With Classical Recording Dead...

Started by dtwilbanks, May 11, 2007, 09:06:19 PM

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dtwilbanks

[I know the industry's dead. I just read the book.]

What is next for this music? How will it be treated in the future?

mahlertitan

who cares about the environment, let's protect classical music!

dtwilbanks

What about these live downloads on the 'net I've read about? Where are they to be found?

loudav

I really think downloads--live or otherwise--are the way to go. The Grateful Dead have done this with some success for their concert recordings (though the series is suspended for the moment)--charging a range of prices depending on quality (MP3, FLAC). Also, at least one orchestra is currently doing this for live recordings (who is that?).

It makes so much sense for "long tail" musics, if that is what classical is destined to be. Especially for concert recordings, the cost to produce is practically nil, and there is little by way of distribution and packaging costs. JPGs can be provided for front/back cover images and booklet notes, if downloaders want a nice package.

Ironically, the sticking point could be contracts with musicians' unions, existing ones being predicated on more traditional commercial releases with defined print runs, as opposed to the (probably smaller but) open-ended runs possible with downloads. I think that this will come online (so to speak) within the next 2-5 years, as more people have highspeed internet. Or maybe not.

dtwilbanks

In the future, music may be given away free as promotion for live events. CDs, regardless of genre, aren't exactly selling like hotcakes (except to hardcore music-heads, like most of us).

mahlertitan

classical music should be free for everyone, and the classical artists should get paid from the government.

Todd

Someone forgot to tell Klaus Heymann the industry died.
The universe is change; life is opinion. - Marcus Aurelius, Meditations

People would rather believe than know - E.O. Wilson

Propaganda death ensemble - Tom Araya

dtwilbanks

Quote from: Todd on May 12, 2007, 08:54:40 AM
Someone forgot to tell Klaus Heymann the industry died.

Yeah, there's him filling the niches. And the small labels.

Todd

Quote from: dtwilbanks on May 12, 2007, 09:01:55 AMYeah, there's him filling the niches. And the small labels.


So then how's the industry dead?  Small labels offer thousands of new recordings every year, and often are more interesting than the "majors".

And at least one major is still alive and kicking: take a look at DG's web-site.  A new LvB Symphony cycle is due later this year, and three pianists have recorded LvB's concertos (Grimuad, Pletnev, and Lang Lang).  There was the whole Mozart year last year.  And so on.  Hell, even EMI still manages to crank out some new recordings.  The other "majors", too.  Sure, they're not making as many as in the 80s and early 90s, but so what?  How does that equate with the industry dying?  As long as there's money to be made, someone, somewhere will produce the goods.  Just as it should be. 

People ought not to be afraid of old dinosaurs and antiquated industry structures dying in favor of new ones; that's a good thing.
The universe is change; life is opinion. - Marcus Aurelius, Meditations

People would rather believe than know - E.O. Wilson

Propaganda death ensemble - Tom Araya

71 dB

Quote from: MahlerTitan on May 12, 2007, 08:44:44 AM
classical music should be free for everyone, and the classical artists should get paid from the government.

Not a bad idea but are the tax payers ready to accept that?
Spatial distortion is a serious problem deteriorating headphone listening.
Crossfeeders reduce spatial distortion and make the sound more natural
and less tiresome in headphone listening.

My Sound Cloud page <-- NEW July 2025 "Liminal Feelings"

Bach Man

Quote from: Todd on May 12, 2007, 09:09:17 AMAnd at least one major is still alive and kicking: take a look at DG's web-site.  A new LvB Symphony cycle is due later this year, and three pianists have recorded LvB's concertos (Grimuad, Pletnev, and Lang Lang).
This is precisely what is wrong with the majors. Basically their releases follow the "same sh*t, new wrapping" principle, even though DG isn't the worst offender in this respect. The indie companies are so far ahead nowadays, pushing new repertoire and actually keeping the initiative of the recording business. They frequently use more interesting artists too, yet avoid the "portrait"-releases that is a mainstay of the majors. The majors can't even sell records at full price for more than a few years following release.

Don

Quote from: 71 dB on May 12, 2007, 09:23:24 AM
Not a bad idea but are the tax payers ready to accept that?

No way, and I personally wouldn't like doing it either.

Todd

#12
Quote from: 71 dB on May 12, 2007, 09:23:24 AMNot a bad idea but are the tax payers ready to accept that?



I say it's a terrible idea. 

As to whether taxpayers would support it, it depends.  Some areas may have greater support than others.  In the US, this generally falls to states and local governments, but given limited budgets, I'd say these levels of government should focus on other things - you know, true public goods.  Roads, bridges, schools, etc.  Supporting "The Arts" should be low on the agenda.  If a particular level of government is flush with cash, and the taxpayers' support, then public funding makes sense.

Every time I go to a classical music concert I'm struck by the average age and appearance of relative affluence of the patrons.  Why on earth should all taxpayers be asked to support something that the comparatively wealthy enjoy?  That's absurd.  I suppose one could try to argue that by making it "free" that a broader audience would become interested in the music, but I'd like to see some type of evidence from somewhere that supports that.  (I should point out that cheap tickets can be had for around $20 locally, so it's not at all expensive to attend concerts in at least some places.)  I'd also like to know why that would be a laudable goal.  Should government be in the business of forming the artistic tastes of its citizens? 

Also, why only classical music?  Why not indie rock or jazz or pop music?  While I prefer classical music (and jazz) to pop and rock, does that mean it's somehow intrinsically better, or at least more deserving of public funds?  I can't see how.  If anything, I think "Arts" funding by government should be reduced, and that includes funding for venues, unless, again, funds are plentiful and more important issues are taken care of.
The universe is change; life is opinion. - Marcus Aurelius, Meditations

People would rather believe than know - E.O. Wilson

Propaganda death ensemble - Tom Araya

Brian

#13
Quote from: MahlerTitan on May 12, 2007, 08:44:44 AM
classical music should be free for everyone, and the classical artists should get paid from the government.
But that's akin to acknowledging it's dead. That's an act of unspeakable desperation. It's also gratuitously unnecessary. Classical music recording is alive and well - it's just that the life has moved, and with it the mainstream. The problem is that Norman Lebrecht was simply wrong.

The problem with his view is that Naxos and the small labels are not just "filling the niches" behind the flopping "major labels". They are small physically, but big in importance, dynamic, and promoting a classical renaissance in a major way. Watch as Naxos, Cedille, Albany, Bridge, and others constantly bring to light living composers and provide a forum for new classical music; watch as Hyperion leaps out of the niches to provide us with performances by people like the Lindsays, Angela Hewitt, and Stephen Hough; watch as Telarc continues to crank out fantastic work with folks like the Atlanta Symphony; watch as Arte Nova gives us a classic Schumann cycle with David Zinman; watch as Naxos explores the impossibly bustling, beautiful alleyways of Japanese, Spanish, and now Greek classics. In the niche market that is classical music, the independent record labels are not bit players or even glitters of hope - they are the leaders. While they continue to release classic recordings of mainstream repertoire (Sudbin's new Tchaikovsky album on BIS; Zinman's Schumann), the independents realize that if there is any hope for the regeneration and rebirth of classical music, it is in the discovery of new styles and kinds of music - not in the rehashing of the old stuff. Bach Man's comments are dead accurate, and the independents realized it years ago. Hence new series of unfamiliar styles (Greek, Bax, or anything between); hence releases featuring new composers (like Huang Ruo) and music from young people around the world. Hence the use of ill-publicized but exceptionally worthy performers (Arnaldo Cohen, Ilya Kaler, Klara Wurtz, Peter Wispelwey, Havard Gimse, James Judd, Antoni Wit). Hence the audacity to go boldly in search of the things people don't realize they want to hear - and then turn profits.

Rather than "filling the niches", Klaus Heymann has placed the niches squarely in center stage, and in so doing has turned upside down all our notions of the recording industry's present and future. If Norman Lebrecht is blind to this, it's the shortsightedness of old age. The classical industry is indeed alive - thanks only to the perseverance of a few brilliant people like Heymann who have had the guts to demonstrate that the niches have gone mainstream - people who've had the guts to transform our perspective and finally realize the true value of classical recordings.

At least, that's what I think.

dtwilbanks

Good posts.

I wonder how many CDs these small labels are actually selling per title. Hundreds? Thousands? Lebrecht doesn't seem to think it's many.

jochanaan

Quote from: brianrein on May 12, 2007, 11:59:28 AM
...At least, that's what I think.
Not just you. :D

Rumors of classical music recording's death, as usual, are greatly exaggerated--but we can't rest on our laurels.  And I would add that, historically, the small forms--solo works, chamber music, songs--have been on the cutting edge of musical innovation; orchestral music and opera have had to wait for the new styles to affect them.  Smaller ensembles find it easier to explore and redefine themselves.  Example: the Kronos Quartet. :D
Imagination + discipline = creativity

71 dB

Quote from: dtwilbanks on May 12, 2007, 01:11:58 PM
Good posts.

I wonder how many CDs these small labels are actually selling per title. Hundreds? Thousands? Lebrecht doesn't seem to think it's many.

I don't know if you mean Naxos by "small label" because Naxos is a major player these days but from the foreword by Klaus Heymann in Naxos catalogue:

"Our consumer-friendly price and wide distribution allow us to spread recording cost across 20,000 to 30,000 copies."  
Spatial distortion is a serious problem deteriorating headphone listening.
Crossfeeders reduce spatial distortion and make the sound more natural
and less tiresome in headphone listening.

My Sound Cloud page <-- NEW July 2025 "Liminal Feelings"

Don

Quote from: brianrein on May 12, 2007, 11:59:28 AM
Rather than "filling the niches", Klaus Heymann has placed the niches squarely in center stage, and in so doing has turned upside down all our notions of the recording industry's present and future. If Norman Lebrecht is blind to this, it's the shortsightedness of old age. The classical industry is indeed alive - thanks only to the perseverance of a few brilliant people like Heymann who have had the guts to demonstrate that the niches have gone mainstream - people who've had the guts to transform our perspective and finally realize the true value of classical recordings.

At least, that's what I think.

I doubt that Lebrecht's advanced age has anything to do with his dire predictions about the death of classical music.  His reputation is built on bitching about stuff and declaring that "the sky is falling".  That's his MO, and he'll continue along these lines until he croaks. 

In the meantime, the real state of classical music is doing fine as Todd and Brian well described.  There are live concerts all over the place, and the recording industry is doing great although the so-called majors do what they can to screw it up.  So I'm high on classical music and its future. 8)

Brian

I'm a little less high, having just gone to a concert downtown. At intermission my family and I stood up and looked around; my father noted, "Twenty years from now, nearly all the people in the audience won't be here. As in, on the planet."

And it's true.
We need to rise quickly to the greatest challenge in classical music's history - redefining its image and making new customers return to concert halls, before it's too late. But I stand by my earlier comments - if anybody will be up to the task, it will be a mind like Klaus Heymann, willing to shatter all the barriers and conventions and try something completely different.

mahlertitan

Taxplayers's money is sponsoring the War in Iraq, i doubt that majority of the people wanted that.