, I enjoy music while working in the yard.  For example I had some Mozart piped outside today while I took care of some brush piles.  I do not like having headphones on so I can hear our kids and the birds at the feeders while I do yard work.  No intent listening, just some nice added ambiance to help make my chores seem more palatable on a beautiful Colorado day.

[Coopmv]

I listened to disc 1 from this set late last night through my headphones.  I have never listened to any symphonies through headsets before.  The program on this disc includes Symphonies 1 and 3.  For some reasons, I really like #3 even though I was never a fan of this symphony.  It is not clear if it was the performance or it was the headphones that added the extra ambiance?

[Grazioso]

How many times and in how many ways do how many different people here have to patiently explain that enjoying music without giving it one's full attention does NOT preclude also listening to music while giving it full attention when desired?  Why is this concept so difficult for some to grasp?  It ain't rocket science.

We get that. But how many times and in how many ways do how many different people here have to patiently explain that enjoying music with giving it one's full attention is the more rewarding approach and the one better suited to something as deep and complex as classical music? If you approach anything with one-pointed attention, where you fully immerse yourself in it (again, not the same as intellectual analysis), you can gain a much richer, more memorable experience. To intentionally divide your attention to where you're only half listening to great artistic masterpieces seems like a wasted opportunity at best.

Someone used the example of walking into a bookstore where they're playing Yo-Yo Ma's version of the Bach cello suites. Well, it's one thing to walk into a store and find music playing, will you or nill you, another entirely to be at home and intentionally to turn on Bach as background Muzak instead of giving the music/yourself/the experience its full due by actually paying attention. One would be better served in life by increasing one's focus instead of consciously dulling it.

I listened to disc 1 from this set late last night through my headphones.  I have never listened to any symphonies through headsets before.  The program on this disc includes Symphonies 1 and 3.  For some reasons, I really like #3 even though I was never a fan of this symphony.  It is not clear if it was the performance or it was the headphones that added the extra ambiance?

Headphones can definitely add an extra level of immersion. Unfortunately, I had to quit using mine because my stereo is apparently haunted From time to time, the volume maxes out on its own, which would be really bad news with phones on!

[Coopmv]

Headphones can definitely add an extra level of immersion. Unfortunately, I had to quit using mine because my stereo is apparently haunted From time to time, the volume maxes out on its own, which would be really bad news with phones on!

No, you don't want to join the rank of LvB too early ...   

[DavidRoss]

We get that.

Apparently not, because you are still taking issue with it and then arguing a proposition that no one here has disputed.

[ChamberNut]

I listened to disc 1 from this set late last night through my headphones.  I have never listened to any symphonies through headsets before.  The program on this disc includes Symphonies 1 and 3.  For some reasons, I really like #3 even though I was never a fan of this symphony.  It is not clear if it was the performance or it was the headphones that added the extra ambiance?

Coop, so glad to hear you unwrapped that boxset, and enjoyed the 3rd! 

[Wanderer]

This is a pseudo-dilemma, really. It goes without saying that one's going to listen to music with his undivided attention as often as possible; but there inevitably come times when one's going to listen to music while doing other things that don't necessarily distract a great deal from it - to deny that's still good is nonsense. Getting (better) acquainted with unfamiliar or disliked works in order to pave the way for more focused listening sessions later, that's where I find the most use for multitasking listening. To refuse to listen to music at all in these situations under pseudo-elitist, purist pretenses is merely being recalcitrant.
The bottom line as I see it is that a person who doesn't consider his every single session of listening to music as a sacred ritual ends up listening to and appreciating more music in the long run whereas those who only listen when conditions are just perfect and every single distraction eliminated are inevitably depriving themselves of a lot of listening time.

[Grazioso]

This is a pseudo-dilemma, really. It goes without saying that one's going to listen to music with his undivided attention as often as possible

For many people, listening while jogging, driving, doing homework, etc. is their standard approach. I've mentioned to others how I love music and will sit and just listen to it, and they look at me like I'm from Mars.

To refuse to listen to music at all in these situations under pseudo-elitist, purist pretenses is merely being recalcitrant.

That I agree with. But what I'm talking about has nothing to do with elitism or pretense, but rather an acknowledgment that there are various ways to approach things, some better than others. I try to take the better approach with things I care about, such as music. I've found it vastly better in life--on all fronts--to cultivate single-pointed focus since every experience can become far richer, intense, and more memorable when you're fully absorbed in it and not letting your thoughts and emotions jump all over the place and control you instead of vice versa. As such, when I sit down with a book, a piece of music, a movie, or whatever, if I find I'm not focusing for whatever reason and can't bring myself to focus, I'll set it aside and come back to it another time when I'm in a more attuned and receptive state so I can really get something out of my time with it. When you only half experience a piece of art, it's no longer worth being called art, but is rather just something to pass the time. I want to really hear Beethoven and Mozart, not reduce them to sonic wallpaper while I try to accomplish other things.

The bottom line as I see it is that a person who doesn't consider his every single session of listening to music as a sacred ritual ends up listening to and appreciating more music in the long run whereas those who only listen when conditions are just perfect and every single distraction eliminated are inevitably depriving themselves of a lot of listening time.

You might end up listening more over the long haul, but I disagree about appreciating it more. Based on my past experience, times I spent half listening while doing other things at worst detracted from my enjoyment and understanding of the music precisely because it was turned into a surfeit of background noise. At best, it was merely time wasted since I neither focused on nor remembered either task or experience well and ultimately failed to get what I might out of them. And really, in the years since I started trying to pay real attention to music, I've listened to a huge amount of it without being curtailed in any way

No, you don't want to join the rank of LvB too early ...

I was listening to Mahler 6 last night, and those hammer blows in the finale were strikingly loud over speakers--through phones at max volume, it would have been like gunshots in a concrete room...what?...what?!

[orbital]

Point taken.  But wouldn't you agree that by not giving music your full attention, you may miss some important subtleties?  If you listen to it enough times in the background, I'm sure it will all eventually sink in...but thats an inefficient approach.  There are also some pieces which you may never be able to appreciate without intense listening and analysis.  Art can be challenging and great, and in many cases the two are not mutually exclusive.  Intellectual stimulation is one of the reasons to love concert music.

But I am not interested in the challenges art provides. I enjoy listening to music, and I am not expecting anything more out of it. That's how I treat music (and most other things in life  ) My number one priority is to derive enjoyment, everything else comes second.
That is not to say that I don't listen to music exclusively with my undivided attention. I spent a better part of yesterday doing just that in fact. But the purpose was not any different. I wasn't listening to music to unravel the secrets or the structural development of the Enescu sonatas, my only interest was to flow with his sound palette.
This may be a superficial approach for a lot of people, but I can't have it any other way. Whenever other aspects of music/arts start to come on top of enjoyment, my interest and time I voluntarily devote goes down accordingly.

[Anne]

I'd love to listen to Bernstein's Mahler while going to sleep at night but have finally admitted I cannot.  The dynamic range is so great that either I cannot hear the quiet parts or get blasted out of bed by the loud parts.

Regarding the discussion of partial concentration of music while doing something else, if I  cannot give it my full attention, it is a waste of time for me to put it on the cd player.  Honestly, I do not hear the music at all when doing something else.  it's just the way I focus.  My mother reprimanded me as a teenager for not picking up my baby sister who was crying in the adjoining room.  I had been reading a book and truly had not heard her.

[Bogey]

  My mother reprimanded me as a teenager for not picking up my baby sister who was crying in the adjoining room.  I had been reading a book and truly had not heard her.

Our son is like that when reading.  My wife went to pick him up the other day in his 4th grade classroom.  It was chaos as all the kids were getting their things as the bell rang.  She observed our son walking from his desk to the coat rack without once taking his eyes away from the book as he wove his way in and out of the kiddos.  He continued reading totally oblivious to his surroundings.  We actually applauded it, though we can kind of see your mom had a point too, Anne. 

[Rod Corkin]

I'd love to listen to Bernstein's Mahler while going to sleep at night but have finally admitted I cannot.  The dynamic range is so great that either I cannot hear the quiet parts or get blasted out of bed by the loud parts.

I hope you found the dynamic range of the Tamerlano extracts to your satisfaction Anne...

[DavidRoss]

Bill--that ability (or compulsion!) to "hyperfocus" can be a very valuable asset, but it can paradoxically be a sign of "ADD."  (Referring to that constellation of traits and abilities as a "disorder" is prejudicial from the get-go, isn't it?  No wonder kids thus gifted can have a hard time in school.  Tough enough for hunters to fit among the farmers without labeling them as "disordered.")

Anne--funny you should mention that.  Just last night I was having some trouble falling asleep so I put some music on, but softly, and as usual drifted right off to dreamland.  (Maybe the problem is Bernstein...have you tried Rattle? )  On the other hand, I can be oblivious to many things while reading (just ask my wife!) but not music--it keeps grabbing my attention and pulling me in.

[Anne]

I hope you found the dynamic range of the Tamerlano extracts to your satisfaction Anne...

Hi Rod,

It was quite late at night when I went looking for the various pieces of music from Tamerlano.  I was primarily collecting the locations of the music to help me decide whether my next composer to study would be Bach or Handel.  I had planned to listen to the extracts at a later time which has not been in great supply lately.

[Anne]

Our son is like that when reading.  My wife went to pick him up the other day in his 4th grade classroom.  It was chaos as all the kids were getting their things as the bell rang.  She observed our son walking from his desk to the coat rack without once taking his eyes away from the book as he wove his way in and out of the kiddos.  He continued reading totally oblivious to his surroundings.  We actually applauded it, though we can kind of see your mom had a point too, Anne. 

Yes, I agree.  Only I knew for sure whether I had heard the baby or not.  I can understand my mother's vexation with me.

[DavidW]

Bill--that ability (or compulsion!) to "hyperfocus" can be a very valuable asset, but it can paradoxically be a sign of "ADD."  (Referring to that constellation of traits and abilities as a "disorder" is prejudicial from the get-go, isn't it?  No wonder kids thus gifted can have a hard time in school.  Tough enough for hunters to fit among the farmers without labeling them as "disordered.")

I have a student that has ADD running through his family, and even if he isn't officially diagnosed with it (unlike his brother), he sometimes hyperfocuses on one task, such as completing a picture just right and neglects everything else on tests (when he doesn't mean to)!   Alot of people throw around having ADD, when they really mean they are easily distracted when they are bored.  But seeing something closer to the real deal was a bit jarring.