Love can transpose things bass and viol to form and dignity.

[AnotherSpin]

He probably means коровай but what it has got to do with Purcell and Les Voix Humaines I have not the slightest idea. 

I have been to Ukrainian weddings several times only. Usually the table is no different from that on any other occasion. In the village the most important thing is homemade samogon (moonshine), in the city vodka from the shop. I have no recollection of any cake or karavai.

[Florestan]

They have embellished Purcell like the above.

Well, you described it thus:

The result is a sort of nervousness, brittleness.  It's also objective,  cold almost. 

I may be a hair-splitter but that photo does not fit that at all.

[Mandryka]

Well, you described it thus:

I may be a hair-splitter but that photo does not fit that at all.

Well it is highly embellished but not expressive, at least that's what I think. You can embellish in a way which doesn't create an effect, other than brittleness.


It's all subjective, someone else may hear the deepest expression of love and death in it. Listen to it and tell me you feel differently! The reviews on Amazon seem positive. All I hear is a tale which maybe tries to be of sound and fury, but in fact signifies nothing.

[Florestan]

I have been to Ukrainian weddings several times only. Usually the table is no different from that on any other occasion. In the village the most important thing is homemade samogon (moonshine), in the city vodka from the shop. I have no recollection of any cake or karavai.

In Romania something similar to the cake in the photo is called "The Bride's Cake" and is not homemade at all but ordered from a cake shop. It is mandatory at weddings but I have never seen it that much decorated, though, and I've been to lots of weddings, including mine. As for strong drinks, both in the village and the city the most popular one is whisky (beside the national țuică , that is).

[Florestan]

Well it is highly embellished but not expressive, at least that's what I think. You can embellish in a way which doesn't create an effect, other than brittleness.


It's all subjective, someone else may hear the deepest expression of love and death in it. Listen to it and tell me you feel differently! The reviews on Amazon seem positive. All I hear is a tale which maybe tries to be of sound and fury, but in fact signifies nothing.

I don't know. I just try to find a musical equivalent for the photo you posted but I'm at a loss. I have never listened to something so sugary, kitschy and schmaltzy.

[Mandryka]

I don't know. I just try to find a musical equivalent for the photo you posted but I'm at a loss. I have never listened to something so sugary, kitschy and schmaltzy.

Ah yes, I see now the misunderstanding. Bad metaphor possibly.

[Mandryka]

In Romania something similar to the cake in the photo is called "The Bride's Cake" and is not homemade at all but ordered from a cake shop. It is mandatory at weddings but I have never seen it that much decorated, though, and I've been to lots of weddings, including mine. As for strong drinks, both in the village and the city the most popular one is whisky (beside the national țuică , that is).

[Mandryka]

In Romania something similar to the cake in the photo is called "The Bride's Cake" and is not homemade at all but ordered from a cake shop. It is mandatory at weddings but I have never seen it that much decorated, though, and I've been to lots of weddings, including mine. As for strong drinks, both in the village and the city the most popular one is whisky (beside the national țuică , that is).

I shall show the pic to Petru and see if he had one.

I've been enjoying this dancing - and I'd really like a hat like the older dancer wears. I've been angling for one for Christmas. I'm told it's sheepskin.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y1SJ59iMHNQ

[Florestan]

Ah yes, I see now the misunderstanding. Bad metaphor possibly.

My idea of highly embellished but inexpressive, almost cold, is this:

[Florestan]

I shall show the pic to Petru and see if he had one.

I'd be surprised if he hadn't.

I've been enjoying this dancing - and I'd really like a hat like the older dancer wears. I've been angling for one for Christmas. I'm told it's sheepskin.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y1SJ59iMHNQ

It is.

Here's a fairly typical Bride's Cake (Tortul miresei):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fEa3VsLZkv8

Notice it is brought over the Light Cavalry Overture musical background: this is traditional as well. 

Also, the schmaltzy figurine on top is not mandatory and at more sophisticated weddings there is none (I had none at mine).

[AnotherSpin]

In Romania something similar to the cake in the photo is called "The Bride's Cake" and is not homemade at all but ordered from a cake shop. It is mandatory at weddings but I have never seen it that much decorated, though, and I've been to lots of weddings, including mine. As for strong drinks, both in the village and the city the most popular one is whisky (beside the national țuică , that is).

Interesting. I thought it is wine, red wine. In Moldova, they drink wine like water, and start literally from infancy, as I know from several of my dear Moldovan friends. The same in the south-west of Ukraine. In Odessa region, for example, where some modest wine is produced as well. In fact, I bought 6 litres of local wine today for New Year party.

The cake, the photo of which @Mandryka posted, is somewhat reminiscent of Roma culture.

[Mandryka]

Interesting. I thought it is wine, red wine. In Moldova, they drink wine like water, and start literally from infancy, as I know from several of my dear Moldovan friends.

The cake, the photo of which @Mandryka posted, is somewhat reminiscent of Roma culture.

When the iron curtain fell, London was buzzing with talk of how wonderful Moldovian wines are, and how they were now going to become available in London. In fact I remember buying some, and they were indeed like good claret. Not so easy to find now.

[AnotherSpin]

When the iron curtain fell, London was buzzing with talk of how wonderful Moldovian wines are, and how they were now going to become available in London. In fact I remember buying some, and they were indeed like good claret. Not so easy to find now.

Negru de Purcari is very famous. We have a variety of Moldovan wines, but I don't buy them because the price is quite high, and at this price level it is possible to find more interesting wines.

[Florestan]

Interesting. I thought it is wine, red wine. In Moldova, they drink wine like water, and start literally from infancy, as I know from several of my dear Moldovan friends.

Well, yes, at a Romanian wedding the largest quantity of drink is wine too (red or white according to preference --- but I was talking specifically about strong drinks because you mentioned vodka and samogon.

Typically, at a wedding (or baptism; we celebrate them exactly like a wedding) one starts with a few shots of strong drink while eating the hors d'oeuvre, then proceeds to wine for the other courses and ends with sparkling wine for the dessert. The quantity of each depends on the person, but I see where you're coming from: Moldovans (by which I mean Romanians born in the historical province of Moldavia within Romania, not the Republic of Moldavia which is only a small part of it annexed by Russia in 1812) are reputed to be heavy drinkers, men and women alike --- and judging by my own experience, it's only slightly exaggerated. 

The cake, the photo of which @Mandryka posted, is somewhat reminiscent of Roma culture.

You're not far off the mark, what with the heavy, over-the-top ornamentation and the overall schmaltzy feeling.

[Mandryka]

Very good one -- in a bit of the same vein as Les Voix Humaine  (I spoke to son when I said their approach is unique.) Vittorio Ghielmi and friends phrase as recitative, rhythms and phrasing more like speech than song Fast.   Good dynamic effects. The ensemble is wonderfully clear and the sound is good too.  I like this one very much. Top tier.

[AnotherSpin]

Well, yes, at a Romanian wedding the largest quantity of drink is wine too (red or white according to preference --- but I was talking specifically about strong drinks because you mentioned vodka and samogon.

Typically, at a wedding (or baptism; we celebrate them exactly like a wedding) one starts with a few shots of strong drink while eating the hors d'oeuvre, then proceeds to wine for the other courses and ends with sparkling wine for the dessert. The quantity of each depends on the person, but I see where you're coming from: Moldovans (by which I mean Romanians born in the historical province of Moldavia within Romania, not the Republic of Moldavia which is only a small part of it annexed by Russia in 1812) are reputed to be heavy drinkers, men and women alike --- and judging by my own experience, it's only slightly exaggerated. 

You're not far off the mark, what with the heavy, over-the-top ornamentation and the overall schmaltzy feeling.

I didn't emphasise it, but in general samogon and vodka is not just a strong drink, but often a basic for many Ukrainian families. Wine, and even more so "champagne" (sparkling wine) is considered to be a drink for sissies and faint-hearted. Also, wine is produced only in a small part of the country. Odessa is not typical, many people drink wine, and in the villages of the Odessa region many households grow grapes and make their own homemade wine.

I guess we should end the diversion from the topic, we are taking advantage of @Mandryka's patience

[AnotherSpin]

This is the polar opposite of the Ukrainien wedding cake of a performance by Les Voix Humaines. Harnoncourt's CMW Purcell fantasias have a simplicity and honesty and humility and naturalness which I find totally winning. This is art hiding art - it just feels like a totally unaffected effusion of musical poetry. Top tier Purcell.

Listened to several Fantasia recordings today. Some in full, some in part. Harnoncourt's recording really stands out. A very good impression. Couldn't find a separate disc on Qobuz, however this recording included in the box set of Purcell's music:

[Florestan]

I guess we should end the diversion from the topic, we are taking advantage of @Mandryka's patience

Nah! I've known Mandryka for almost a decade now --- he's a most excellent fellow, among the last ones to make a fuss about a few off-topic posts. 

[Mandryka]

Listened to several Fantasia recordings today. Some in full, some in part. Harnoncourt's recording really stands out.

I'm not surprised you say that, it is very appealing. Humble, no narcissism.

Nah! I've known Mandryka for almost a decade now --- he's a most excellent fellow, among the last ones to make a fuss about a few off-topic posts. 

Indeed, I'm totally relaxed about that sort of thing!

[AnotherSpin]

I'm not surprised you say that, it is very appealing. Humble, no narcissism.

Indeed, I'm totally relaxed about that sort of thing!

Frankly, I've never understood the stern reprimands regarding digressions from the topic. Can't digressions be much more interesting than the main topic? Theme/variations. I thought of Nabokov's translations of Pushkin's Eugene Onegin. Four major volumes. The first contains two English translations, one in verse, one in prose - Nabokov concluded that it was impossible to convey rhythm and meaning at the same time. The next three volumes, extended commentaries, reading which one can easily forget about Onegin.