Unpopular Opinions

[Mahlerian]

If you concentrate more on something, it's away from other things. It's math.

There's plenty of math that doesn't work that way.  You're thinking of a zero-sum game, which music certainly is not.

[Baron Scarpia]

There's plenty of math that doesn't work that way.  You're thinking of a zero-sum game, which music certainly is not.

If he is talking about attention paid it is a zero sum game, since there are only so many hours in the day. If you pay more attention to one composer, you pay less to all of the others.

I decided to listen to Saint-Saens PC's, but after getting through two I decided to listen to Martinu symphonies, after getting through three I decided to listen to Tansman symphonies, after getting through three I decided to listen to listen to Milhaud symphonies, after listening to four I decided to listen to Beethoven String Quartets. Now I'm on Beethoven Piano Sonatas. Never got back to Saint-Saens PC's, no disrespect to Saint-Saens.

[Mahlerian]

If he is talking about attention paid it is a zero sum game, since there are only so many hours in the day. If you pay more attention to one composer, you pay less to all of the others.

I decided to listen to Saint-Saens PC's, but after getting through two I decided to listen to Martinu symphonies, after getting through three I decided to listen to Tansman symphonies, after getting through three I decided to listen to listen to Milhaud symphonies, after listening to four I decided to listen to Beethoven String Quartets. Now I'm on Beethoven Piano Sonatas. Never got back to Saint-Saens PC's, no disrespect to Saint-Saens.

True enough, but that wasn't the context under discussion.  The original context was that Telemann should be talked about less in order to make way for discussion of Fasch and Graupner.  When I was in high school, the number of composers I could reasonably discuss was limited to a handful, maybe about a dozen.  Today, my horizons have greatly expanded, and I can say more about many others than I could have about those dozen back then, but perhaps surprisingly, this makes it possible to say even more about those few, not less.  If I can write about Rameau's music or Fux's in addition to that of Bach, Handel, and Vivaldi, then that just gives me more to say about the latter through their relation to the former.

Like I said, music is not itself a zero-sum game, though as you said there are limited ways in which consumption of it can be construed as one.

[Baron Scarpia]

Like I said, music is not itself a zero-sum game, though as you said there are limited ways in which consumption of it can be construed as one.

Limited way, such as the concept of time...

[Mahlerian]

Limited way, such as the concept of time...

Which is not directly correlated to other measures of art consumption, such as engagement.  One brings one's entire listening history and knowledge of music into play when listening to a piece, and this is something that only grows, rather than growing and shrinking as priorities shift.

So even consumption of music is only a zero-sum game in limited ways.

[Florestan]

Culture isn't math.

Nor is it a zero-sum game.

EDIT: I see Mahlerian beat me to it, and also made other salient points.

[Jo498]

If not some musicians and listeners had prevailed playing Telemann (and not only/mainly Bach and Handel), lesser known German composers like Graupner or Fasch would be even more obscure than they actually are. Sure, if one play Telemann one cannot play something else at the same time. (So it is zero sum in that restricted, rather trivial sense.)
But the historical path leading to the fact that there are any Fasch recordings at all, probably involved some people editing/playing/listening Telemann.

[Florestan]

If not some musicians and listeners had prevailed playing Telemann (and not only/mainly Bach and Handel), lesser known German composers like Graupner or Fasch would be even more obscure than they actually are. Sure, if one play Telemann one cannot play something else at the same time. (So it is zero sum in that restricted, rather trivial sense.)
But the historical path leading to the fact that there are any Fasch recordings at all, probably involved some people editing/playing/listening Telemann.

This.

For 71dB's information, Fasch and Graupner are well represented in my library and I have appreciated them as positively as I have Telemann. I just find the notion that talking less about the latter is a necessary step in making the former two better known deeply misguided.

[Ken B]

Time spent is a zero sum game. More reading X, less reading Y. So that is indisputable. But the importance of a work in one's life is not proportional to the amount of time spent on it. I used to listen to the Goldbergs endlessly. Now maybe twice a year. But they are still an important part of my musical experience and education. I can explore Spohr without losing the Goldbergs. But I cannot explore Spohr and Graupner both, that really is zero sum.

So it is zero sum in some ways but not in all.

In short, you are all wrong

[Mahlerian]

Time spent is a zero sum game. More reading X, less reading Y. So that is indisputable. But the importance of a work in one's life is not proportional to the amount of time spent on it. I used to listen to the Goldbergs endlessly. Now maybe twice a year. But they are still an important part of my musical experience and education. I can explore Spohr without losing the Goldbergs. But I cannot explore Spohr and Graupner both, that really is zero sum.

So it is zero sum in some ways but not in all.

In short, you are all wrong

Given that that's more or less exactly the same point I made...I'm wondering how I can be both wrong and right on it at the same time.

[71 dB]

This.

For 71dB's information, Fasch and Graupner are well represented in my library and I have appreciated them as positively as I have Telemann. I just find the notion that talking less about the latter is a necessary step in making the former two better known deeply misguided.

Noted. It's how it works, relative promotion.

[Baron Scarpia]

This.

For 71dB's information, Fasch and Graupner are well represented in my library and I have appreciated them as positively as I have Telemann. I just find the notion that talking less about the latter is a necessary step in making the former two better known deeply misguided.

Deeply misguided? 71dB made his comments in reference to "talking about" and "concentrating on." One takes finite time, and attention is a finite resource which perhaps the most valuable thing we have. They are both zero-sum. If you talk about something, you have less time to talk about something else, if you devote attention to something, you have less time to devote attention to something else. For instance, the attention you have devoted to fault-finding with 71dB has reduced the talking time and attention you have available for Fasch and Graupner, whatever that is.

[Florestan]

Deeply misguided? 71dB made his comments in reference to "talking about" and "concentrating on." One takes finite time, and attention is a finite resource which perhaps the most valuable thing we have. They are both zero-sum. If you talk about something, you have less time to talk about something else, if you devote attention to something, you have less time to devote attention to something else.

I'm absolutely fine with 71dB talking less about Telemann and more about Fasch and Graupner. But he formulated it in such a way as to imply that everybody else should do that, in order to redress the balance. That's wrong.

For instance, the attention you have devoted to fault-finding with 71dB has reduced the talking time and attention you have available for Fasch and Graupner, whatever that is.

Pot calling the kettle black. 

[Florestan]

Noted. It's how it works, relative promotion.

No, it's not how it works. Telemann's revival has been brought about by talking about him and recording his music, all the while JS Bach was being talked about and recorded at least as much as before.

[ComposerOfAvantGarde]

I hate maths

[North Star]

I hate maths

Wrong thread, unfortunately.

[Florestan]

I hate maths

Maths is more vast than China. Which part of it do you hate specifically?

[aleazk]

I hate maths

Yes, it's common to hate what one doesn't understand... 

[Karl Henning]

Ouch!

[Crudblud]

I'm indifferent towards maths. I didn't like doing it at school, but then I didn't like school at all.