Charles Koechlin(1867-1950)

[eyeresist]

So anyway, this Koechlin dude...

I listened to some Amazon samples and thought what I heard had potential. Is there any one disc (orchestral) that you would especially recommend to the newbie?


BTW, I noticed a 2-CD set listed at HMV jp, conducted by Bedford on a label named Actes Sud (weird, huh). No other details given.

http://www.hmv.co.jp/en/product/detail/726808

[Mirror Image]

So anyway, this Koechlin dude...

I listened to some Amazon samples and thought what I heard had potential. Is there any one disc (orchestral) that you would especially recommend to the newbie?

Yes, I would start with Zinman's recording of The Jungle Book. It's the complete cycle and it's 2-CDs, but checkout these videos first before you proceed:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ctPTaigcRTE&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OAy-pMCJims

[eyeresist]

Thank you!

[Mirror Image]

Thank you!

You're welcome. Enjoy the music!

[Luke]

Anyway, it's the dreadful double standards of this forum that keep me from expressing myself freely or the way I think I should be allowed to do.

You really think your free speech is being repressed? 

[(poco) Sforzando]

You really think your free speech is being repressed? 

I can see what he means. Here are a couple of examples to support his point:

SCARPIA: Oh dear, looks like Philo has gone on hiatus
MI: Thank goodness. I hope he stays gone awhile.

MI: I have a bit of a grip [sic] here, it seems to be okay for people to dismiss Koechlin, like haydnguy has done, and it doesn't bother me that people don't like his music, but it's not okay for me to say I dislike Messiaen's music and when I do I get a whole panel of know-it-all, holier than thou eggheads telling me that I'm wrong for disliking his music.

MI (about me): He has constantly mocked my own opinion on numerous occasions, which, to my estimate, lies a larger problem deep in his psyche. He simply cannot stand to hear somebody bad mouth a composer he likes and if they do they are somehow "wrong" for feeling the way they do. He goes around with some sort of superiority complex, etc. etc.

[DavidW]

My fingers are crossed that I'll be the first to see it if MI moves the Messiaen set to the refusal bin!

You know seeing all of the confusion between me and haydnguy, I'm starting to think that I should go back to my previous handle, especially since every one knows my name anyway.

Let's forget that dust up on the Messiaen thread eh? it's not worth it.  MI, listen to Quartet for the End of Time, a work that could distract people from the horrors of war for a brief time in Stalag VIII-A, and let the worries over an internet forum pass you by. 0:)

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You really think your free speech is being repressed? 

Please excuse my rant. That's all it was, nothing more.

[Mirror Image]

My fingers are crossed that I'll be the first to see it if MI moves the Messiaen set to the refusal bin!

You know seeing all of the confusion between me and haydnguy, I'm starting to think that I should go back to my previous handle, especially since every one knows my name anyway.

Let's forget that dust up on the Messiaen thread eh? it's not worth it.  MI, listen to Quartet for the End of Time, a work that could distract people from the horrors of war for a brief time in Stalag VIII-A, and let the worries over an internet forum pass you by. 0:)

No, David. I won't be getting rid of my Messiaen set. I have complete confidence that I will find something that I like in that set.

[Mirror Image]

Thank you!

eyeresist, did you get a chance to watch those videos I linked? If yes, please share your thoughts with me.

[eyeresist]

Good thing you prompted me, because otherwise I wouldn't have bothered (accessing YouTube is a hassle due to workplace restrictions - I have to go through a portal site).

I didn't listen to too much of the Jungle Book, as honestly I found it a bit of a bore.

OTOH, I really liked Vers la Voute Etoilee. It reminded me of the Russians (always good), plus in parts of the more reflective RVW (also good). My only quibble is the slightly scrappy playing. But this looks like being the first work of his I will acquire.

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Good thing you prompted me, because otherwise I wouldn't have bothered (accessing YouTube is a hassle due to workplace restrictions - I have to go through a portal site).

I didn't listen to too much of the Jungle Book, as honestly I found it a bit of a bore.

OTOH, I really liked Vers la Voute Etoilee. It reminded me of the Russians (always good), plus in parts of the more reflective RVW (also good). My only quibble is the slightly scrappy playing. But this looks like being the first work of his I will acquire.

Vers la Voute Etoilee is played fine. You're listening through YouTube, so, obviously, the audio quality isn't up to par with the CD itself. I think this particular work sounds like nobody but Koechlin, but, then again, I've listened to him enough to recognize his musical language. You found that link to The Jungle Book a bore? Hmmm...I find it enchanting from start to finish, but then we are only talking about The Meditation of Purun Bhagat. This particular piece builds up to a wonderful climax, that is, if you're patient enough to hear it. I think the idea with Koechlin is that if you're not willing to wallow in the impressionistic haze with him, then you're not going to get very far with the music, because, let me tell you, it rewards the listener as you patiently go along. I think the general problem with many classical listeners when they hear someone like Koechlin is their initial reaction is he's boring or he's too "new agey," but does this assessment really mean much in the long run? There's a viciousness that runs deep through Koechlin's Jungle Book, but I think the whole cycle is one of the greatest works of orchestral music in the 20th Century. I mean, for me, it's right up there with Stravinsky's three famous ballets, Villa-Lobos' Choros, etc. I guess it's fair to say that many people don't hear what I hear in the music and I'm perfectly fine with that, because I have found a composer who speaks directly to me rather than trying to break some special code in order to appreciate the music. The aren't many composers that do this for me, but Koechlin, Villa-Lobos, RVW, Ravel, Bartok, Stravinsky, Bruckner, Berg, and Milhaud are who I consider my musical soulmates.

I think if I'm willing to give Messiaen a fair trial than anybody else can do the same with Koechlin.

[JerryS]

This forum is proving to be a wonderful guide to new musical discoveries! I had never heard of Koechlin. After reading through some of the posts in this thread I listened to Vers la Voûte étoilée op. 129 on Naxos Music Library (Holliger, Heinz; Stuttgart Radio Symphony Orchestra). What a marvelous work! So accessible and evocative. I'm reminded of both Delius and early Schoenberg (Gurrelieder).

Next up is Jungle Book on Marco Polo!

Thank you for the recommendations!

Jerry

[eyeresist]

I admit I wasn't terribly patient with that extract from the Jungle Book. I thought it might eventually develop into something, but after flicking through the first few minutes, I decided not to bother.

There is an RCA double combining Zinman's Jungle Book with Judd's disc of the Seven Stars et al., which might be a good first buy.

[Mirror Image]

This forum is proving to be a wonderful guide to new musical discoveries! I had never heard of Koechlin. After reading through some of the posts in this thread I listened to Vers la Voûte étoilée op. 129 on Naxos Music Library (Holliger, Heinz; Stuttgart Radio Symphony Orchestra). What a marvelous work! So accessible and evocative. I'm reminded of both Delius and early Schoenberg (Gurrelieder).

Next up is Jungle Book on Marco Polo!

Thank you for the recommendations!

Jerry

Excellent, Jerry! Welcome to the forum. I don't think we met yet, but I'm glad to see that you enjoyed this work by Koechlin. Please contact me if you have any questions regarding this composer.

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I admit I wasn't terribly patient with that extract from the Jungle Book. I thought it might eventually develop into something, but after flicking through the first few minutes, I decided not to bother.

There is an RCA double combining Zinman's Jungle Book with Judd's disc of the Seven Stars et al., which might be a good first buy.

Good things come to those who wait.

Yes, I've seen this RCA double as well and it would be an excellent buy. I'm still on the lookout for an original copy of Judd's recording of Seven Stars Symphony. I haven't even heard this work yet, but there's still a lot of Koechlin's orchestral music that hasn't been recorded yet. I'm praying that Heinz Holliger continues his foray into this man's music.

[JerryS]

Excellent, Jerry! Welcome to the forum. I don't think we met yet, but I'm glad to see that you enjoyed this work by Koechlin. Please contact me if you have any questions regarding this composer.

Thanks! I'm new to the forum but a lifelong classical music lover. I decided to try some Koechlin chamber music, so I'm listening to Quintet No. 2 for Flute, Harp and String Trio, "Primavera II" performed by the Montreal Chamber Players on the ATMA Classique label. Very nice; I've always liked the flute and harp together.

Jerry

[eyeresist]

I haven't even heard this work yet, but there's still a lot of Koechlin's orchestral music that hasn't been recorded yet. I'm praying that Heinz Holliger continues his foray into this man's music.

Is Hanssler the new cpo?


EDIT: I've just been listening to samples from Persian Hours (orchestral). Wow.

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Thanks! I'm new to the forum but a lifelong classical music lover. I decided to try some Koechlin chamber music, so I'm listening to Quintet No. 2 for Flute, Harp and String Trio, "Primavera II" performed by the Montreal Chamber Players on the ATMA Classique label. Very nice; I've always liked the flute and harp together.

Jerry

You're welcome, Jerry. I would like to dive into some of Koechlin's chamber works as well, but right now I'm so mesmerized by his orchestral music that it may take me awhile to get there. Not to deviate from this thread too much, but who are some of your favorite composers?

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Is Hanssler the new cpo?


EDIT: I've just been listening to samples from Persian Hours (orchestral). Wow.

I don't know, eyeresist. I think both companies have given many hardcore classical fans, like us here on the forum, some great recordings to cherish for many years to come.

Yes, The Persian Hours is a fine piece. Very textural, and atmospheric.