The Men's Rights Movement

[Geo Dude]

If the women in my life are waging war on me, they have deployed the weaponry of love. Frightfully shrewd!

[lisa needs braces]

Thank God for web archives.

The original "Life of Julia" slide show by the Obama campaign:

http://tinyurl.com/ms2p6cl

No men in Julia's life.

[Sammy]

Thank God for web archives.

The original "Life of Julia" slide show by the Obama campaign:

http://tinyurl.com/ms2p6cl

No men in Julia's life.

Sounds like Julia will have a better life than you, and she don't need no man to do it.

[lisa needs braces]

Actually, Julia is depending on taxes extracted from men. Obamacare, for instance, is a bachelor tax.

[Sammy]

Actually, Julia is depending on taxes extracted from men.

Men - the gift that never stops giving.

[lisa needs braces]

Men - the gift that never stops giving.

Lol.

[lisa needs braces]

A random insightful blog comment I found by a guy named novaseeker. He's talking about the concept of "hypergamy," defined here:

http://badgerhut.wordpress.com/2011/04/30/wtf-is-hypergamy-really/






I would say that there are a few reasons why men are so put-off by hypergamy.

The first is that many of us who are older than, say, 35, were raised with the idea that women are NOT like that, and that women tend to be good, naturally monogamous, faithful, and loyal *by nature* — unless the guy is a drunk, is an abuser, or is otherwise unsuitable, you'll be fine with women. My parents' advice to me when I was in my coming of age period in the late 1980s. It was already false then, because the sexual revolution, which increased options for women sexually and attractionally, allowed women to select mates more based on their natural hypergamy — and not based on things that my parents (and many others) encouraged in their male children like stability, reliability, sobriety and so on — the classic "loser/beta/boring" picture we see today. So when confronted with the (admittedly much less impressive) reality of female hypergamy, as compared with what we were taught women were like (and what we were taught they liked), dissonance ensues, followed closely by anger (based on point 2 below). You can see echoes of this in Devlin, a guy of my generation (roughly), when he says, with a noted wistful tone, that when women say they want men who are stable and kind and generous and like walks on the beach and so on, what they aren't saying is that these qualities are what they look for once a man is already "in their erotic field of view" (i.e., hypergamously attractive). There is a wistfulness there, and it relates to the sense of having lost something. To be quite honest, I would much prefer the world if women were more as my parents had described (including my mother, btw) rather than how they are, post-sexual revolution — and I suspect many men of my generation feel more or less the same.

The second reason is that under a regime of unfettered hypergamy, most guys are losers. This is certainly the way the casual sex market works, currently — great for the guys who are hypergamous targets of female attraction, but not so good for the guys who are not. The LTR market differs only somewhat — women do tend to downplay some of the more raw aspects of hypergamy when LTR hunting (like rampant shit testing, for example), but the damage is often already done. I think when you look at marriage rates among everyone other than the dual income dual professional set, you'll see that marriage is dying — probably because women are hypergamous, and the men who are the most hypergamously attractive in an LTR sense are also the men in the higher slice (and they have high marriage rates, unsurprisingly), but for the rest of the guys ... not so much. They just aren't hypgermously attractive enough to sustain high rates of marriage in these lower echelon groups, which is why we see fatherless growing and so on. But even leaving aside the broader social consequences, I think men viscerally figure out that the "fun part" of dating and mating in the 15-30 age range is dominated by unfettered female hypergamy, and that this is a game which, in that age range, most men lose. A lot of men don't like that, quite understandably.

The third reason relates to what happens later, and is alluded to in this post. Namely, the well disproportionate impact of female hypergamy on modern marriage. Marriage 2.0 is no longer about lifetime commitment, so you may as well throw that out — even if there are couples who do embrace that, we can't say with a straight face that this is what the institution is about, currently. Rather, currently, marriage is about self-actualization — what makes us happy, makes us feel content and fulfilled and so on. The problem here is that hypergamy undermines marital stability in ways that male straying (which is an equal betrayal, of course) simply does not. Hypergamy directly undermines a female's sense of happiness, contentedness and of being fulfilled unless her husband works his ass off constantly DHVing and Game-ing her to head-off her hypergamous impulses. This is a recipe for disaster, in particular, in the typical modern/equalist marriage. It's normal, in a marriage, for the attentions of one or both spouses to stray occasionally. However, when that happens with women, it almost always means she has checked out of the marriage and is looking for a replacement — which means it's much more of a direct hit at the marital relationship, no matter how you slice it. The fact that this behavior is subsidized by the family courts, and applauded by endless choruses of "You Go Girl!" in the culture only exacerbates the situation — it is not, however, the core issue. The core issue is that we have defined marriage to be about self-actualization, and in the context of women, that is most often going to NOT mean being "saddled with" a guy for whom, for whatever reason, her hypergamous tingle has faded. And*that* is reason three why men are off-put by hypergamy.

It strikes me that things worked better, overall, when hypergamy was more restricted. However, I realize that it isn't going back to that anytime soon. So, faced with that, men need to learn Game (which, in 2010, you need just as much in an LTR/marriage as you do in the club) or adjust to leading a female-free life. There really are only those two options, I think — and each of them is a good one for each kind of guy, really.


http://deansdale.wordpress.com/2010/09/22/about-hypergamy/#comment-329

[Wendell_E]

No men in Julia's life.

Maybe she stumbled across this thread.

[ibanezmonster]

Relative to this thread:



https://www.youtube.com/v/XDto2JLbzoA

[lisa needs braces]

This pro-marriage blogger was a male Registered Nurse from New Zealand (now living in New England) who has found some e-book success by publishing a guide for men in fixing their marriages. The material is on the same realist, un-pc wavelength as so called "red pill" relationship ideas, but he's compassionate to both genders.

http://marriedmansexlife.com/

[lisa needs braces]

It's not about the nail.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-4EDhdAHrOg

[ibanezmonster]

Nowadays I remain skeptical of everything involving "movements," but I was thinking about this VICE video where it was asserted that "women have more rights than men." (Notice the background music, not taking any of this seriously).

https://www.youtube.com/v/s6dC0AQ25xU

So I googled "do women have more rights than men?" On debate.org, I was surprised to see the consensus is 79% yes and 21% no. Scrolling down, the only argument I see for "no" is the "wage gap," something which has been debunked numerous times and is illegal, anyways.

http://www.debate.org/opinions/do-women-have-more-rights-than-men-in-todays-society


Just a general opinion that I've probably already said, but wouldn't it be better if both feminism and MRM didn't exist? And just focus on human issues?

[Daverz]

Just a general opinion that I've probably already said, but wouldn't it be better if both feminism and MRM didn't exist? And just focus on human issues?

Local area man thinks feminism unnecessary.  News at 11.

[Cosi bel do]

What a marvellous place debate.org is. I never go there, but that's certainly entertaining.

Next topic : Should men have rights to opt-out of child support in unwanted pregnancies?
67% say yes ! In your FACE women !
http://www.debate.org/opinions/male-rights-to-opt-out-of-child-support-in-unwanted-pregnancies-should-men-have-rights-to-opt-out-of-child-support-in-unwanted-pregnancies

[Ken B]

Nowadays I remain skeptical of everything involving "movements," but I was thinking about this VICE video where it was asserted that "women have more rights than men." (Notice the background music, not taking any of this seriously).

https://www.youtube.com/v/s6dC0AQ25xU

So I googled "do women have more rights than men?" On debate.org, I was surprised to see the consensus is 79% yes and 21% no. Scrolling down, the only argument I see for "no" is the "wage gap," something which has been debunked numerous times and is illegal, anyways.

http://www.debate.org/opinions/do-women-have-more-rights-than-men-in-todays-society


Just a general opinion that I've probably already said, but wouldn't it be better if both feminism and MRM didn't exist? And just focus on human issues?

Women have a right to an abortion, men don't. Seems a slam dunk. 

[Karl Henning]

Local area man thinks feminism unnecessary.  News at 11.

(* chortle *)

Twenty-something men add their thoughts.

[kishnevi]

Local area man thinks feminism unnecessary.  News at 11.

But he has a point.  Just like the insistence on seeing the death by cops in Ferguson and NYC as racism derails examination of the real problem, out of control policing and the systemic biases that allow it to be ignored and covered up....something that impacts all parts of the community, not just blacks.

[snyprrr]

The woman I just got played by for three months (of course by my naive permission) will be 50 soon. Frankly, this woman looks absolutely spectacular, not a day over mid-30s, '50s 'torpedo' breasts standing straight up, German stock, not a clue of any age on her face...

and yes, she is fitting this hypergamous stereotype to a 'T'. She's Sociopathically Charming enough to keep "it" up for a good while, but then the sheer Human Greed of moreMoreMORE!!! takes over and she has too many tongs in the fire, and then a "mistake" is made whereby said chump finds out what's reeeally going on. Human Cobra Syndeome.

fuuuuuu... yea, this shit is REAL. I get treated the same by the, frankly, unattractive women, as I do by the 'hawt' ones. The only ones who aren't like that are the obviously Damaged Goods-- BUT, IF YOU MAKE HER FEEL good about herself, she too can turn into the HyperGam before your eyes.


I was brought up a heart On Sleeve Liberal- you go girl --- all the waaay,... and I sooo needed the validation from the babes, and just wasn't going to get it.-- just like the libby bearded white hipsters who get beat by the black thugs they worship ("It's my fault they beat me up.") - or any "fan" who is mocked by their ArtistStar...


MarxEngels101



"If I want a "friend", I'll go looking for someone with a penis."
                                   snips to random HyperGam











... I'm thinking...










I do see couples around that look like they've been TogetherForever... no matter how funny looking, they're always cute .










sorry,... I've been sitting here for hours.... was I saying anything important? ... oh look, a squirrel!!

[Karl Henning]

But he has a point.  Just like the insistence on seeing the death by cops in Ferguson and NYC as racism derails examination of the real problem, out of control policing and the systemic biases that allow it to be ignored and covered up....something that impacts all parts of the community, not just blacks.

Point taken.

[Ken B]

But he has a point.  Just like the insistence on seeing the death by cops in Ferguson and NYC as racism derails examination of the real problem, out of control policing and the systemic biases that allow it to be ignored and covered up....something that impacts all parts of the community, not just blacks.

+1