Author Topic: Thirty three and a third.  (Read 76016 times)

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Offline Szykneij

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Re: Thirty three and a third.
« Reply #820 on: January 18, 2021, 05:11:38 AM »
I'm trying to figure out how "the tape time was half of what it would be if it were basic stereo"?

PD

A regular 8-track cassette had music recorded on 4 sections of the tape, each section using 2 tracks for stereo. When the end of the first section was reached, a metal tab on the tape switched the heads to read the music on the next section. The quad recordings used four tracks (half) of the tape instead of two, so there were only two sections instead of 4.
   8-track recordings could only turn in one direction and had tape twice as wide (the same width of reel-to-reel) as the cassettes that came later. Those cassettes can be reversed to play the other side, utilizing 4 tracks total.
Men profess to be lovers of music, but for the most part they give no evidence in their opinions and lives that they have heard it.  ~ Henry David Thoreau

Don't pray when it rains if you don't pray when the sun shines. ~ Satchel Paige

Offline Pohjolas Daughter

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Re: Thirty three and a third.
« Reply #821 on: January 18, 2021, 05:20:28 AM »
A regular 8-track cassette had music recorded on 4 sections of the tape, each section using 2 tracks for stereo. When the end of the first section was reached, a metal tab on the tape switched the heads to read the music on the next section. The quad recordings used four tracks (half) of the tape instead of two, so there were only two sections instead of 4.
   8-track recordings could only turn in one direction and had tape twice as wide (the same width of reel-to-reel) as the cassettes that came later. Those cassettes can be reversed to play the other side, utilizing 4 tracks total.
Ah, thanks for the explanation!  :)

PD

Offline Irons

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Re: Thirty three and a third.
« Reply #822 on: January 18, 2021, 08:40:00 AM »
I'm trying to figure out how "the tape time was half of what it would be if it were basic stereo"?

PD

PD, I did own a 8-track player once! Must go down as the most odd and impractical of formats ever.

 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/8-track_tape

You must have a very good opinion of yourself to write a symphony - John Ireland.

Offline Pohjolas Daughter

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Re: Thirty three and a third.
« Reply #823 on: January 18, 2021, 09:21:16 AM »
PD, I did own a 8-track player once! Must go down as the most odd and impractical of formats ever.

 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/8-track_tape
My parents' had one, so I listened to it (never purchased any recordings for it though).   Anyone here remember that age-old craft of making mixed-compilation cassette for parties, etc.?  ;D  Ah, the careful calculations that one had to make.... the art of the mixed-tape!  :D

PD

Offline Szykneij

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Re: Thirty three and a third.
« Reply #824 on: January 18, 2021, 09:58:57 AM »
PD, I did own a 8-track player once! Must go down as the most odd and impractical of formats ever.

 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/8-track_tape

Yes, for sure.

The link you posted had a good picture of the inner workings. The cartridges had a continuous loop tape that had to be pulled out of the center spool to go back around again. This put some significant wear on the tape itself which was notorious for breaking, especially in car players. I got pretty good at opening them up and splicing the tape back together.

Another drawback was the short length of each track, which made it nearly impossible to fit all pieces of an album within the allotted times (about 12-15 minutes) and in the correct order. Commercially produced ones often had a song fade out and fade back in to finish when the player needed to make the switch. If you had a recorder (which wasn't that common) and made your own, the switch just occurred where it needed to with a pop, which I thought was much preferable.
Men profess to be lovers of music, but for the most part they give no evidence in their opinions and lives that they have heard it.  ~ Henry David Thoreau

Don't pray when it rains if you don't pray when the sun shines. ~ Satchel Paige

Offline Pohjolas Daughter

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Re: Thirty three and a third.
« Reply #825 on: January 18, 2021, 10:04:47 AM »
Yes, for sure.

The link you posted had a good picture of the inner workings. The cartridges had a continuous loop tape that had to be pulled out of the center spool to go back around again. This put some significant wear on the tape itself which was notorious for breaking, especially in car players. I got pretty good at opening them up and splicing the tape back together.

Another drawback was the short length of each track, which made it nearly impossible to fit all pieces of an album within the allotted times (about 12-15 minutes) and in the correct order. Commercially produced ones often had a song fade out and fade back in to finish when the player needed to make the switch. If you had a recorder (which wasn't that common) and made your own, the switch just occurred where it needed to with a pop, which I thought was much preferable.
Looking at that Wiki page reminded me of that endless loop and hearing it go back to the 'start' of the tape! lol

And sounds like you're good at tape surgery there Tony!

Offline Irons

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Re: Thirty three and a third.
« Reply #826 on: January 31, 2021, 03:05:05 AM »


For over half a century the du Pré iconic recording of the Elgar Cello Concerto ASD 655 has not left the catalogue. The coupling although excellent is odd. Even odder, in the same year (1965) EMI coupled Jackie's Delius recording in a similar way (ASD 644). EMI obviously thought it more important to have composer over artist continuity. Although later they were to have second thoughts with ASD 2764.

 
You must have a very good opinion of yourself to write a symphony - John Ireland.

Offline vandermolen

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Re: Thirty three and a third.
« Reply #827 on: February 20, 2021, 01:09:45 AM »
I like the look of the Delius only EMI/HMV LP Lol.

From WAYLTN thread:

Kabalevsky Symphony No.4

The politically correct soviet notes are very characteristic:
'...[the Symphony embodies] the grand and lofty thoughts and emotions of the Soviet people.'
« Last Edit: February 20, 2021, 01:33:54 AM by vandermolen »
"Courage is going from failure to failure without losing enthusiasm" (Churchill).

'The test of a work of art is, in the end, our affection for it, not our ability to explain why it is good' (Stanley Kubrick).

Offline Irons

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Re: Thirty three and a third.
« Reply #828 on: February 20, 2021, 01:32:41 AM »
I like the look of the Delius only EMI/HMV LP Lol.

From WAYLTN thread:

Kabalevsky Symphony No.4

Picked the Delius up at a charity shop that had just opened in Kensington Church Street, Jeffrey. Could not believe my luck.

Your MK has the the best cover image I have seen. Not a label noted for cover artwork. I will listen later to a YouTube upload of the recording.
You must have a very good opinion of yourself to write a symphony - John Ireland.

Offline vandermolen

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Re: Thirty three and a third.
« Reply #829 on: February 20, 2021, 01:41:44 AM »
Picked the Delius up at a charity shop that had just opened in Kensington Church Street, Jeffrey. Could not believe my luck.

Your MK has the the best cover image I have seen. Not a label noted for cover artwork. I will listen later to a YouTube upload of the recording.
Yes Lol and it's in vg condition. Was on offer on eBay for £10. I offered £5.00 which was immediately accepted. I had the LP in a white cardboard sleeve many decades ago and it's nice to have a copy complete with an attractive jacket design and characteristically poorly-translated and propagandist soviet notes (see above). I knew Kensington Church St well from my youth in Earl's Court. As a boy I remember being dragged round the very trendy clothes boutique 'Biba' probably by our au-pair girl.
"Courage is going from failure to failure without losing enthusiasm" (Churchill).

'The test of a work of art is, in the end, our affection for it, not our ability to explain why it is good' (Stanley Kubrick).

Offline Irons

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Re: Thirty three and a third.
« Reply #830 on: February 20, 2021, 09:23:50 AM »
Yes Lol and it's in vg condition. Was on offer on eBay for £10. I offered £5.00 which was immediately accepted. I had the LP in a white cardboard sleeve many decades ago and it's nice to have a copy complete with an attractive jacket design and characteristically poorly-translated and propagandist soviet notes (see above). I knew Kensington Church St well from my youth in Earl's Court. As a boy I remember being dragged round the very trendy clothes boutique 'Biba' probably by our au-pair girl.

Most enjoyable. Russian to it's bootstraps! Tchaikovsky and Shostakovich influence in equal measure. Anyway, I have ordered a copy. ;D

In my youf I worked at John Barkers for a few years.
You must have a very good opinion of yourself to write a symphony - John Ireland.

Offline vandermolen

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Re: Thirty three and a third.
« Reply #831 on: February 27, 2021, 06:20:28 AM »
Most enjoyable. Russian to it's bootstraps! Tchaikovsky and Shostakovich influence in equal measure. Anyway, I have ordered a copy. ;D

In my youf I worked at John Barkers for a few years.
Excellent - it is my favourite of Kabalevsky's symphonies. I worked at Harrods and Whiteley's of Bayswater (where I was told that I was driving customer's out of the shop by playing Durufle's 'Requiem' at top volume) in my youth.
"Courage is going from failure to failure without losing enthusiasm" (Churchill).

'The test of a work of art is, in the end, our affection for it, not our ability to explain why it is good' (Stanley Kubrick).

Offline Pohjolas Daughter

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Re: Thirty three and a third.
« Reply #832 on: February 27, 2021, 06:35:06 AM »
Excellent - it is my favourite of Kabalevsky's symphonies. I worked at Harrods and Whiteley's of Bayswater (where I was told that I was driving customer's out of the shop by playing Durufle's 'Requiem' at top volume) in my youth.
Whoopsie!  :-[ 😆

Offline DavidW

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Re: Thirty three and a third.
« Reply #833 on: February 27, 2021, 09:11:14 AM »
Excellent - it is my favourite of Kabalevsky's symphonies.

If you're talking the fourth symphony I just listened to it last night.  It is great!  I doubt it was the specific recording you and Irons are discussing though.

Offline Irons

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Re: Thirty three and a third.
« Reply #834 on: February 28, 2021, 01:33:14 AM »
Excellent - it is my favourite of Kabalevsky's symphonies. I worked at Harrods and Whiteley's of Bayswater (where I was told that I was driving customer's out of the shop by playing Durufle's 'Requiem' at top volume) in my youth.

We did get around didn't we, Jeffrey. :) Took my wife for lunch at Whiteley's for her birthday once. Very olde worlde, I was expecting to bump into Mrs Slocombe! Worked at Bentalls, Kingston too. Unfortunately not at any time in record departments.
You must have a very good opinion of yourself to write a symphony - John Ireland.

Offline DavidW

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Re: Thirty three and a third.
« Reply #835 on: February 28, 2021, 06:42:50 AM »
So I'm confused, is this 40+ page thread actually devoted to the 33 (as the title suggests), or you mostly talking about 45s? 

Offline Irons

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Re: Thirty three and a third.
« Reply #836 on: March 01, 2021, 12:43:43 AM »
So I'm confused, is this 40+ page thread actually devoted to the 33 (as the title suggests), or you mostly talking about 45s?

I am now confused as you. I cannot recall any mention of 45s on this thread.
You must have a very good opinion of yourself to write a symphony - John Ireland.

Offline vandermolen

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Re: Thirty three and a third.
« Reply #837 on: March 01, 2021, 12:48:08 PM »
If you're talking the fourth symphony I just listened to it last night.  It is great!  I doubt it was the specific recording you and Irons are discussing though.
Yes, we are David. There are, AFAIK, only two recordings, the one conducted by Kabalevsky which has had various LP and CD manifestations and the more recent CPO recording. I wouldn't be without either of them.
"Courage is going from failure to failure without losing enthusiasm" (Churchill).

'The test of a work of art is, in the end, our affection for it, not our ability to explain why it is good' (Stanley Kubrick).

Offline vandermolen

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Re: Thirty three and a third.
« Reply #838 on: March 01, 2021, 12:51:14 PM »
We did get around didn't we, Jeffrey. :) Took my wife for lunch at Whiteley's for her birthday once. Very olde worlde, I was expecting to bump into Mrs Slocombe! Worked at Bentalls, Kingston too. Unfortunately not at any time in record departments.
Haha, yes we did Lol. At Harrods I wanted to be in the record dept but was placed in the silk dept  ???. My boss, whom I recall as being very keen on security, was later arrested and sent to prison for stealing 1000s of pounds of material.
"Courage is going from failure to failure without losing enthusiasm" (Churchill).

'The test of a work of art is, in the end, our affection for it, not our ability to explain why it is good' (Stanley Kubrick).

Offline Pohjolas Daughter

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Re: Thirty three and a third.
« Reply #839 on: March 01, 2021, 01:04:52 PM »
Haha, yes we did Lol. At Harrods I wanted to be in the record dept but was placed in the silk dept  ???. My boss, whom I recall as being very keen on security, was later arrested and sent to prison for stealing 1000s of pounds of material.
:o  Oh, my!  Did you ever manage to get transferred to the record department?  I'm sure that they could have used you there.

PD