Handel: Messiah Oratorio

[knight66]

This is interesting; I would have thought that the b minor mass was far more difficult for a choir than Messiah. I once heard a performance of Messiah with a young laypeople choir that was decent but they had "His yoke is easy" and maybe another chorus sung by the (professional) soloists.

There are several really demanding parts of the Messiah and a lot of local choirs cut swathes of it. Yes, the b Minor is also very demanding, but the breath control and fast runs within the Messiah felt more difficult in terms of vocal technique. The b Minor is demanding in different ways. It was not written as one piece, but it feels right to bring it together and treat it as one piece.

Of the pre 20th cent works, I think the most demanding for the chorus is the Missa Solemnis: not a mountain, a range of mountains.

Mike

[knight66]

Richter's early 1960s German recording is negligible, except maybe for ardent fans of one of the singers. I gave this to my mother for Xmas several years ago but was really disappointed. It's plodding, "four square" and the soloist are not all that great despite having famous names.

But I must assume that the somewhat later English language recording is much better.

I have heard parts or most of one of Scherchen's (I guess the earlier one) and the sound is bad, the soloists variable and the whole thing extremely excentric. While I love some of Scherchen's excentric but highly expressive recordings (St. Matthew, Art of Fugue, Handel op.6 concerti, Mahler's 2nd, Mozart's Requiem and more) I was not convinced by what I heard of his Messiah.

There are to many recordings around for me to have listened to all of the famous ones. I have about seven or so on the shelf and heard a few more. My favorites are probably McCreesh for HIP and the 1960s Colin Davis because I basically got to know the piece with that one and it still holds up very well.

The recent Haim version is, I think, special. But if you are happy with the two excellent ones you specify; there is nothing to compell you further I feel. I have about half a dozen versions and don't think I need more. In contrast, I can never have too many b Minor Masses which seems to me to be that much more interesting with more complex subtexts. Ditto St Matthew, you never come to an end of it.

Mike

[Jo498]

Thanks for the comments. Messiah certainly has more "fast" passages for the choir then e.g. Bach's Passions (not sure about the b minor mass) and in some recordings I had the impression that e.g. "And he shall purify" was sung as fast as possible like a choral exercise (I prefer a somewhat more weighty approach).
I actually have fewer recordings of the b minor mass, not for specific reasons. But the Mass is for me a more "objective" piece mainly dependent on a good choir and conductor. Unless the solo singer totally suck, I do not care so much about them in this piece. This is hugely different in Messiah and even more so in the St. Matthew where in addition to the soloists one need a superlative evangelist and Christ.
But for all three works there are lots of very good recordings in different stylistic approaches to choose from. The somewhat recent Messiah recording I have on my list for eventual purchase is the one on Linn.

[knight66]

Joe, It is interesting to see what gets different people's juices going. I enjoy Messiah and am fully engaged in it when performing; but it does not for me provide the same kind of significant experience as do the two Bach works we have mentioned. In those theatrical drama seems to be supplemented by a rare kind of reflection and a more personal sense of journey, one with more layers in it.

Handel's Theodora can, in the right hands, provide me with just that deep sense of an inner journey. It is my favourite Handel piece.

Mike

[jochanaan]

I've sung both the B minor Mass and the Messiah; the Mass is definitely the more demanding for the singers.  Wider vocal ranges, more wide leaps, and more constant singing.  But they are both an ecstasy to sing.