Elliott Carter, 1908-2012

[Joe Barron]

* cough * Gmgers

I'll post my impressions when that Carter cd arrives in the mail btw.

Fine: make a fool of me. Typo has been corrected.

Which CD would this be, then?

[DavidW]

Fine: make a fool of me. Typo has been corrrected.

Which CD would this be, then?

We know which forum you really love!

Oh the cd that you rec'd--

[Joe Barron]

I am interested to read your comments.

Corrrected has also been corrected.

[karlhenning]

Can't fling a dead cat around here without hitting a correction . . . .

[DavidW]

I'm not the type to make a fuss about spelling, but I wouldn't want those pesky cmgers dancing a jig if they saw this thread.

[DavidW]

My initial impression is that the cd is superb, all of the works on there are exceptional, but pretty different from each other.

[Joe Barron]

My initial impression is that the cd is superb, all of the works on there are exceptional, but pretty different from each other.

As if there was any doubt. 

[bhodges]

My initial impression is that the cd is superb, all of the works on there are exceptional, but pretty different from each other.

You pegged it succinctly.  It's a really good survey of his work done since 2000 (when he was a mere 92-year-old sapling  ).

--Bruce

[Joe Barron]

Charles Rosen offered this assessment of the Cello Concerto in his centenary tribute to Carter in the New York Review of Books:

To understand the power of the work of the recent decades, one might try the inspired recorded performance of the Cello Concerto by Fred Sherry, conducted by Oliver Knussen, a lyrical and even tragic work, written when Carter was only ninety-two, which escapes all the generalizations often made of intransigent modernism. It is from performances like this that one realizes that the music of Elliott Carter offers pleasures and delights that no other composer can offer.

What he said.

[karlhenning]

From amazon.com:

We've noticed that customers who have purchased or rated Elliott Carter: String Quartets Nos. 2, 3 and 4 have also purchased Beethoven: Complete String Quartets by Beethoven. For this reason, you might like to know that Beethoven: Complete String Quartets is now available.  You can order yours for just $99.99 by following the link below.

Oh, they've noticed that, have they?  That customers who buy an $8 disc of Elliott Carter's music belly right up for a $100 set of Just More Beethoven?

Frightfully interesting.

[Guido]

At the centenery talk that Robin Holloway gave at Cambridge with a complete overview of his oeuvre and assessment of all the major works he absolutely panned the cello concerto, calling it grating, rasping and unpleasant amongst other things! I plan to argue the work's corner when I go and meet him! It's the cello concerto and Boston concerto that fire me up most from that CD - both I thnk are Great.

He admired What Next? I believe, but thought the libretto was vacuous and inane - what are people's thoughts on this?

[not edward]

At the centenery talk that Robin Holloway gave at Cambridge with a complete overview of his oeuvre and assessment of all the major works he absolutely panned the cello concerto, calling it grating, rasping and unpleasant amongst other things! I plan to argue the work's corner when I go and meet him! It's the cello concerto and Boston concerto that fire me up most from that CD - both I thnk are Great.

He admired What Next? I believe, but thought the libretto was vacuous and inane - what are people's thoughts on this?

I'm on your side regarding the Cello Concerto; though I prefer the Boston Concerto I think the cello work is fine.

What Next?--yeah, I think the libretto is weak. The music is certainly well-done, but it doesn't grab me in the way that my favourite Carter does.

[Joe Barron]

i agree with Guido about the Cello Concerto: one of my favorites, both pre- and post-millenium, and a highlght on a CD that consists entirely of highlights.(How Zen.) The live performance, with Ma and Barneboim, left me speechless. I actually had to go off and be by myself during intermission, so great was the impression.

The critical consensus on What Next? seems to be that the music is good, but the libretto is weak. One Carter expert told me he thought the libretto sucks (the very word he used), and he couldn't understand why Carter bothered set it to music. He also said the piece doesn't work as an opera, though it does work as what he called a "vocal whatnot."

I have to say, though, that it came to life for me when I saw it at the Miller Theater a couple of years ago. (I'm sure my comments are back on one of the earlier pages here somewhere.) It was a lively production with a lot of creative stage business, much different from the premiere production on DVD. I understood afterward the potential Carter saw in the libretto, and I think the piece works better as an opera --- that is, as staged theater --- than as an abstract, vocal recording. I canlt remember when I've had a better tme at the opera, but then I'm sure the brevity helped. Opera for me is largely a test of endurance.   

And let's face it: a lot of librettos are silly. This one is no worse than Siegfried.

[karlhenning]

In so much of his work, Carter has displayed wit & erudition in text selection;  I think he's quite well inoculated in the question of an opera libretto 

[bhodges]

At the centenery talk that Robin Holloway gave at Cambridge with a complete overview of his oeuvre and assessment of all the major works he absolutely panned the cello concerto, calling it grating, rasping and unpleasant amongst other things! I plan to argue the work's corner when I go and meet him! It's the cello concerto and Boston concerto that fire me up most from that CD - both I thnk are Great.

He admired What Next? I believe, but thought the libretto was vacuous and inane - what are people's thoughts on this?

"Grating, rasping and unpleasant" would seem to be a comment on a performance of the concerto, rather than the piece itself, but...to each his own.  I like the piece just fine, although I haven't heard it as much as the Boston and ASKO Concertos. 

And as far as the libretto to What Next?, I agree that it's a little wacky, but it did generate some of his typically excellent music, so I'll put up with it.  Not my favorite Carter at the moment, but then I've only heard the score twice, in the Miller Theatre production Joe mentions above.

--Bruce

[Guido]

"Grating, rasping and unpleasant" would seem to be a comment on a performance of the concerto, rather than the piece itself, but...to each his own.  I like the piece just fine, although I haven't heard it as much as the Boston and ASKO Concertos. 
--Bruce

I think he was referring to the nature of the cello writing which does indeed tend to avoid the lyrical (with notable exceptions), and can be downright percussive in places...

[CRCulver]

He admired What Next? I believe, but thought the libretto was vacuous and inane - what are people's thoughts on this?

Every text Paul Griffiths is involved with is vacuous and inane. See also his libretto for Tan Dun's Marco Polo opera and his Frances-Marie Uitti collaboration.

[Guido]

this listener didn't think the cello concerto was all that exceptional, i'd rather listen to those from ligeti, dutilleux or jonathan harvey.

Those three are indeed wonderful (and possibly superior), but I still think the Carter is a major contribution, if if it will never ever reach repertory status.

[karlhenning]

Music is all ONE, anyway 

[greg]

Rhythm, melody, harmony, tone-colour, texture ... ... (basic musical dimensions)

And you can file all of that under "sound in time"...