Diving into chamber music (and looking for recs)

[lordlance]

Those of you who've read my posts here may know that I listen almost exclusively to orchestral music. I am not quite sure what changed but I have been exploring a lot of chamber music recently. I've had some success so far but before going further I should tell my deal-breakers:
1. Slow movements still don't do it for me. I don't know when that will change. Slow music only manages to muster a shrug from me and not a feeling of heavenly beauty or whatever it is that most people experience. Because of this I have had much more fun listening to chamber music skipping the adagios.
2. I *really* dislike woodwind at the fore. The high-pitch triggers my anxiety. Probably why I also dislike sopranos. I can tolerate woodwinds as part of the overall ensemble though.
3. I am sticking to trio and more for now. Violin or cello sonatas don't really cut it for me. Coming from orchestral is probably why I like larger chamber ensembles that have a symphonic sound themselves like piano trios and so forth.
4. I usually love piano as part of the ensemble. Piano's rich timbral possibilities are unmatched.
5. Not sure why but I've never really warmed up to string quartets. Like Beethoven's late string quartets are plain boring. (Not Grosse Fugue - string orchestra - incidentally.)

All of those aside, here are some pieces I have sort of warmed up to: https://open.spotify.com/playlist/4HCgz4jO07vzmf5SGJAL8T?si=78f111bd7fe94f30

The Bax Piano Quintet is not easy. It will require many listens I reckon to digest its contents. In addition I was sort of surprised by Rheinbeger's Nonet. Seems he was better in chamber music. Hummel's piano quintet showed some promise unlike his piano concertos that I've heard. Something I liked instantly was the first movement of Lyapunov's piano sextet. I have also tried Lachner's Septet and Nonet. They aren't *amazing* but they are OK-ish I suppose. Dvorak's Piano Trio No. 3 was good stuff too. Something which was a bit of a surprise that I enjoyed was Martinu's Piano Quintets No. 2.

Some clear misses:
1. Faure's and Pierne's Piano Quintet - I just knew from the first few minutes this isn't the kind of music I like. Maybe it's more "gentle."
2. Stanford's Piano Trio No. 2 and Piano Quintet - I heard the latter twice. Stanford doesn't cut it unfortunately. Where are the tunes?
3. Beethoven's Septet - I heard the orchestration conducted by Toscanini and not Beethoven's finest efforts sadly.
4. Raff's Piano Quintet

I hope this large data set makes it easier for people to recommend new chamber pieces to me. You get the idea - music that's swift or more extroverted generally.

Recommended by the community so far - https://open.spotify.com/playlist/5XqavZfkYzQ7BfjNP6qAVV?si=2c24fc7a8c554614

[Karl Henning]

Mendelssohn Octet? Enescu Octet? Mozart viola quintets? Brahms viola sonatas?

[lordlance]

Mendelssohn Octet? Enescu Octet? Mozart viola quintets? Brahms viola sonatas?

The first two are in my list. I have heard the Mozart String Quintet No. 1. The latter seems promising.

[Karl Henning]

The first two are in my list. I have heard the Mozart String Quintet No. 1. The latter seems promising.

Do you have any affinity for 20th-c. music?

[Cato]

Cesar Franck:

Ravel:

Borodin:

Nicolai Tcherepnin:

Alexander Tcherepnin:

and

[Brian]

Mendelssohn Octet? Enescu Octet? Mozart viola quintets?

Yes! And I also thought of Janacek's string quartets, which are a genre OP does not love yet but which do not really have slow movements so maybe they are a good starting point.

Dvorak Piano Quartet No. 2 also comes to mind.

[lordlance]

Do you have any affinity for 20th-c. music?

Yep. It's harder than Romantics but after the latter, my principal interest is "modern" (contemporary/20thC)

[Symphonic Addict]

5. Not sure why but I've never really warmed up to string quartets. Like Beethoven's late string quartets are plain boring. (Not Grosse Fugue - string orchestra - incidentally.)

Not even Bartók's SQs? Nos. 4 and 5 feature some turbulent, visceral and rhythmically vivid music. They are the most approachable in my opinion.

As for other suggestions, I think Leo Ornstein's Piano Quintet could be of your interest, also Ernest Bloch's Piano Quintet No. 1, Boris Tchaikovsky's Piano Trio, Florent Schmitt's epic Piano Quintet, Toivo Kuula's monumental Piano Trio, Einar Englund's Piano Quintet, Shostakovich's Piano Quintet and Piano Trio No. 2, etc.

[DavidW]

Schumann's piano quintet, Brahms piano quartets sound really rich and symphonic to my ears.

[lordlance]

Not even Bartók's SQs? Nos. 4 and 5 feature some turbulent, visceral and rhythmically vivid music. They are the most approachable in my opinion.

As for other suggestions, I think Leo Ornstein's Piano Quintet could be of your interest, also Ernest Bloch's Piano Quintet No. 1, Boris Tchaikovsky's Piano Trio, Florent Schmitt's epic Piano Quintet, Toivo Kuula's monumental Piano Trio, Einar Englund's Piano Quintet, Shostakovich's Piano Quintet and Piano Trio No. 2, etc.

I do like Shostakovich's PT2. I tried his PQ but the two slow movements were too much for me so I quit. Bartok is actually a little too acerbic. Anxiety acts up. SQ4 tried and stopped.

Also made this playlist based on what people have recommended so far: https://open.spotify.com/playlist/5XqavZfkYzQ7BfjNP6qAVV?si=641c462c551e4c64

Listening to Boris Tchaikovsky's Piano Trio.I - that is the right path definitely.

[lordlance]

Schumann's piano quintet, Brahms piano quartets sound really rich and symphonic to my ears.

I love PQ1 arranged by Schoenberg. Heard the Gavle performance recently. The finale is such cheery music.

[Karl Henning]

Yep. It's harder than Romantics but after the latter, my principal interest is "modern" (contemporary/20thC)

If you're game, you might try the Schoenberg Serenade, Op. 24, which is one of my favorite scores of his.

[Jo498]

Schubert's "Trout" Quintet and Schumann's Piano quintet are almost like piano concerti with strings. There are a few lesser such pieces (the most famous by Hummel) in a similar concertante style. Mozart's piano quartets and also Brahms' Schumann's, Dvorak's are less concert-like but might also appeal more than pure strings.

Some later romantic pieces like piano quintets by Brahms, Franck, the Chausson Concert (a sextet) are also sounding quite big (and more dramatic than Fauré). If you like the Brahms try the quintets by Dohnanyi and Bloch.

A problem is that the more "orchestral" chamber music often includes woodwinds, you might want to try the Schubert octet that is a bit like a bigger and more romantic version of Beethoven's septet. HUmmel and Spohr also wrote septets through nonets for such mixed ensembles. A great late romantic/early modern such piece is the shortish Decet (dixtuor, 10 players) by Enescu.

[DaveF]

Elgar's 3 late chamber works are all masterpieces (although one is a violin sonata ).  The string quartet and piano quartet do both have slow movements, but both fairly quick-moving ones (the Piacevole movement of the quartet was a favourite of Alice Elgar's and was played at her funeral).  I like the Maggini Quartet and Peter Donohoe on Naxos.

[lordlance]

Schubert's "Trout" Quintet and Schumann's Piano quintet are almost like piano concerti with strings. There are a few lesser such pieces (the most famous by Hummel) in a similar concertante style. Mozart's piano quartets and also Brahms' Schumann's, Dvorak's are less concert-like but might also appeal more than pure strings.

Some later romantic pieces like piano quintets by Brahms, Franck, the Chausson Concert (a sextet) are also sounding quite big (and more dramatic than Fauré). If you like the Brahms try the quintets by Dohnanyi and Bloch.

A problem is that the more "orchestral" chamber music often includes woodwinds, you might want to try the Schubert octet that is a bit like a bigger and more romantic version of Beethoven's septet. HUmmel and Spohr also wrote septets through nonets for such mixed ensembles. A great late romantic/early modern such piece is the shortish Decet (dixtuor, 10 players) by Enescu.

I don't mint woodwinds when they're part of the larger ensemble so much. I've heard sextets and onwards with them. It's when I encounter something like an Oboe Quartet that it becomes too much. Point is go ahead with larger pieces if they have winds. 

[Florestan]

If Beethoven's Septet does nothing for you, I'm afraid you're a hopeless case.     

[Karl Henning]

If Beethoven's Septet does nothing for you, I'm afraid you're a hopeless case.     

incorrect (* chortle *)

(Of course, I noted your wink.)

[Jo498]

If Beethoven's Septet does nothing for you, I'm afraid you're a hopeless case.     

The septet was hugely popular back then but today it hovers a bit uneasily between serenade and "serious" chamber music as well as between chamber and larger ensemble.

I never had a problem with string quartets or cello sonatas etc. I don't want chamber music to sound quasi-orchestral, in fact, I find this a slight annoyance with some chamber piece that seem to try to make a "bigger" sound than appropriate (e.g. Franck's quartet and quintet).

[Karl Henning]

[Karl Henning]

The [LvB] septet was hugely popular back then but today it hovers a bit uneasily between serenade and "serious" chamber music

Point taken, though A. that feels redolent of "received opinion" and B. considering that one valid quibble with LvB is [heavy business too often] I'm personally inclined to give him some credit (Eighth Symphony, e.g.) when he has a light touch.