Unpopular Opinions

[Ken B]

Geez. I thought I had a clear thread-winner with my James post. But orfeo and Florestan have smoked me.

[Madiel]

Ha. MY opinion is so unpopular, even I don't hold it.

[Madiel]

It's a race to the bottom.

[PerfectWagnerite]

I have shit taste in music 

You don't say...

[Ken B]

I have shit taste in music

This is the UNpopular opinion thread!

[Madiel]

I'm not sure it belongs in this thread as it's not a public consensus opinion but anyway, I was thinking about this on the bus back from my lecture this morning:

There isn't much pre-20th century music that is deeply emotionally, sentimentally or nostalgically significant to me, there just isn't (there is a little early music + some late romantic but that is only it).

*shrug*

This is true of a lot of people, although most of them don't hang out on classical music forums.

[kishnevi]

I'm not sure it belongs in this thread as it's not a public consensus opinion but anyway, I was thinking about this on the bus back from my lecture this morning:

There isn't much pre-20th century music that is deeply emotionally, sentimentally or nostalgically significant to me, there just isn't (there is a little early music + some late romantic but that is only it).

You are young. Don't be surprised if, twenty or thirty years from now, your view of 18th and 19th century music has changed completely.

Or maybe not. These things are deeply personal, and vary enormously from person to person.

[Ken B]

But 20th century classical/western "art"-music? what about those people? do they have anywhere to hang and chill? 

Here. You won't be turfed out for preferring Xenakis to Schubert. Damned for all eternity perhaps, but not turfed out. 

[Madiel]

But 20th century classical/western "art"-music? what about those people? do they have anywhere to hang and chill? 

The internet has places to hang out for people who like to dress up as giant furry animals. I'm sure it can manage fans of 20th Century art music.

[Jo498]

From what I understand, people usually return to the music of their formative years by their middle age (which is usually what they're most nostalgic and sentimental about). For a large majority of older classical fans, it tends to be the music of composers from those centuries (often being stereotypically one of the "three B's").

Most classical listeners do not "return" to the music of their teenage years. Rather, they started listening to classical in these years and never stopped listening to classical since then. Because classical encompasses a lot of different music they might listen to rather different stuff in their 50s than in their late teens, or they might not.

But this is a very different situation from browsing one's highschool yearbooks and listening to the music you heard on you first date or graduation party or whatever and waxing nostalgic.
Regardless of genre, I believe that quite a few people largely stick to or at least remain very fond of the music they heard in their teens and twenties. So here one also has to distinguish between nostalgia and having one's tastes formed in that time.

[Madiel]

I have a track record of having a certain disdain for composers like Mozart for instance but but I have quite a few Wolfgang cds in my collection despite that, for example.

And this means what? Do you want to get credit for this?

You can collect whatever CDs you like. If you choose to collect music that you don't actually like much, well it's your money to waste but I wouldn't applaud you for it. If it's music that you do like, then your "certain disdain" is a front.

[Pat B]

And this means what? Do you want to get credit for this?

You can collect whatever CDs you like. If you choose to collect music that you don't actually like much, well it's your money to waste but I wouldn't applaud you for it. If it's music that you do like, then your "certain disdain" is a front.

That seems harsh. Years ago I got rid of some CDs that I now wish I had kept, because my appreciation of the music eventually grew.

[Brian]

I'm with Pat - there's music I'm just now discovering that I love, that has been in my collection for years. (Maybe because the coupling was good, or because it was in a Big Box, or because I figured eventually I'd like it.) It's like making an investment - except that you can only lose some time, not more money.

Perhaps the biggest example is Bach. I bought a bunch starting out because he's so famous, and then only really liked Brandenburg No. 3. Thought the rest was dry and rote. Now that I've changed my mind, it's nice to have a bunch of good Bach around!

[Madiel]

That seems harsh. Years ago I got rid of some CDs that I now wish I had kept, because my appreciation of the music eventually grew.

But that doesn't seem to be what is being said here. It's not expressed as a past disdain for Mozart. Nor is it expressed as having bought Mozart CDs in the past but now having a disdain for Mozart.

I'm sure it's possible for it to be cleared up, but right now what I'm reading is two present-tense statements: I express disdain for Mozart, and/but I own Mozart CDs.

I don't know if this is a misguided attempt to demonstrate a lack of bias, because I've witnessed many examples of people having learned that "discrimination is bad" and then applying that idea indiscriminately to categories it was never meant to be applied to.  Discrimination is bad when it's applied to for no reason, such as choosing between people based on skin colour or gender when the relevant consideration is employable skills. But when it comes to one's own music collection, one's own personal and subjective decisions are the only criteria.

[Pat B]

But that doesn't seem to be what is being said here. It's not expressed as a past disdain for Mozart. Nor is it expressed as having bought Mozart CDs in the past but now having a disdain for Mozart.

I'm sure it's possible for it to be cleared up, but right now what I'm reading is two present-tense statements: I express disdain for Mozart, and/but I own Mozart CDs.

My read was that Neila was accounting for the possibility that he might not disdain Mozart in the future.

As for money, it's possible that he paid little or nothing for those CDs, and/or that he would get little or nothing for culling them.

His post just didn't strike me as controversial, or warranting a demand for further explanation.

[Madiel]

My read was that Neila was accounting for the possibility that he might not disdain Mozart in the future.

Which, if the disdain is real, baffles me utterly as a purchasing decision.

I might well buy music that I'm not totally certain I like, not least if I don't know it well, but it at least has to be something that interests me.*** I am simply mystified by the proposition that one would collect something one has a negative attitude towards.

But I would much prefer to hear from the original author, not the interpretation of others.


***For example, this was part of my motivation with Per Nørgård's symphonies.

[Ken B]

Which, if the disdain is real, baffles me utterly as a purchasing decision.

I might well buy music that I'm not totally certain I like, not least if I don't know it well, but it at least has to be something that interests me.*** I am simply mystified by the proposition that one would collect something one has a negative attitude towards.

But I would much prefer to hear from the original author, not the interpretation of others.


***For example, this was part of my motivation with Per Nørgård's symphonies.

Guys. I think Alien meant, "look it's not as if I haven't listened to the music. I gave it what I think is a fair shot, I bought some and listened a few times. I dislike it."
That's reasonable isn't it?
It's even sensible if you substitute Webern for Mozart

[Karl Henning]

The internet has places to hang out for people who like to dress up as giant furry animals.

I thought I recognized you over there.


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[Pat B]

Which, if the disdain is real, baffles me utterly as a purchasing decision.

I might well buy music that I'm not totally certain I like, not least if I don't know it well, but it at least has to be something that interests me.*** I am simply mystified by the proposition that one would collect something one has a negative attitude towards.

But I would much prefer to hear from the original author, not the interpretation of others.

There are any number of uninteresting possible explanations for why he might have gotten them initially. Maybe they were in box sets that he bought for other contents. Maybe he received them as gifts. Maybe he bought them in support of his studies. Maybe he bought them before spotify. Maybe he believed he would want them in the future. Maybe he liked Mozart then more than he does now. Or maybe he'll have some explanation that is interesting.

I don't object to your curiosity. I just really didn't like the hostility in your initial response.

[Florestan]

I just really didn't like the hostility in your initial response.

I'm puzzled, too. He's usually calm and relaxed.