GMG Classical Music Forum

Johann Strauss' music is quite special for me, and I noticed there wasn't a general topic about the "Waltz King" :)

I started being an extreme fan of classical music listening to Bach, Mozart, Beethoven and Haydn, but I was introduced to it for the very first time after listening to some pieces by J. Strauss II at the New Year's Concert 1998 (Rosen aus dem Süden, Nur Fort!-Polka and An der schönen blauen Donau, plus Strauss Father's Radetzky-Marsch); I was rather impressed by the deep beauty, the wonderful harmony and the great brilliance that music bursts out, a music so enjoyable and colourful!
I've never considered Strausses compositions as "light music", but always as an intense, passionate and powerfully emotional expression of the viennese nature: those stunning works (especially the waltzes), with that hauting rythm and amazing orchestration, which create almost descrptive moments, are certainly much more than "dancing music".

Fell free to leave any comment you want about Johann Strauss II, but also the rest of the Strauss Family, the Wiener Philharmoniker and the Wiener Neujahrskonzert.

Listening to his music is always a delight and highly enjoyable! Often his melodies are so irresistable and charming that one cannot stop thinking of them continuously! And I certainly agree, his works definitely seem to capture the Viennese spirit, and in a very beautiful way. I enjoy so many of his waltzes, too many to list here. It is rather difficult to find a dull one in the whole lot!
Obviously, his works are not as powerful and passionate as that of some of his contemporaries, such as Brahms and Dvorak etc, but J.Strauss II certainly still is a master of his craft and his music is always wonderful to listen to.

Nice to see you here Daniel, I'm really glad you like Strauss' compositions :)

Yes, althought his music is very beautiful and enchanting, I admit that Strauss can not be as thrilling, evocative and impressive as Wagner, Beethoven, R. Strauss or Mahler; but comparing waltzes and polkas to symphonies, tone poems and operas would not be right, they're totally different compositions.
But read what his contemporaries thought about Schani:

"How could I forget the laughing genius of Vienna?" - Richard Strauss
"Unfortunately, NOT by Johannes Brahms." - Johannes Brahms about the "Blue Danube"
"The most musical mind of Europe" - Richard Wagner
"That man oozes with music!" - Johannes Brahms

Quote from: Lisztianwagner on December 17, 2011, 04:53:33 AM
Nice to see you here Daniel, I'm really glad you like Strauss' compositions :)

Yes, althought his music is very beautiful and enchanting, I admit that Strauss can not be as thrilling, evocative and impressive as Wagner, Beethoven, R. Strauss or Mahler; but comparing waltzes and polkas to symphonies, tone poems and operas would not be right, they're totally different compositions.
But read what his contemporaries thought about Schani:

"How could I forget the laughing genius of Vienna?" - Richard Strauss
"Unfortunately, NOT by Johannes Brahms." - Johannes Brahms about the "Blue Danube"
"The most musical mind of Europe" - Richard Wagner
"That man oozes with music!" - Johannes Brahms

:)

Very true point, waltzes and polkas (etc) are too different to be compared with symphonies, tone poems etc. Both serve different purposes in the world of music. I particularly like the quote from R.Strauss, and completely agree with it! J.Strauss II's music is so enjoyable, and fun! :)

Quote from: madaboutmahler on December 17, 2011, 05:31:42 AM
:)

Very true point, waltzes and polkas (etc) are too different to be compared with symphonies, tone poems etc. Both serve different purposes in the world of music. I particularly like the quote from R.Strauss, and completely agree with it! J.Strauss II's music is so enjoyable, and fun! :)

:)

I suppose you would change Wagner's quote in this way: "Mahler is the most musical mind of Europe".  ;)

Quote from: Lisztianwagner on December 17, 2011, 05:41:29 AM
:)

I suppose you would change Wagner's quote in this way: "Mahler is the most musical mind of Europe".  ;)

I would! ;D
In fact, I would change it even further by saying: "Mahler is the most musical mind of THE WORLD"
;)
I wonder what Wagner would have thought of Mahler's music....

Programme of the next New Year's Concert:

http://www.arkivmusic.com/classical/album.jsp?album_id=688269&album_group=8 (http://www.arkivmusic.com/classical/album.jsp?album_id=688269&album_group=8)

Quote from: Lisztianwagner on December 27, 2011, 05:14:10 AM
Programme of the next New Year's Concert:

http://www.arkivmusic.com/classical/album.jsp?album_id=688269&album_group=8 (http://www.arkivmusic.com/classical/album.jsp?album_id=688269&album_group=8)

Looks fun - looking forward to watching it! :)

Johann Strauss's music bores the living daylights out of me. There's nothing remotely interesting about his music to me. But hey, if you like his music, then that's all that matters. 8)

Quote from: madaboutmahler on December 17, 2011, 05:58:07 AM
In fact, I would change it even further by saying: "Mahler is the most musical mind of THE WORLD"
;)

Oh, jeez.... ::)

Quote from: Mirror Image on December 27, 2011, 09:50:02 AM
Johann Strauss's music bores the living daylights out of me. There's nothing remotely interesting about his music to me. But hey, if you like his music, then that's all that matters. 8)

What wonderful things to say on a thread dedicated to the appreciation of J.Strauss!
Surely John, you must agree that his music is great fun and is a high pleasure to listen to. Always makes me smile!

Quote from: madaboutmahler on December 27, 2011, 09:03:46 AM
Looks fun - looking forward to watching it! :)

Definitely! :) They're playing a lot of rare compositions this year (even Tchaikovsky's waltzes, how wonderful), that's great to see they don't always restrict choices to the usual thirty/forty pieces :)
But as a matter Janssons has always been a very enlightened conductor ;)

Quote from: madaboutmahler on December 27, 2011, 09:57:29 AM
What wonderful things to say on a thread dedicated to the appreciation of J.Strauss!
Surely John, you must agree that his music is great fun and is a high pleasure to listen to. Always makes me smile!

Well I had to say it. :) The only Strauss I like is Richard.

Quote from: Lisztianwagner on December 27, 2011, 10:43:18 AM
Definitely! :) They're playing a lot of rare compositions this year (even Tchaikovsky's waltzes, how wonderful), that's great to see they don't always restrict choices to the usual thirty/forty pieces :)
But as a matter Janssons has always been a very enlightened conductor ;)

I agree, Janssons is a great conductor! I am sure he will bring delightful performances to this charming repetoire! :)

Quote from: Mirror Image on December 27, 2011, 09:50:02 AM
Johann Strauss's music bores the living daylights out of me. There's nothing remotely interesting about his music to me. But hey, if you like his music, then that's all that matters. 8)

Unfortunately, Strauss never used the hammer for his music, so I can't strike you with Strauss hammer ;D

Joking aside, I'm sorry to read this, because I've always found Strausses works very powerfully emotional, enchanting and not boring at all; maybe those compositions can't be as deep, haunting and thrilling as Wagner's, Mahler's or Koechlin's one are (Koechlin in your case), but that is the magic of music: it can show its power and its beauty in many different ways.
Anyway I respect your opinion :)

Another vote for Strauss!!! Here are a couple interesting ones, a bit off the beaten track...
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And there is plenty more!!

Quote from: mc ukrneal on December 27, 2011, 11:13:57 AM
Another vote for Strauss!!! Here are a couple interesting ones, a bit off the beaten track...
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[asin]B000068QRU[/asin]

And there is plenty more!!

Welcome and enjoy the thread! ;)

I like both Aschenbrödel and Fürstin Ninetta, agree they're rather interesting works :)

Quote from: Lisztianwagner on December 27, 2011, 11:13:06 AM
Unfortunately, Strauss never used the hammer for his music, so I can't strike you with Strauss hammer ;D

Joking aside, I'm sorry to read this, because I've always found Strausses works very powerfully emotional, enchanting and not boring at all; maybe those compositions can't be as deep, haunting and thrilling as Wagner's, Mahler's or Koechlin's one are (Koechlin in your case), but that is the magic of music: it can show its power and its beauty in many different ways.
Anyway I respect your opinion :)

Beautifully expressed, Ilaria. :)
And that first sentence did make me laugh! :D

Quote from: madaboutmahler on December 27, 2011, 11:35:28 AM
Beautifully expressed, Ilaria. :)
And that first sentence did make me laugh! :D

Thank you Daniel :)
Haha, yes, I have to admit that it was a good witty remark.

Quote from: cilgwyn on December 27, 2011, 06:11:20 PM
Each to his own,I say! I used to listen to allot of operetta when I was younger & 'Die Fledermaus' was played quite allot!
Sadly,these days I find operetta a little too light weight,although I DO like the opera's of Lortzing,which is singspiel,really,or maybe operetta with a little more meat? Indeed,some people might even (do?) class it as operetta.
It Is nice to see Johan Strauss thread here,though.
Incidentally,have our own Gilbert and Sullivan got one? I'm not a huge G & S fan,but for some strange reason I do have allot of the old D'oyly Carte Decca recordings on cd!

Thanks for joining the thread! :)
I like operetta, especially the viennese one (Strauss, Lehar); it's very beautiful, enchanting and with a brilliant, involving rythm...a perfect compromise between waltz and opera I think.
The french composer J. Offenbach was very prolific in that genre as well, but I'm not a great fan of his music, apart from some pieces from La Vie Parisienne and Orphée aux Enfers; that is music I consider a little too light, not deep and passionate enough.
I'm not very familiar with Gilbert and Sullivan, I only know their H.M.S. Pinafore, which is a rather enjoyable work.

QuoteIncidentally,going back to Strauss's 'Fledermaus',does anyone remember the Carlos Kleiber recording of Die Fledermaus with Ivan Rebroff singing the part of Orlofsky in a truly apalling falsetto? Dame Edna Everage,anyone? What a disaster! And Hermann prey & Lucia Popp,two of my favourite singers,amongst an excellent cast. Tut,tut! It could have been so good! :o
  The emi Boskovsky recording was a favourite of mine. No falsetto's there,thank goodness. Also,for some reason,I used to like the Metropolitan Opera recording with Lily Pons! A strange one that,I know! :o

Die Fledermaus is definitely my favourite Strausses operetta along with Der Zigeunerbaron, they are certainly masterpieces!
About Die Fledermaus, I agree the Boskovsky is absolutely one of the most stunning and melodious versions ever recorded; I think also Karajan made amazing perfomances of it, both with the Wiener Phil and the Philharmonia Orchestra.

Agreed about Karajan. I should have mentioned him. Regarding Offenbach,I'm not a huge fan;but I do rather like the Plasson emi recording of 'Orpheus in the Underworld'. I had the Lps set as a teenager. His other operetta's are a bit too frivolous for me & probably work better on stage anyway.
  I particularly like Boskovsky in Strauss's orchestral music.He had just the right touch.

Quote from: Lisztianwagner on December 27, 2011, 05:14:10 AM
Programme of the next New Year's Concert:

http://www.arkivmusic.com/classical/album.jsp?album_id=688269&album_group=8 (http://www.arkivmusic.com/classical/album.jsp?album_id=688269&album_group=8)

I am glad for the many Josef Strauss works selected. He is in many ways the equal or more of his older brother, maybe not in terms of melodies but otherwise a very good composer.

The non-Strausses, save Tchaikovsky, are names I have never heard of. Should be fun.

Quote from: springrite on December 28, 2011, 06:48:36 AM
I am glad for the many Josef Strauss works selected. He is in many ways the equal or more of his older brother, maybe not in terms of melodies but otherwise a very good composer.

The non-Strausses, save Tchaikovsky, are names I have never heard of. Should be fun.

I agree, Josef was certainly a very fine and inspired composer; his music sounds more melancholic than Johann's, especially the waltzes (Delirien, Sphären-Klänge, Transaktionen etc.), but though it's very poetical and beautiful, and prone to introspection.

About the others:
Karl Michael Ziehrer was an Austrian composer, contemporary of the Strausses and one of the fiercest rivals of the viennese family, author of waltzes, polkas, maches and operettas.
Josef Hellmesberger was another Austrian composer, first hofkapellmeister at the Vienna Court Opera, and from 1901 to 1903 he was principal conductor of the Vienna Philharmonic, mainly known for his operettas.
Hans Christian Lumbye wrote waltzes, polkas, mazurkas and galops as well, but he was Danish.

Quote from: Lisztianwagner on December 27, 2011, 11:13:06 AM
Unfortunately, Strauss never used the hammer for his music, so I can't strike you with Strauss hammer ;D

Joking aside, I'm sorry to read this, because I've always found Strausses works very powerfully emotional, enchanting and not boring at all; maybe those compositions can't be as deep, haunting and thrilling as Wagner's, Mahler's or Koechlin's one are (Koechlin in your case), but that is the magic of music: it can show its power and its beauty in many different ways.
Anyway I respect your opinion :)

:P

I understand your points and I respect your opinion too. I guess J. Strauss is okay for some light listening, but usually when I want to hear something light I turn to Stravinsky's Neoclassical period, but even this period produced works that were profound. I'm thinking of the last movement of Apollo and the Mass in particular.

Quote from: cilgwyn on December 28, 2011, 06:41:38 AM
  I particularly like Boskovsky in Strauss's orchestral music.He had just the right touch.

Definitely, very well said :)

I remember my grandmother had an Lp of Boskovsky playing Schubert's lovely 'Trout' quintet (as it's popularly known) with members of the Vienna Octet.(I think it was a 'chunky' Decca 10" ffrr!)  A work which share's Johann Strauss's melodic wit & gracefulness. I'm not sure if the recording is available on cd,but it was a fine performance.
Boskovsky certainly had the credentials!

Quote from: springrite on December 28, 2011, 06:48:36 AM
The non-Strausses, save Tchaikovsky, are names I have never heard of. Should be fun.

Hellmesberger's 'diabolique' is absolutely superb. I believe it has appeared in the concerts relatively recently - maybe under Ozawa.

I agree with mc ukrneal, by the way: the csardas and waltz from Ritter Pasman are two of J. Strauss' most treasurable gems. Every Strauss fan ought to know and love them. The fake waltz which dissipates into midair in the introduction to Pasman-walzer is too witty.

Quote from: Brian on December 29, 2011, 03:00:55 PM
Hellmesberger's 'diabolique' is absolutely superb. I believe it has appeared in the concerts relatively recently - maybe under Ozawa.

I agree with mc ukrneal, by the way: the csardas and waltz from Ritter Pasman are two of J. Strauss' most treasurable gems. Every Strauss fan ought to know and love them. The fake waltz which dissipates into midair in the introduction to Pasman-walzer is too witty.

Very good memory :) As a matter of fact, Hellmesberger's Diabolique was played by Ozawa & Vienna Phil in the New Year's Concert 2002.

I agree as well, those works are incredibly stunning, especially the waltz; Strauss certainly had a special gift to extract beautiful pieces from his operettas (or in this case, opera).

Lots of Strauss waltzes at the upcoming Beijing New Year's Concert, with the Budapest Festival Orchestra under Fischer. Should be a stunner!

Quote from: Lisztianwagner on December 28, 2011, 07:55:57 AM
I agree, Josef was certainly a very fine and inspired composer; his music sounds more melancholic than Johann's, especially the waltzes (Delirien, Sphären-Klänge, Transaktionen etc.), but though it's very poetical and beautiful, and prone to introspection.

About the others:
Karl Michael Ziehrer was an Austrian composer, contemporary of the Strausses and one of the fiercest rivals of the viennese family, author of waltzes, polkas, maches and operettas.
Josef Hellmesberger was another Austrian composer, first hofkapellmeister at the Vienna Court Opera, and from 1901 to 1903 he was principal conductor of the Vienna Philharmonic, mainly known for his operettas.
Hans Christian Lumbye wrote waltzes, polkas, mazurkas and galops as well, but he was Danish.

There is also Waldteufel and Komzak. Bilse is even further off the beaten track (a CPO disc). Lanner was one of the first with the waltz in its current form.

The Wiener Neujahrskonzert was absolutely outastanding today! I had no doubt that Jansons & Wiener Philharmoniker would give an incredibly powerful and deeply emotional performance, full of beauty and orchestral brilliance! :D The programme of concert was amazing, I really enjoyed it; they played many stunning and rare pieces.....Rathausball Tanze, Vaterlandischer-Marsch, Entweder-oder!! And the presence of both Lumbye and Tchaikovsky added much passion and colour.
But surely, I couldn't do without getting excited when I listened to the trembling of the violins in An der Schonen Blauen Donau. ;D

Quote from: Lisztianwagner on January 01, 2012, 10:01:00 AM
The Wiener Neujahrskonzert was absolutely outastanding today! I had no doubt that Jansons & Wiener Philharmoniker would give an incredibly powerful and deeply emotional performance, full of beauty and orchestral brilliance! :D The programme of concert was amazing, I really enjoyed it; they played many stunning and rare pieces.....Rathausball Tanze, Vaterlandischer-Marsch, Entweder-oder!! And the presence of both Lumbye and Tchaikovsky added much passion and colour.
But surely, I couldn't do without getting excited when I listened to the trembling of the violins in An der Schonen Blauen Donau. ;D

I agree, excellent choices and performance. For me the winners were "Feuerfest"  and "Copenhagen Steam Railway Galop" - absolutely delicious and charming.

Quote from: Florestan on January 03, 2012, 05:50:34 AM
Copenhagen Steam Railway Galop"

I was addicted to that piece a few years ago! :D

Quote from: Florestan on January 03, 2012, 05:50:34 AM
I agree, excellent choices and performance. For me the winners were "Feuerfest"  and "Copenhagen Steam Railway Galop" - absolutely delicious and charming.

Absolutely; especially Jansons must have enjoyed the Feuerfest-Polka very much considering how he skipped while he was beating the hammers ;)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N4pMVJixbKE (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N4pMVJixbKE)

Briefly, Happy Birthday to the first violin of the Wiener Philharmoniker Erich Schagerl :)

At the Neujahrskonzert 2006, the end of Eduard Strauss' polka Telephon op. 165 was interrupted by a phone-call as well; but unlike the recent performance of Mahler No.9 at Lincoln Center, it was all settled ;D Stroke of genius from Mariss Jansons!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yCHRvu4qDWQ (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yCHRvu4qDWQ)

Johann Strauss is known mainly as a composer of dancing music (waltzes, polkas, marches, quadrilles) and operettas; but he also wrote some beautifully expressive, passionate, delightful romances for orchestra and cello; such absolutely brilliant pieces! ;D

http://www.youtube.com/v/JT-maayVP_M

Lovely piece, Ilaria! :)

Quote from: madaboutmahler on September 06, 2012, 01:38:00 PM
Lovely piece, Ilaria! :)

Thank you, Daniel, I'm glad you liked it. :)

Another enchanting example, Dolci Pianti:

http://www.youtube.com/v/7GJFcgTzR8c

To celebrate Johann Strauss' birthday....der Walzer aller Walzer! ;D

http://www.youtube.com/v/sP0r917EX-8

The programme of the Neujahrskonzert 2013:

Franz Welser-Most
Wiener Philharmoniker

Josef Strauss Die Soubrette, Polka schnell, op. 109
Johann Strauss II Kuss‐Walzer op. 400
Josef Strauss Theater‐Quadrille, op. 213
Johann Strauss II Aus den Bergen, Walzer, op. 292
Franz von Suppé Die leichte Kavallerie ‐ Overture

Interval

Josef Strauss Spharen‐Klänge, Walzer, op. 235
Josef Strauss Die Spinnerin, Polka française, op. 192
Richard Wagner Lohengrin – Prelude to Act III
Joseph Hellmesberger II Unter vier Augen, Polka Mazur
Josef Strauss Hesperusbahnen. Walzer, op. 279 Hesperus' Path Galoppin. Polka schnell, op. 237
Joseph Lanner Steyrische Tänze, op. 165
Johann Strauss II Melodien‐Quadrille op.112
Giuseppe Verdi Don Carlo, Prestissimo: Ballet music from Act III
Johann Strauss II Wo die Citronen blüh'n! Walzer, op. 364
Johann Strauss I Erinnerungen an Ernst oder: Der Carneval in Venedig Fantasie,op.126

The programme looks absolutely interesting, can't wait to watch the concert!!

Quote from: Lisztianwagner on December 28, 2012, 01:07:41 AM
The programme looks absolutely interesting, can't wait to watch the concert!!

+1.

Maybe just the schnell-polka the Neujahrskonzert starts with perplexes me, I don't think it's the best way to open the concert; a march or an ouverture are much better!

The programme of the Neujahrskonzert 2014:

Daniel Barenboim
Wiener Philharmoniker

Eduard Strauss: Helenen-Quadrille, op.14 (nach Offenbach)
Josef Strauss: Friedenspalmen. Walzer, op.207
Johann Strauss Vater: Carolinen-Galopp, op.21a
Johann Strauss II: Ägyptischer-Marsch, op.335
Johann Strauss II: Seid Umschlungen, Millionen. Walzer, op.443
Johann Strauss II: Stürmisch in Lieb' und Tanz. Polka schnell, op.393

Interval

Johann Strauss II: Ouvertüre zu "Waldmeister"
Johann Strauss II: Klipp Klapp. Galopp, op.466
Johann Strauss II: Geschichten aus dem Wienerwald. Walzer, op.325
Joseph Hellmesberger Jr: Vielliebchen. Polka française
Josef Strauss: Bouquet-Polka. Polka schnell, op.188
Richard Strauss: Mondscheinmusik aus "Capriccio"
Joseph Lanner: Die Romantiker. Walzer, op.167
Josef Strauss: Neckerei. Polka mazur, op.262
Josef Strauss: Schabernack. Polka schnell, op.98
Leo Delibes: Pizzicato-Polka aus "Sylvia"
Josef Strauss: Dynamiden (Geheime Anziehungskraft). Walzer, op.173
Josef Strauss: Ohne Sorgen! Polka schnell, op.271

Josef Strauss: Carriere. Polka schnell, op.200
Johann Strauss II: An der schönen, blauen Donau. Walzer, op.314
Johann Strauss Vater: Radetzky-Marsch, op.228

It is definitely going to be an excellent concert on next January, lots of wonderful, marvelous works! I was confident in Barenboim to see rare pieces in the programme and he didn't disappoint. :) I'm very pleased there will be Ägyptischer-Marsch, it hasn't been played since 1993. To celebrate Richard Strauss' 150th anniversary, Mondscheinmusik has been chosen, what an absolutely delightful surprise!!

Quote from: Lisztianwagner on November 21, 2013, 02:30:23 AM
The programme of the Neujahrskonzert 2014:

Daniel Barenboim
Wiener Philharmoniker

Eduard Strauss: Helenen-Quadrille, op.14 (nach Offenbach)
Josef Strauss: Friedenspalmen. Walzer, op.207
Johann Strauss Vater: Carolinen-Galopp, op.21a
Johann Strauss II: Ägyptischer-Marsch, op.335
Johann Strauss II: Seid Umschlungen, Millionen. Walzer, op.443
Johann Strauss II: Stürmisch in Lieb' und Tanz. Polka schnell, op.393

Interval

Johann Strauss II: Ouvertüre zu "Waldmeister"
Johann Strauss II: Klipp Klapp. Galopp, op.466
Johann Strauss II: Geschichten aus dem Wienerwald. Walzer, op.325
Joseph Hellmesberger Jr: Vielliebchen. Polka française
Josef Strauss: Bouquet-Polka. Polka schnell, op.188
Richard Strauss: Mondscheinmusik aus "Capriccio"
Joseph Lanner: Die Romantiker. Walzer, op.167
Josef Strauss: Neckerei. Polka mazur, op.262
Josef Strauss: Schabernack. Polka schnell, op.98
Leo Delibes: Pizzicato-Polka aus "Sylvia"
Josef Strauss: Dynamiden (Geheime Anziehungskraft). Walzer, op.173
Josef Strauss: Ohne Sorgen! Polka schnell, op.271

Josef Strauss: Carriere. Polka schnell, op.200
Johann Strauss II: An der schönen, blauen Donau. Walzer, op.314
Johann Strauss Vater: Radetzky-Marsch, op.228

It is definitely going to be an excellent concert on next January, lots of wonderful, marvelous works! I was confident in Barenboim to see rare pieces in the programme and he didn't disappoint. :) I'm very pleased there will be Ägyptischer-Marsch, it hasn't been played since 1993. To celebrate Richard Strauss' 150th anniversary, Mondscheinmusik has been chosen, what an absolutely delightful surprise!!

Excellent indeed!

I'm only a little puzzled about Helenen-Quadrille as opening piece; although it is a very nice work, I think it would be better to start with something lively and energetic to enter the joyous, cheerful atmosphere of the concert. Maybe Barenboim wanted to follow the example of Welser-Most, who started with a polka-française......

Quote from: Lisztianwagner on November 21, 2013, 02:30:23 AM
Richard Strauss: Mondscheinmusik aus "Capriccio"

YESSSS! I'm sure I have already made clear that this is 4 of my favourite minutes in all of music. :)  0:)

Later today, I'll be playing some Johann Strauss II music (Cinderella), and The Beautiful Blue Danube.

Now I'm sure Ilaria (perhaps the biggest Waltz Strauss Family fan) will pound the table at that!  :D

Quote from: ChamberNut on December 24, 2013, 09:46:09 AM
Later today, I'll be playing some Johann Strauss II music (Cinderella), and The Beautiful Blue Danube.

Now I'm sure Ilaria (perhaps the biggest Waltz Strauss Family fan) will pound the table at that!  :D

Absolutely!! Fiercely pounds the table! :D

Quote from: madaboutmahler on December 24, 2013, 09:11:40 AM
YESSSS! I'm sure I have already made clear that this is 4 of my favourite minutes in all of music. :)  0:)

Mondscheinmusik was absolutely a delightful surprise, I would have bet the Wiener Philharmoniker would have included the waltzes from Der Rosenkavalier! :)

I was absolutely delighted and satisfied by the New Year's Concert today, lots of wonderful, rare pieces, Barenboim and the Wiener Philharmoniker played extremely well. :) I was curious to listen to the unusual opening with a quadrille, but luckily the Helenen-Quadrille is lively, playful enough to dive into the joyous, cheerful atmosphere of the concert; Ägyptischer-Marsch was very funny, performed in almost Karajan style (slow rythm, but great intensity), but without the sudden acceleration in the central theme. :D How beautiful to hear Geschichten aus dem Wienerwald, Seid Umschlungen, Millionen and Klipp-Klapp again. Mondscheinmusik is such an incredible, passionate piece, I'm so glad it was included in the programme.

The programme of the Neujahrskonzert 2015:

Zubin Mehta
Wiener Philharmoniker

Franz von Suppé: Ouvertüre zum Lustspiel "Ein Morgen, ein Mittag, ein Abend in Wien"
Johann Strauß Sohn: Märchen aus dem Orient. Walzer, op. 444
Josef Strauß: Wiener Leben. Polka francaise, op. 218
Eduard Strauß: Wo man lacht und lebt. Polka schnell, op. 108
Josef Strauß: Dorfschwalben aus Österreich. Walzer, op. 164
Johann Strauß Sohn: Vom Donaustrande. Polka schnell, op. 356

-- Pause --

Johann Strauß SohnPerpetuum mobile. Musikalischer Scherz, op. 257/Accelerationen. Walzer, op.234/Elektro-magnetische Polka, op. 110
Eduard Strauß: Mit Dampf. Polka schnell, op. 70
Johann Strauß Sohn: An der Elbe. Walzer, op. 477
Hans Christian Lumbye: Champagner-Galopp, op. 14
Johann Strauß Sohn: Studenten-Polka. Polka francaise, op. 263
Johann Strauß Vater: Freiheits-Marsch, op. 226
Johann Strauß Sohn: Annen-Polka, op. 117/Wein, Weib und Gesang. Walzer, op. 333
Eduard Strauß: Mit Chic. Polka schnell, op. 221

What a wonderful programme they have chosen for this New Year's Concert, a lot of marvelous, stunning works! I'm looking forward to watching it; I'm very glad to see Strauss' Perpetuum mobile and Lumbye's Champagner-Galopp again, they haven't been played for a while. :)

The New Year's Concert was wonderful, as usual, I enjoyed it a lot!! That's not the first time Mehta conducts this important event, and he gave a great performance again; the Wiener Philharmoniker has the Strausses' music in its blood, every piece was played in a terribly beautiful way! :) Compared to the second one, the first part of the concert lacked a bit of joy and liveliness, maybe because of the waltzes (Märchen aus dem Orient and Dorfschwalben aus Österreich) and the polka-française (Wiener Leben), all with a more poetical, evocative and fairy atmospheres; the second part part instead, thank to the Lumbye's galopp, the march and the very playful and energetic quick polkas, sounded more immersive and cheerful. I was really glad Perpetuum mobile and Champagner-Galopp were included in the programme, Pretre was the last who chose them in 2010; An der Elbe was an outstanding new entry, such an incredible, hauntingly beautiful waltz; same speech for the explosive Explosions-Polka as an encore. :D

Mariss Jansons will conduct the Neujahrskonzert next year, I'm still looking forward to watching it!

I bought a couple of sets of Johan Strauss operettas recently. I had some already and there were some I knew from old library Lp days.
In addition to the famous mono recordings with Elisabeth Schwarzkopf,which I think are wonderful,I now have the cd release of the  1963 RCA Oscar Danon set,which some people rate very highly and was extremely difficult to get hold of for many years. Curiously it doesn't include Frosch,for reasons explained in the accompanying booklet. I think this was a mistake;although I can see what the producers meant, But for my money,Die Fledermaus isn't really Die Fledermaus without him being in it. But there we are! ;D
I also downloaded the Pristine resoration of the complete Ormandy Metropolitan opera recording of Die Fledermaus,in English with Lily Pons,amongst others. Minus the dialogue,although it does include a few scraps here & there,I have loved this recording since I first heard it as a teenager,via the old CBS Lps. I can't understand why some people don't like it. I absolutely love it! It is definitely one of my favourites. There is a feeling of glamour and escapism to it. Yes,the English translation was made to sound a little too self consciously 'hip';but with singing like that,I really couldn't care less! Sony should give it a proper cd release. I know that some other Met recordings from the period have been released recently. The Pristine restoration is excellent though and they do offer a cd set if you want one.
Other favourites include the marvelous 1950 Clemens Krauss and the Emi Boskovsky recording. Some of the Emi Electrola operetta recordings were a bit heavy and operatic in their approach;but the Boskovsky gets it just about right.  Oh and one of the best of all of them;the 1907 'complete' recording (Around 70 mins inc dialogue. No timings with cd!) made in Berlin. This has to be as close to the 'real thing' and the actual premiere of the operetta as you can get. It's an acoustic recording of course,but the sense of fun and sparkle conveyed by the cast is second to none. Dialogue is included. It also includes one of the longest sustained notes I have ever heard on record. Listening via cordless headphones I initially thought the cd had jammed! Incredible breath control. Truly astonishing!! Although I'm sure Yma Sumac would have had nothing to worry about! ;D Preiser have released this on cd and I only wish they would release some of the other acoustic sets from that era.
I have also collected a load of other operetta recordings,including the emi Zeller Der Vogelhandler,which I used to have on Lp and the recent cd reissue of the celebrated Philps recording with Julius Patzak. A load of Gilbert & Sullivan sets which I didn't have. Also,some more of those wonderful Cantus Lin and Membran sets of Leo Fall,Paul Abraham,Nico Dostal and Rudolf Kattnig,amongst others. Some of the performances are better than others and yes,they are of their period and made for (German) radio productions;but these are recordings that were made by people who were steeped in the actual tradition itself. To get any closer you really do have to listen to cylinder or shellac recordings of individual songs (with a few exceptions,of course) some of them made by the actual performers the works were written for, or,even better, step into a time machine and be able to go to a theatre and watch and listen to an actual production from that era. Unfortunately,that's not possible!! At least it won't be for a while! Who knows?!! ;D
Not so keen on French operetta for some reason;although I do have a soft spot for the Plasson Emi  Orpheus in the Underworld and CBS Grand Duchess of Gerolstein,because I had the Lp's as a teenager (and got taken to a stage production of Gerolstein). The latter unavailable at present except as a (usually) very pricey s/h set with horrible artwork!

Anyway,Happy New Year to everyone here!! :)

The programme of the Neujahrskonzert 2016 was finally announced; I'm very glad Mariss Jansons will come back to conduct the Wiener Philharmoniker for the concert, he is a wonderful interpreter of the Viennese waltz and he always choose very beautiful pieces (how he did this time again). The opening is a Robert Stolz's march, I don't know that composition, so I'm looking forward to listening to it; that's also great that, apart from the Strauss Family, there are Ziehrer, Waldteufel and a Hellmesberger all together in the programme; eight pieces for Johann Strauss II:

Conductor
Mariss Jansons 
Orchestra
Wiener Philharmoniker
Chorus
Wiener Sängerknaben

Robert Stolz
Uno-Marsch
Johann Strauss, Jr.
Schatz-Walzer, op. 418
Violetta, Polka francaise, op. 404
Vergnügungszug, Polka-schnell, op. 281
Carl Michael Ziehrer
Weaner Madl'n, Walzer op. 388
Eduard Strauss
Mit Extrapost, Galopp, op. 259

-- Pause --

Johann Strauss, Jr.
Ouvertüre zu Eine Nacht in Venedig (Wiener Fassung)
Eduard Strauss
Ausser Rand und Band, Polka schnell, op. 168
Josef Strauss
Sphärenklänge, Walzer, op. 235
Johann Strauss, Jr.
Sängerslust, Polka francaise, op. 328
Josef Strauss
Auf Ferienreisen, Polka schnell, op. 133
Johann Strauss, Jr.
Fürstin Ninetta - Entr'acte zwischen 2. und 3. Akt
Èmile Waldteufel
Espana, Walzer, op. 236
Josef Hellmesberger sen.
Ball-Szene
Johann Strauss, sen.
Seufzer-Galopp, op. 9
Josef Strauss
Die Libelle, Polka mazur, op. 204
Johann Strauss, Jr.
Kaiser-Walzer, op. 437
Auf der Jagd. Polka schnell, op. 373

Posted in the "What are you listening to now" thread,a little while ago. I've been going through all my recordings of Die Fledermaus and I got to this less well known recording,which,judging by posts on Amazon,appears to have some admirers. Now,if only emi would reissue the Hollreiser Der Zigeunerbaron!

"This 1963 recording of Die Fledermaus spent years in s/h Lp limbo before it was finally reissued on cd. It's now deleted with sellers asking the usual ridiculous prices. As to the performance? It's very good indeed. Stellar performances by a stellar cast. No Frosch,though! The booklet explains the decision to ban Frosch and I can understand the reasoning,even though a part of me is thinking,"What other characters could you expunge from an opera or operetta because you think a recording would be better without them?" An excellent recording,yes. But I'm afraid,for me at least;Die Fledermaus doesn't seem quite the same without Frosch!" :(

(http://i.imgur.com/yd8Yv2D.jpg)

Minor Gripes aside,this is definitely one of the finest recordings of this operetta I have heard. The singing is really top notch. Wonderful characterful performances. There is a spontaneity and gaiety to the performances and the playing. This recording should be rated up there with the very best. I also like the way the reissue was faithful to the original artwork. The Robert Stolz recording is equally underrated. That one is going on next!! :)

(http://i.imgur.com/yd8Yv2D.jpg)

I'm listening to the 1964 recording of Die Fledermaus conducted by Robert Stolz. This one is,imho,one of the best recordings of this operetta,with a truly vintage cast. The singing is full of character,Stolz's conducting is fantastic,bringing out all the fun and gaiety of this wonderful score. An excellent recording,imho! :) :) :)

(http://i.imgur.com/e2H1yMS.jpg)

In a word,'fun'! Not one for miserable sods;but if you like listening to famous opera singers letting their hair down,this is grreeeat!!
Havergal Brian next,as I've spent the last few days listening to practically every recording of Die Fledermaus you can think of;and I need something different....something cerebral and cryptic!! ::) ;D

(http://i.imgur.com/ZwxzUHE.jpg)

My list of the best 'Complete' Die Fledermaus recordings!

1907 Bruno Seidler-Winkler     Complete with dialogue,probably the best one of all,acoustic technology limitations aside. As near as it gets to the creative forge! Look at the date!!
                                                 Also notable for the inclusion of one of the longest sustained notes by a soloist I have ever heard in a recording! I thought it was some kind of recording
                                                 gimmick (in 1907?) at first;or the cd had frozen! But it is genuine,truly incredible breath control! Wow! At any rate;if recording technology had somehow
                                                 advanced a few decades more quickly than it did;I think this recording might,very well,be my top choice!!

1950 Clemens Krauss              No dialogue,but who cares when it's as good as this. Simply marvellous! I love the inclusion of the 'Gala scene' on the Nimbus set. Expertly done;with 'party
                                                pieces' from Schwarzkopf,amongst others. Yes.Lehar,I know? But it makes up for the absence of dialogue,by adding some party ambience to the proceedings.

1955 Schwarzkopf/Karajan      Rudolf Christ's Orlofsky is the one disappointment,but he's not a disaster like Rebroff's falsetto in Carlos Kleiber's recording ??? and,at least,he does sound
                                                 genuinely bored;unlike some. I prefer a female soloist,though. It also includes the best,and funniest sounding Frosch on record;and shows exactly why Danon
                                                 (see below) was wrong to exclude him!

1972 Böhm                              Some think he's a bit too serious,but I don't see it as a problem. No dialogue,but the performances are stellar!
                                                Update: Dec 7th 2017: Changed my mind!! ::) ;D
                                                Yes,the singing is good;but the whole recording is devoid of the essential party spirit,and joy this genre needs! Karl Böhm hasn't got a clue,and should have
                                                stuck to what he's good at!

1964 Robert Stolz                   The underrated Stolz really knew his operetta,and actually met Johann Strauss. Vintage performances and conducting. One of the very best recordings!

1963 Oscar Danon                   Another underrated set. It has it's fans,though. Stellar performances & conducting. One of the best recordings. No Frosch,though! ::) He got banned!! ::) :(
                                                I can understand some of the reasoning outlined in the booklet;but Die Fledermaus isn't really Die Fledermaus,without Frosch,imho!!

1950/51 Ormandy                   This recording in English gets some flak on the internet,for it's attempts to make the wording a little more chic!. I had the old Columbia Lps and I love it,for all it's
                                                it's eccentricities. Lily Pons and Martha Lipton are particularly great! :) You can buy a download,or cd (cd-r?) from Pristine;but I wish Sony would give it an
                                                an 'official' release. A pity the recording excluded the dialogue. Although,there are a few brief snatches,here and there.

1960 Ackermann                      A very good recording. The coughing is a little overdone,and just a teeny bit annoying, in the third act ::) ::);but I like the additional care taken over the
                                                dialogue and scene setting.

1972 Boskovsky                       An excellent recording. Dietrich Fischer-Dieskau is surprisingly good. But I've always enjoyed his instantly recognisable voice.
                                               
1949 Fricsay                            This gets some praise on the internet. It's certainly very well sung,but didn't 'do' it for me! The fact that they are having a party and the acoustics sound like
                                                a big,dead empty room doesn't help matters!

                                                Update Dec 7th 2017. I recently acquired the new Audite set of this recording. I had the Dg set. The new Audite set is cleaner,and reveals more detail.
                                                Quite frankly,my original verdict was a load of rubbish!! ::) ;D The Fricsay is one of the very best. I would even put it alongside the Karajan recording
                                                with Schwarzkopf;and with a better Orlofsky! The soloists are superb. The recording has loads of atmosphere (a big,dead,empty room?!!! ::)) Another
                                                plus,is the dialogue,which as the booklet says,is treated like a 'radio play',instead of a;'this just needs to be done','read-through'!! Magnificent!!
                   

1960 Karajan/Decca                Again,what kind of misery doesn't enjoy this?! Fun;and there is a stage tradition here,of course. An excellent recording,anyway;'Gala scene',or not!
                                                Erika Köth is on her best,quavery,form,I might add!! And think! If you don't like the Gala Scene here,it could be allot worse? They'd probably add some hip-hop
                                                if they did a recording like this,today!
                                       

Program of the 2018 New Year Concert of the Vienna Philharmonic conducted by Riccardo Muti

Johann Strauss, Jr.
Einzugsmarsch aus der Operette ,,Der Zigeunerbaron", ohne op.

Josef Strauss
Wiener Fresken. Walzer, op. 249

Johann Strauss, Jr.
Brautschau. Polka, op. 417
Leichtes Blut. Polka schnell, op. 319

Johann Strauss, sen.
Marienwalzer, op.212
Wilhelm Tell Galopp, op. 29b

Franz von Suppé
Ouvertüre zu "Boccaccio"

Johann Strauss, Jr.
Myrthenblüten. Walzer, op. 395

Alphons Czibulka
Stephanie-Gavotte, op. 312

Johann Strauss, Jr.
Freikugeln. Polka schnell, op. 326
Tales from the Vienna Woods, Waltz, op. 325
Fest-Marsch, op. 452
Stadt und Land. Polka mazur, op. 322
Un ballo in maschera. Quadrille, op. 272
Rosen aus dem Süden. Walzer, op. 388

Josef Strauss
Eingesendet. Polka schnell, op. 240

Quote from: Lisztianwagner on December 16, 2011, 12:15:23 PMI've never considered Strausses compositions as "light music", but always as an intense, passionate and powerfully emotional expression of the viennese nature: those stunning works (especially the waltzes), with that hauting rythm and amazing orchestration, which create almost descrptive moments, are certainly much more than "dancing music".

So well said, I agree wholeheartedly! His music always lights me up inside, and I'm very grateful for this.

Someone said here (I don't remember in which thread anymore) that playing Strauss family pieces in a concert hall during Neujahrskonzert is a bad idea, as this isn't the kind of music that lends itself to it. I disagree with this. Of course it's true that their music is much better for dancing than for listening calmly on a seat - but does it automatically mean it's bad for the latter? No; it's just not the intended way of enjoying it, but it doesn't make it a wrong way. I personally love both dancing to Strauss' music and getting lost in it while sitting still.

And I'd love nothing more than to attend a Neujahrskonzert someday - to enjoy that music while surrounded by beauty, elegance and perfect acoustics. Plus I understand how one might find it silly or even uncalled for, but for me, the first time I saw on tv all those formally dressed guests clapping to Radetzky March as it was playing... it was magical, and always is. I love the concept of a concerto with a bit more lightness to it than is usual. Perfect for a new year celebration!

PS. I'm really sad to see Lisztianwagner is unactive since years now. It's a pity we can't talk Strauss, but I'm thankful for all the beautiful posts I can still read here.

Quote from: Pizzicato-Polka on March 24, 2022, 07:29:36 AM
Someone said here (I don't remember in which thread anymore) that playing Strauss family pieces in a concert hall during Neujahrskonzert is a bad idea, as this isn't the kind of music that lends itself to it.

That was probably me. Listening to the Strauss family music in a stiff and still manner is what I call "the Brucknerization of the Strausses" which in my book is an abomination. Andre Rieu's concerts are much more akin to the original spirit of that music, which was intended for real dancing and genuine merriment.  ;D

That being said, I enjoy the New Year Concert of the VP as much as anyone else.

Quote from: Florestan on March 24, 2022, 08:09:26 AMAndre Rieu's concerts are much more akin to the original spirit of that music, which was intended for real dancing and genuine merriment.  ;D

That being said, I enjoy the New Year Concert of the VP as much as anyone else.

I see, I just find that both events are (or rather can be) people having fun, just in much different ways. I mean, I definitely am listening to classical music for enjoyment, and I'm having utmost fun when I have an occasion to sit stiffly  :D  in an opera/concert hall. If in the end people enjoy themselves and the music, there's nothing abominable about it, imo. But to each their own! And of course I can understand why you think so when sometimes the camera at a Neujahrskonzert will pan to a clearly bored spectator, haha! But I'd hope these are the minority.

Don't know where else to post it.

Vienna Philharmonic New Year 2023 Concert (https://www.wienerphilharmoniker.at/en/konzerte/new-years-concert/10249/)

The program is heavily dominated by Josef Strauss, probably because this year he'd have turned 195.  ;D

Also, good to see Ziehrer, Helmesberger, Jr. and Franz von Suppe on the list. An exciting program which should be fun to hear and watch, not least because of the genial and unassuming Welser-Moest's conducting style.

Quote from: Florestan on December 16, 2022, 10:58:00 AMDon't know where else to post it.

Vienna Philharmonic New Year 2023 Concert (https://www.wienerphilharmoniker.at/en/konzerte/new-years-concert/10249/)

The program is heavily dominated by Josef Strauss, probably because this year he'd have turned 195.  ;D

Also, good to see Ziehrer, Helmesberger, Jr. and Franz von Suppe on the list. An exciting program which should be fun to hear and watch, not least because of the genial and unassuming Welser-Moest's conducting style.

Indeed, very Josef Strauss-centric! Apart from the Aquarellen-Walzer, they have chosen all new pieces never performed before at the New Year's Concert; there will be certainly a lot of fun, I'm looking forward to watching it!

Quote from: Lisztianwagner on December 16, 2022, 11:17:59 AMIndeed, very Josef Strauss-centric!

Not a bad thing, actually. I think musically he was at least on a par with his more famous brother Johann II and, in contrast to the latter, he was a polymath.

Quote from: WikipediaHe received training as an engineer, and worked for the city of Vienna as an engineer and designer. He designed a horse-drawn revolving brush street-sweeping vehicle and published two textbooks on mathematical subjects.[1] Strauss had talents as an artist, painter, poet, dramatist, singer, composer and inventor.[2]

Not many composers can boast such a broad list of extra-musical interests and achievements.

Quote from: Florestan on December 16, 2022, 10:58:00 AMDon't know where else to post it.

Vienna Philharmonic New Year 2023 Concert (https://www.wienerphilharmoniker.at/en/konzerte/new-years-concert/10249/)

The program is heavily dominated by Josef Strauss, probably because this year he'd have turned 195.  ;D

Also, good to see Ziehrer, Helmesberger, Jr. and Franz von Suppe on the list. An exciting program which should be fun to hear and watch, not least because of the genial and unassuming Welser-Moest's conducting style.

Thanks for this, it's great to see Josef dominating and Eduard represented by more than the usual solitary contribution but why, oh why they don't programme a couple of his lovely waltzes I have no idea - enough have been recorded now to dispel the myth that he was a talentless irrelevance: I've got close on 90 of his works and the best of them would grace any New Year concert...

;)

This is the most uncommon NYD programme I have ever seen. I think I have heard (or even heard of) only two pieces, "Aquarellen" and probably the Gypsy Baron Quadrille (not quite sure, there are several potpourri quadrilles). "Daring" might be misleading, but I guess their might be a few watchers/audience not recognizing a piece before the encores.

Quote from: Albion on December 16, 2022, 11:41:09 AMThanks for this, it's great to see Josef dominating and Eduard represented by more than the usual solitary contribution but why, oh why they don't programme a couple of his lovely waltzes I have no idea - enough have been recorded now to dispel the myth that he was a talentless irrelevance: I've got close on 90 of his works and the best of them would grace any New Year concert...

;)

Marco Polo/Naxos recorded and released the complete works of Johann I, Johann II and Josef (I have them all). Why they didn't do the same with Eduard is beyond me. The market would have been the same, ie quite large methinks.

Regarding the opera and operettas, this completely passed me by (released in 2021) - filling a major gap in the discography: Waldmeister (1895) on Naxos! What a superb score this is (with a stunning main waltz), greatly admired by Brahms and Hanslick. So, there are now only a few gaps* to fill -

Indigo (1871)*
Der Karneval in Rom (1873) - CPO 777405-2
Der Fledermaus (1874) - take your pick
Cagliostro in Wien (1875)*
Prinz Methusalem (1877) - CPO 777747-2
Blindekuh (1878) - Naxos 8.660434-35
Das Spitzentuch der Konigin (1880) - CPO 777406-2
Der Lustige Krieg (1881) - ORF Production CD240
Eine Nacht in Venedig (1883) several, using different versions including the revision by Korngold
Der Zigeunerbaron (1885) - take your pick
Simplicius (1887) - EMI 0724355700926
Ritter Pasman (1892) - Orfeo C200062
Furstin Ninetta (1893)- Naxos 8.660227-28
Jabuka (1894) - Naxos 8.660216-17
Waldmeister (1895) - Naxos 8.660489-90
Die Gottin der Vernunft (1897) - Naxos 8.660280-81

When I first started collecting Johann Strauss over 40 years ago I would never have dreamt that we would have nearly all of the stage-works commercially recorded!

 :)

There are a bunch of Polkas for events of the Technical University of Vienna (Polytechnikum) with titles like Elektromagnetische Polka etc.
Josef was supposed to be the brother with a "real job" (civil engineer) but then drafted back into the family music business; in the end probably overworking himself to an unfortunate early death.

Quote from: Florestan on December 16, 2022, 11:48:05 AMMarco Polo/Naxos recorded and released the complete works of Johann I, Johann II and Josef (I have them all). Why they didn't do the same with Eduard is beyond me. The market would have been the same, ie quite large methinks.

Yep, I've got all those lined up on the shelves as well. However, they did do two splendid discs of Eduard under John Georgiadis and five of Ziehrer - but anybody who loves this repertoire always wants more...

;)

Quote from: Jo498 on December 16, 2022, 11:44:01 AMThis is the most uncommon NYD programme I have ever seen. I think I have heard (or even heard of) only two pieces, "Aquarellen" and probably the Gypsy Baron Quadrille (not quite sure, there are several potpourri quadrilles).

The Zigeunerbaron-Quadrille has never been performed at the Vienna New Year's Concert, this is going to be the first time; from that operetta, just the ouverture and Einzugsmarsch have already been played.

Quote from: Albion on December 16, 2022, 11:53:56 AMthey did do two splendid discs of Eduard under John Georgiadis and five of Ziehrer

I missed the Eduard, will look for them.

I have about 10 discs (I think) of Ziehrer, not on Naxos but on an Austrian label (I think) played by an Austrian dedicated orchestra conducted by one Hans Schadenbauer, all discs arranged thematically. For instance:

(https://www.mueller-spring.ch/cd/media/image/product/315917/lg/ziehrer-carl-michael-1843-1922-wiener-lebn-und-wiener-leut-original-c-m-ziehrer-orchester-hans-schadenbauer-pr91288.jpg) (https://static.wixstatic.com/media/b6869a_d87b7ba623ff4cf1a79a2e40f42060d1~mv2_d_2817_2837_s_4_2.jpg/v1/fit/w_500,h_500,q_90/file.jpg)

The dances and marches are interspersed with vocal numbers from his operettas. Speaking of which, I have also this gem:

(https://i.scdn.co/image/ab67616d0000b2733250103ef28508fb687b09e7)

I'm glad to encounter a fellow enthusiast for such music.  8)

The Danish Hans-Christian Lumbye is excellent too.

https://www.good-music-guide.com/community/index.php/topic,26195.msg1486295.html#msg1486295 (https://www.good-music-guide.com/community/index.php/topic,26195.msg1486295.html#msg1486295)

Quote from: Lisztianwagner on December 16, 2022, 11:56:04 AMThe Zigeunerbaron-Quadrille has never been performed at the Vienna New Year's Concert, this is going to be the first time; from that operetta, just the ouverture and Einzugsmarsch have already been played.

And an excellent quadrille it is too! I just hope that the conductor doesn't bugger around with the tempos. A quadrille should basically keep more or less the same pulse whether it's 2/4 or 6/8 (as should a set of lancers) - I've heard some truly abominable renditions replete with rits and ridiculous accelerandos (several of these figure on the Marco Polo Johann Strauss II Edition, less so on the Johann I and Josef Editions). Don't play around with the music and try to impose your idiosyncracies on music that does not need it! One of the worst renditions I've ever heard was Eduard's Carmen Quadrille, Op.134 under Mariss Jansons at a New Year concert in 2012 - just an utter travesty. It just sped up, slowed down, sped up, lurched, sped up, slowed down, lurched and then careered to the finish. Bloody crap.

Regarding Eduard, alright, he incinerated the entire Strauss orchestral archive towards the end of his life (paranoid that it would be rifled after his death), leading to the loss of works by his father, himself and his brothers but he was a damn fine composer in his own right. Besides the two excellent volumes on Marco Polo, it is now possible to listen to many scores including:

La belle Helene - Quadrille, Op.14 (1865)
Bahn frei! - Quick polka, Op.45 (1869)
Mit Dampf - Quick polka, Op.70 (1870)
Auf und davon - Quick polka, Op.73 (1871)
Fesche Geister - Waltz, Op.75 (1871)
Doctrinen - Waltz, Op.79 (1872)
Ball-Promessen - Waltz, Op.82 (1872)
Amors Gruss - French polka, Op.83 (1872)
Myrthen-Strausschen - Waltz, Op.87 (1872)
Manuscripte - Waltz, Op.90 (1872)
Interpretationen - Waltz, Op.97 (1873)
Colombine - Polka mazurka, Op.98 (1872)
Madchenlaune - Polka mazurka, Op.99 (1873)
Studenten-Ball-Tanze - Waltz, Op.101 (1873)
Wo Man Lecht und Lebt - Quick polka, Op.108 (1873)
Ohne Aufenthalt - Quick polka, Op.112 (1874)
Die Abonnenten - Waltz, Op.116 (1874)
Weyprecht-Payer - March, Op.120 (1874)
Unter der Enns - Quick polka, Op.121 (1874)
Alpenrose - Polka mazurka, Op.127 (1874)
Knall und Fall - Quick polka, op.132 (1876)
Carmen - Quadrille, Op.134 (1876)
Verdicte - Waltz, Op.137 (1876)
Souvenir de Bade - Quick polka, Op.146 (1876)
Fatiniza - Waltz, Op.147 (1876)
Das Leben ist doch schon - Waltz, Op.150 (1876)
Treuliebchen - French polka, Op.152 (1877)
Schneesternchen - French polka, Op.157 (1877)
Saat und Ernte - Quick polka, Op.159 (1877)
Leuchtkaferln - Waltz, Op.161 (1877)
Opern-Soiree - French polka, Op.162 (1877)
Telephon - French polka, Op.165 (1878)
Reiselust - French polka, Op.166 (1878)
Ausser Rand und Band - Quick polka, Op.168 (1878)
Wien uber alles! - Quick polka, Op.172 (1878)
Mit der Stromung - French polka, Op.174 (1879)
Lustfahrten - Waltz, Op.177 (1879)
Boccacio - Quadrille, Op.180 (1879)
Feuerfunken - Waltz, Op.185 (1880)
Hectograph - Quick polka, Op.186 (1880)
Glockensignale - Waltz, Op.198 (1881)
Schleier und Krone - Waltz, Op.200 (1881)
Faschingsbrief - French polka, Op.203 (1882)
Luftig und Duftig - Quick polka, Op.206 (1882)
Jugendfeuer - Quick polka, Op.210 (1882)
Osterreichs Volker-Treue - March, Op.211 (1882)
Chere amie - French polka, Op.223 (1884)
Mit Vergnugen - Quick polka, Op.228 (1884)
Ohne Bremse - Quick polka, Op.238 (1886)
Um die Wette - Quick polka, Op.241 (1885)
Greeting Waltz on English Airs (1885)
Blauauglein - French polka, Op.254 (1887)
Fur lustige Leut - Waltz, Op.255 (1887)
Myrthenzauber - Waltz, Op.272 (1890)
Electrisch - Quick polka (1895)

:)

Quote from: Florestan on December 16, 2022, 11:25:03 AMNot a bad thing, actually. I think musically he was at least on a par with his more famous brother Johann II and, in contrast to the latter, he was a polymath.

Not many composers can boast such a broad list of extra-musical interests and achievements.

Yes, it is not a bad thing at all; his works are quite poetical and inspired, introspective and mildly melancholic, rather opposite to the vivid, colourful and explosive pieces of his brother Johann. I think Johann Strauss was able to express much poetry and imagination in his waltzes, polkas, etc. too, making them beautifully evocative and far from simple dancing music, but in a different way from Josef Strauss, whose creations sound more tormented (at least for how tormented a waltz or a polka can be), they sound having a brighter component.

Quote from: Albion on December 16, 2022, 12:15:37 PMAnd an excellent quadrille it is too! I just hope that the conductor doesn't bugger around with the tempos. A quarille should basically keep more or less the same pulse whether it's 2/4 or 6/8 - I've heard some truly abominable renditions replete with rits and ridiculous accelerandos (several of these figure on the Marco Polo Johann Strauss II Edition, less so on the Johann I and Josef Editions). Don't play around with the music and try to impose your idiosyncracies on music that does not need it! One of the worst renditions I've ever heard was Eduard's Carmen Quadrille, Op.134 under Mariss Jansons at a New Year concert in 2012 - just an utter travesty. I just sped up, slowed down, sped up, lurched, sped up, slowed down, lurched and then careered to the finish. Bloody crap.

This is actually a good example of what I call "the Brucknerization of the Strausses". I mean, this music was never meant to be performed in a concert hall for reverential, stiff-and-still, formally dressed audience. This is dance music, to have fun with and be entertained by; merriment music to be enjoyed by foot tapping and hand clapping, while imbibing, chatting and flirting. In this respect the VPO New Year Concert is a big travesty. Andre Rieu's concerts are much more akin to what one could have experienced at a Johann Strauss concert, either father or son, not least the violin conducting.

Quote from: Lisztianwagner on December 16, 2022, 12:38:42 PMhis works are quite poetical and inspired, introspective and mildly melancholic

Agreed, but see my post above. They are still dance and merriment music; let's not read too much Bruckner into them.  ;D

Quote from: Florestan on December 16, 2022, 12:06:14 PMI missed the Eduard, will look for them.

I have about 10 discs (I think) of Ziehrer, not on Naxos but on an Austrian label (I think) played by an Austrian dedicated orchestra conducted by one Hans Schadenbauer, all discs arranged thematically. For instance:

(https://www.mueller-spring.ch/cd/media/image/product/315917/lg/ziehrer-carl-michael-1843-1922-wiener-lebn-und-wiener-leut-original-c-m-ziehrer-orchester-hans-schadenbauer-pr91288.jpg) (https://static.wixstatic.com/media/b6869a_d87b7ba623ff4cf1a79a2e40f42060d1~mv2_d_2817_2837_s_4_2.jpg/v1/fit/w_500,h_500,q_90/file.jpg)

The dances and marches are interspersed with vocal numbers from his operettas. Speaking of which, I have also this gem:

(https://i.scdn.co/image/ab67616d0000b2733250103ef28508fb687b09e7)

I'm glad to encounter a fellow enthusiast for such music.  8)

The two Marco Polo discs of Eduard are splendid as are the items on the three Chandos "Vienna Premiere" volumes. As to Ziehrer, I'd love to start collecting this series but money and shelf space are a problem. I've got pretty much what I want from the Marco Polo discs and the magnificent "Wiener Musik" under Robert Stolz which I'm sure that you have: in the 1970s I treasured the beautiful and luxuriously packaged original four boxes of LPs (clicks, jumps, varying pitch and all) but I was pleased to see the recordings reincarnated on twelve CDs (first on Eurodisc and now on RCA)...

:)

Quote from: Albion on December 16, 2022, 12:43:34 PMthe magnificent "Wiener Musik" under Robert Stolz which I'm sure that you have

If you mean this, then yes, I have it.


(https://d1iiivw74516uk.cloudfront.net/eyJidWNrZXQiOiJwcmVzdG8tY292ZXItaW1hZ2VzIiwia2V5IjoiODM2NTQ5NS4xLmpwZyIsImVkaXRzIjp7InJlc2l6ZSI6eyJ3aWR0aCI6OTAwfSwianBlZyI6eyJxdWFsaXR5Ijo2NX0sInRvRm9ybWF0IjoianBlZyJ9LCJ0aW1lc3RhbXAiOjE1MDgxNTY1Mjl9)

Btw, did you notice that Ziehrer is  misspelled as Zierer?

Quote from: Florestan on December 16, 2022, 12:39:26 PMThis is actually a good example of what I call "the Brucknerization of the Strausses". I mean, this music was never meant to be performed in a concert hall for reverential, stiff-and-still, formally dressed audience. This is dance music, to have fun with and be entertained by; merriment music to be enjoyed by foot tapping and hand clapping, while imbibing, chatting and flirting. In this respect the VPO New Year Concert is a big travesty. Andre Rieu's concerts are much more akin to what one could have experienced at a Johann Strauss concert, either father or son, not least the violin conducting.

I like my dance music played straight. You can get away with a certain amount of rubato in the waltzes and even polka mazurkas but for French polkas, quick polkas, galops and quadrilles you just let the music basically play itself and don't intervene.

Here is a parallel article that I wrote on Sullivan -

https://www.gsarchive.net/articles/arrangements/dance_music.html

:)

Yes, the Eurodisc LPs/ CDs got Ziehrer's name right, RCA were obviously less diligent...

 ::)

Quote from: Albion on December 16, 2022, 12:51:36 PMHere is a parallel article that I wrote on Sullivan -

https://www.gsarchive.net/articles/arrangements/dance_music.html (https://www.gsarchive.net/articles/arrangements/dance_music.html)

Saved for later, more attentive reading. Thanks.

It's a pity that the two BASF 1970s double-LP sets conducted by Stolz "Johann Strauss: Come to Ball" and "Johann Strauss in St Petersburg" have not been reissued (I don't know who holds the rights, or indeed if there is any interest in reissuing them now that all the repertoire has been recorded by Marco Polo). At the time these LPs covered a whole range of previously-unrecorded works and were extremely well-played. Stolz in his 90s was truly amazing...

8)

Quote from: Florestan on December 16, 2022, 12:41:14 PMAgreed, but see my post above. They are still dance and merriment music; let's not read too much Bruckner into them.  ;D

;D
Well, of course they are light-hearted tone music and they can't have all the expressive depth, the intensity and the poetical inwardness of the so called 'serious music', like symphonies for example; but the Strausses' music, especially Johann II's and Josef's, has much more dignity than simple dance music; in fact, besides the cheerful element, they can express great beauty, delicacy, as well as they can be immersive and enchantigly depicting when needed, at least in my opinion.
I share Wagner's opinion on this matter, but you'll provably disagree with that, Andrei. ;)

Quote from: Lisztianwagner on December 16, 2022, 01:27:48 PMthe Strausses' music, especially Johann II's and Josef's, has much more dignity than simple dance music; in fact, besides the cheerful element, they can express great beauty, delicacy, as well as they can be immersive and enchantigly depicting when needed, at least in my opinion.
I share Wagner's opinion on this matter, but you'll provably disagree with that, Andrei. ;)

No, I fully agree with you, Ilaria, and not only about the Strausses --- and if this is what Wagner thought, too, then good for him.  :D

Although I have all the Marco Polo Strauss and Ziehrer discs (plus Waldteufel) I'm constantly drawn back to Robert Stolz's incredible 12 CD set of "Wiener Musik", or whatever it's called now. This has to be one of the most intelligently-programmed collections of all time (just as it was on LP): arranged chronologically by composer, arranged for each composer in opus number order. Alright, he tarts up a couple of pieces here and there (such as the harp in Johann II's "Sinngedichte", Op.1) but it's never unidiomatic and is always there to serve the music. When is the next time I will listen to the complete works of Johann I, Johann II or Josef? Probably in the afterlife, but at least I know that they are bending my shelves. Dave Hurwirz strongly recommended this set, with very good reason...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YrEc2Fhe9X4

 ;D

Quote from: Albion on December 16, 2022, 12:59:53 PMIt's a pity that the two BASF 1970s double-LP sets conducted by Stolz "Johann Strauss: Come to Ball" and "Johann Strauss in St Petersburg" have not been reissued (I don't know who holds the rights, or indeed if there is any interest in reissuing them now that all the repertoire has been recorded by Marco Polo). At the time these LPs covered a whole range of previously-unrecorded works and were extremely well-played. Stolz in his 90s was truly amazing...

8)

I learn that these recordings are now with Universal: why the hell don't they do anything with them? They are (or would be) very competitive for anyone wishing to supplement their Stolz "Wiener Musik" box...

 ;)

Geering up for the 2023 New Year's Day Vienna concert with it's Josef Strauss spectacular. I sincerely hope that Welser-Most doesn't muck it up by trying to intervene in the music. Of course, the whole idea of such a straight-laced concert in the "Golden Hall" is totally bloody ridiculous (yep, let's all clap out of time to the "Radetzky March" whilst sitting there like embalmed otters). This year shows serious enterprise in repertoire, which is very welcome indeed: my Dog, there's certainly plenty to choose from - they've not even scraped the surface of truly wonderful stuff by all the Strauss dynasty (including Eduard and Eduard II), Ziehrer, etc. I wish that they would include some Waldteufel, Millocker, Suppe, Komzak and cast their nets wider because all of this wonderful stuff is out there to be given to a bigger audience...

Quote from: Albion on December 27, 2022, 04:16:59 PMI wish that they would include some Waldteufel, Millocker, Suppe, Komzak

Suppe is in the program, actually.

Quote from: Albion on December 27, 2022, 04:16:59 PMGeering up for the 2023 New Year's Day Vienna concert with it's Josef Strauss spectacular. I sincerely hope that Welser-Most doesn't muck it up by trying to intervene in the music. Of course, the whole idea of such a straight-laced concert in the "Golden Hall" is totally bloody ridiculous (yep, let's all clap out of time to the "Radetzky March" whilst sitting there like embalmed otters). This year shows serious enterprise in repertoire, which is very welcome indeed: my Dog, there's certainly plenty to choose from - they've not even scraped the surface of truly wonderful stuff by all the Strauss dynasty (including Eduard and Eduard II), Ziehrer, etc. I wish that they would include some Waldteufel, Millocker, Suppe, Komzak and cast their nets wider because all of this wonderful stuff is out there to be given to a bigger audience...

I sincerely hope that Welser-Most will be able to bring out the right energy and emotions from that music, because, when I saw him conducting the Neujharskozert in 2011 and 2013, he seemed a rather standard conductor, fine, but nothing more.
At least this time, about Josef Strauss, there's a step forward, since they haven't restricted themselves to perform the same few waltzes or polka-mazurkas, they have chosen a more varied repertoire with pieces never played before, apart from Aquarellen-Walzer; but I agree about Eduard Strauss, his music doesn't appear in the program of the Neujharskonzert very often, and when it does, it is always with one or two schnell-polkas.

Quote from: Florestan on December 28, 2022, 12:51:28 AMSuppe is in the program, actually.

Yes, the overture to Isabella is a very welcome inclusion! Not long to go now until we get to hear what Franz Welser-Möst makes of a whole heap of Josef Strauss. I've not been overly impressed with his dance music performances and his EMI Simplicius was a bit of a cold fish (not because of the music). I wish that one year they would give similar prominence to Eduard (taking a temporary break from Bax, Bowen and Moeran and Dog alone knows what else at the moment I'm now onto a "Edi" session) but it still looks like a nice and enterprising programme however you look at it. I generally switch off at the point that The Blue Danube and Radetzky March appear on the horizon and the suits start to swoon and clap out of time - just drop both of them and end with a quick polka or one of Johann II's less well known marches such as the Großfürsten Marsch, Op.107 which is great fun in a jaunty 6/8 (most of Josef's and several of Eduard's sound more designed for the ballet than the parade ground)...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l5qKE-kU_Co

 ;)

What do you think about the Vienna New Year's Concert 2023 then? I liked it very much, it was an inspiring, bright and cheerful performance. Welser-Möst is a conductor who doesn't enthuse me particularly, personally speaking I think, for example, Jansons and Pretre had more involving styles; but he did very fine anyway, all the pieces included in the program were played excellently, with liveliness, but also elegance and perceivable glimpses of poetry, maybe because of the abundance of Josef Strauss.

Quote from: Lisztianwagner on January 01, 2023, 06:26:23 AMWhat do you think about the Vienna New Year's Concert 2023 then? I liked it very much, it was an inspiring, bright and cheerful performance. Welser-Möst is a conductor who doesn't enthuse me particularly, personally speaking I think, for example, Jansons and Pretre had more involving styles; but he did very fine anyway, all the pieces included in the program were played excellently, with liveliness, but also elegance and perceivable glimpses of poetry, maybe because of the abundance of Josef Strauss.

I thought it was splendid overall, and the inclusion of so many novelties made for a really interesting programme: I hope that this policy continues with future conductors prepared to take on "unknown" works. Josef's Allegro Fantastique Orchestral Fantasy was fascinating (was it included in the Marco Polo series? I can't find it without clambering over piles of precarious CDs). The Zigeunerbaron Quadrille suffered from the usual pulling around with tempos. Otherwise I was pleasantly surprised by the warmth of Welser-Most's performances, a big thumbs up...

 ;D

The quadrille is a rather silly piece, most NYD concerts are bound to have some (the ouverture, or Schatzwalzer, or just the Einzugsmarsch would have been much better, but they are of course staples of NYDC). I had to do some meal preparation, so was not always paying full attention, but I also liked it overall quite a bit. That Allegro fantastique deserved to be as known as hungarian rhapsodies or similar pieces and the first? waltz of the program (Heldengedichte) was stunning and should be as well known as Aquarellen or Dynamiden. "Dorfschwalben" is better than "Zeiserln", so I understand that latter was forgotten. But it will probably be the first concert in years I'll be getting the recording of, if only for "Heldengedichte".

Quote from: Albion on January 01, 2023, 08:54:16 AMI thought it was splendid overall, and the inclusion of so many novelties made for a really interesting programme: I hope that this policy continues with future conductors prepared to take on "unknown" works. Josef's Allegro Fantastique Orchestral Fantasy was fascinating (was it included in the Marco Polo series? I can't find it without clambering over piles of precarious CDs). The Zigeunerbaron Quadrille suffered from the usual pulling around with tempos. Otherwise I was pleasantly surprised by the warmth of Welser-Most's performances, a big thumbs up...

 ;D

I agree, he did a better performance than those ones in 2011 and 2013. I appreciated he didn't exaggerate with the rubato in Die Zeisserln and Perlen der Liebe, and the choice of so many premieres was very enchanting; thumb up from me too.
I don't think Allegro Fantastique has been included in the Marco Polo series, I haven't seen it.

Quote from: Albion on January 01, 2023, 08:54:16 AMJosef's Allegro Fantastique Orchestral Fantasy was fascinating

Quote from: Jo498 on January 01, 2023, 09:11:46 AMThat Allegro fantastique deserved to be as known as hungarian rhapsodies or similar pieces and the first? waltz of the program (Heldengedichte) was stunning

Yes to both.

Quote from: Lisztianwagner on January 01, 2023, 09:19:00 AMI agree, he did a better performance than those ones in 2011 and 2013. I appreciated he didn't exaggerate with the rubato in Die Zeisserln and Perlen der Liebe, and the choice of so many premieres was very enchanting; thumb up from me too.
I don't think Allegro Fantastique has been included in the Marco Polo series, I haven't seen it.

Thanks, I didn't recall it figuring in the 26 volumes: so that saves me being buried under a pile of cascading CDs...

 ;)

I absolutely loved the choral piece as well. Those boys and girls were superb and to watch their very different but equally expressive countenances while singing was a delight.

The ballet sequences were enjoyable too.

Big kudos to Mr. Welser-Moest for assembling an unusually interesting program (presented with elegance and cheerfulness). I hope he will be a trendsetter in this respect.

Quote from: Albion on January 01, 2023, 09:33:25 AMThanks, I didn't recall it figuring in the 26 volumes: so that saves me being buried under a pile of cascading CDs...

 ;)

You're welcome.  :)

Quote from: Florestan on January 01, 2023, 09:53:27 AMI absolutely loved the choral piece as well. Those boys and girls were superb and to watch their very different but equally expressive countenances while singing was a delight.

The ballet sequences were enjoyable too.

Big kudos to Mr. Welser-Moest for assembling an unusually interesting program (presented with elegance and cheerfulness). I hope he will be a trendsetter in this respect.

Agreed, the choral part fits surprisingly well to the piece; in my opinion, Strausses polkas usually are better without the chorus and there are few exceptions (Feuerfest-polka, for example) , but in Heiterer Muth this inclusion sounded very beautiful and delightful. Same speech about the ballet sequences, extremely charming.
The conductor of the next Neujahrskonzert is Christian Thielemann, let's see what he will pull out of the hat.

Quote from: Lisztianwagner on January 01, 2023, 10:54:25 AMThe conductor of the next Neujahrskonzert is Christian Thielemann, let's see what he will pull out of the hat.

A mostly Eduard program, perhaps? That would be nice.

There's a recording of the Allegro Fantastique with Johannes Wildner, not on Marco Polo, that has the performance note "Austrian premiere." It must be a real rarity, as that was the only recording available until this concert.

Will have to catch this on streaming to hear some of the rarities like "Heldengedichte".

Quote from: Brian on January 01, 2023, 11:50:14 AMThere's a recording of the Allegro Fantastique with Johannes Wildner, not on Marco Polo, that has the performance note "Austrian premiere." It must be a real rarity, as that was the only recording available until this concert.

Will have to catch this on streaming to hear some of the rarities like "Heldengedichte".

Welser-Most (2023):

https://www.mediafire.com/file/xdd12k708iwo91f/Strauss%252C_Josef_-_Heldengedichte%252C_Waltz%252C_Op.87_%25281860%2529.mp3/file

https://www.mediafire.com/file/1xy1gw4scnqt7mr/Strauss%252C_Josef_-_Allegro_Fantastique%252C_Orchestral_Fantasy.mp3/file

 :)

For those who missed the New Year concert from Vienna, which largely show-cased Josef Strauss (1827-1870), there is a very good video of the broadcast (although for some reason or other the Josef Hellmesberger II's "Glocken-Polka und Galop" appears to be silent - perhaps there was copyright on the bells). As usual, I could do without the ballet sequences but the virtuosity that this music demands is evident: when they're doing second violin on the off-beat in a quick polka it's a bloody wonder that their arms don't simply fall off...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-mxnohip6jI

 :o

Late Bohm can be dreadfully slow but he seems in much better shape conducting the Kaiser-walzer in 1975 with VPO:


Random Karajan trivia: He recorded things 3-4 times often but he recorded the Kaiser-walzer a whopping 7 times. He must really like it.

Quote from: lordlance on July 10, 2023, 11:17:23 AMLate Bohm can be dreadfully slow but he seems in much better shape conducting the Kaiser-walzer in 1975 with VPO:

Random Karajan trivia: He recorded things 3-4 times often but he recorded the Kaiser-walzer a whopping 7 times. He must really like it.

Agreed, excellent performances by Böhm, very nice rubati in central part; it would have been interesting to see him conducting the Viennese New Year's Concert.

Quote from: lordlance on July 10, 2023, 11:17:23 AMRandom Karajan trivia: He recorded things 3-4 times often but he recorded the Kaiser-walzer a whopping 7 times. He must really like it.

Ironically, the Kaiserwalzer in the famous NYD concert 1987 was cut in the first release, due to 1980s playing times but it was of course on the video/laserdisc and has been included in a more recent CD release.

Here's the official program of the New Year's Concert 2024:

Christian Thielemann & Wiener Philharmoniker

Karl Komzák - Erzherzog Albrecht-Marsch, op. 136
Johann Strauß II - Wiener Bonbons. Walzer, op. 307
Johann Strauß II - Figaro-Polka. Polka française, op. 320
Josef Hellmesberger (Sohn) - Für die ganze Welt. Walzer
Eduard Strauß - Ohne Bremse. Polka schnell, op. 238
Johann Strauß II - Ouvertüre zur Operette "Waldmeister"
Johann Strauß II - Ischler Walzer. Nachgelassener Walzer Nr. 2
Johann Strauß II - Nachtigall-Polka, op. 222
Eduard Strauß - Die Hochquelle. Polka mazur, op. 114
Johann Strauß II - Neue Pizzicato-Polka. op. 449
Josef Hellmesberger (Sohn) - Estudiantina-Polka aus dem Ballett "Die Perle von Iberien"
Carl Michael Ziehrer - Wiener Bürger. Walzer, op. 419
Anton Bruckner - Quadrille, WAB 121 (Orchestr. W. Dörner)
Hans Christian Lumbye - Glædeligt Nytaar! Galopp
Josef Strauß Delirien - Walzer, op. 212

Many pleasant surprises which have never been played before at the concert, it seems it will be extremely interesting next year! Honorable mention for Bruckner's Quadrille (I imagine, for the 200th anniversary), it is the first time the Austrian composer is included in the program, how great; I almost hoped there would be some Schönberg too, both because of his 150th anniversary and because he was Viennese, but as a matter of fact his music doesn't match the atmosphere of the concert very much.

Oh my God! The Brucknerization is now complete --- and literal. I was afraid of what Thielemann might do ever since he was nominated as conductor for 2024, and I was right.  ;D

Quote from: Florestan on December 04, 2023, 11:14:29 PMOh my God! The Brucknerization is now complete --- and literal. I was afraid of what Thielemann might do ever since he was nominated as conductor for 2024, and I was right.  ;D

;D

Well, it can't be denied that Thielemann has given a really Germanic mark to the Neujahrskonzert, he's certainly completely different from Pretre. I'm very curious about Bruckner's quadrille, I didn't know he composed that kind of music too.

Quote from: Lisztianwagner on December 05, 2023, 04:00:02 AM;D

Well, it can't be denied that Thielemann has given a really Germanic mark to the Neujahrskonzert, he's certainly completely different from Pretre. I'm very curious about Bruckner's quadrille, I didn't know he composed that kind of music too.

It's a (very probably ad hoc) orchestration of a piano four-hand piece he wrote in 1854. Does Thielemann really believe, or want us to believe, that this ditty puts Bruckner in the same league as Johann Strauss-Sohn, Ziehrer and Lumbye?  ;D 

Quote from: Florestan on December 05, 2023, 04:22:30 AMIt's a (very probably ad hoc) orchestration of a piano four-hand piece he wrote in 1854. Does Thielemann really believe, or want us to believe, that this ditty puts Bruckner in the same league as Johann Strauss-Sohn, Ziehrer and Lumbye?  ;D 

Of course, when it comes to waltzes, polkas, marches, ect, es gibt nur ein König! Anyway it is nice they find a way to celebrate Bruckner's anniversary.

Quote from: Lisztianwagner on December 05, 2023, 11:22:24 AMOf course, when it comes to waltzes, polkas, marches, ect, es gibt nur ein König! Anyway it is nice they find a way to celebrate Bruckner's anniversary.

You menționed Schoenberg too. I'm sure that if Thielemann had been able to find something similar în his oeuvre he'd have used it but it looks like Schoenberg did not write any light music, not even im his youth.  :D

Quote from: Florestan on December 05, 2023, 11:30:03 AMYou menționed Schoenberg too. I'm sure that if Thielemann had been able to find something similar în his oeuvre he'd have used it but it looks like Schoenberg did not write any light music, not even in his youth.  :D

They could have given an orchestration of this:



Or better yet, a New Year's Concert with the Schoenberg Piano Concerto, followed by Bruckner's Fourth. And the Radetzky-Marsch as an encore, of course. That would cause a sensation!  ;D

Quote from: ritter on December 05, 2023, 11:38:45 AMThey could have given an orchestration of this:

Or better yet, a New Year's Concert with the Schoenberg Piano Concerto, followed by Bruckner's Fourth. And the Radetzky-Marsch as an encore, of course. That would cause a sensation!  ;D

I wouldn't be surprised if something like that actually crossed Thielemann's mind for a milisecond.  :D

Quote from: Florestan on December 05, 2023, 11:30:03 AMYou menționed Schoenberg too. I'm sure that if Thielemann had been able to find something similar în his oeuvre he'd have used it but it looks like Schoenberg did not write any light music, not even im his youth.  :D

Yes, I mentioned Schönberg, but at the same time I recognized that his music didn't exactly match the sparkling, joyous atmosphere of the concert. Pity. Anyway I'm not sure Thielemann would have included Schönberg in the program even if there could have been the chance, if I'm not wrong he's not a schönbergian conductor.

Quote from: Florestan on December 05, 2023, 11:41:32 AMI wouldn't be surprised if something like that actually crossed Thielemann's mind for a milisecond.  :D

Do listen to Die Eiserne Brigade, Andrei! It should be right up your alley, and might help you have a more benign attitude towards poor old Annie...

Quote from: ritter on December 05, 2023, 11:38:45 AMThey could have given an orchestration of this:

Or better yet, a New Year's Concert with the Schoenberg Piano Concerto, followed by Bruckner's Fourth. And the Radetzky-Marsch as an encore, of course. That would cause a sensation!  ;D

I wish!  ;D

Quote from: ritter on December 05, 2023, 11:46:40 AMDo listen to Die Eiserne Brigade, Andrei! It should be right up your alley, and might help you have a more benign attitude towards poor old Annie...

I will. And hey, you know me by now, shouldn't take seriously everyting I write.  ;)

Quote from: Florestan on December 05, 2023, 11:49:42 AMI will. And hey, you know me by now, shouldn't take seriously everyting I write.  ;)

I take almost nothing you write seriously, Andrei, don't you worry!

Just kidding, you know I have you in high esteem and appreciate your contributions (even those praising Offenbach ;) ).

Un abrazo,

Schönberg arranged loads of Johann Strauss waltzes! He just did it for smaller chamber ensembles, not appropriate for that occasion. It was how he paid the bills for quite some time.  8)

loads = 3, Kaiserwalzer, Rosen aus dem Süden and Lagunenwalzer

https://www.schoenberg.at/index.php/de/faq/walzer-von-johann-strauss

IIRC Abbado had some Mozart dances in the 1991 concert because of the anniversary and he included also a bit of Schubert (orch. Webern! they did this to make some money!)

Welser Möst had 2 pieces by Richard Strauss a few years ago. I think Thielemann should have included the scherzo from Bruckner's 4th!

Jansons had some Mozart in 2006 for the anniversary too.

The Scherzo from the 4th Symphony would have been extraordinary! It is also as long as a Strauss' overture, more or less, so it wouldn't have taken too much time....

Yes, it's probably the most popular Bruckner piece and about as long as the longest waltzes like Emperor waltz. But they probably still thought it would be too much for a NYD concert.

Quote from: Brian on December 05, 2023, 12:00:09 PMSchönberg arranged loads of Johann Strauss waltzes! He just did it for smaller chamber ensembles, not appropriate for that occasion. It was how he paid the bills for quite some time.  8)

Just like Wagner in Paris, arranging Bellini's hits for violin duet.  :D

Quote from: Florestan on December 06, 2023, 02:14:10 AMJust like Wagner in Paris, arranging Bellini's Donizetti's hits for violin duet.  :D

Fixed that for you... :) What he did with Bellini was compose an alternate bass aria for Norma, and do some retouching of the orchestration for that opera and for Il Pirata, but I suspect these were for purely practical performance reasons (and predate his stay in Paris).

As for Schoenberg, AFAIK his waltz arrangements were to raise funds for the floundering Society for Private Musical Performances, which ceased its activities anyway. I doubt good old Arnold managed to buy a villa with the proceeds of those arrangements... ;D

Quote from: ritter on December 06, 2023, 03:36:14 AMFixed that for you... :) What he did with Bellini was compose an alternate bass aria for Norma, and do some retouching of the orchestration for that opera and for Il Pirata, but I suspect these were for purely practical performance reasons (and predate his stay in Paris).

Thanks, I stand corrected. I see that besides Donizetti he also made arrangements of Halevy's and Auber's operas.  :D

Schönberg's arrangements of Strauss are extremely delightful pieces, with an expressive, colourful orchestration which brilliantly compensates the absence of most of the instruments of a original works; they aren't exactly as poetic, graceful and suggestive as Strauss' waltzes (at least, in my opinion), but they are really ravishing, airy and sparkling. Least, but not last, they are persuasive not to forget the Viennese spirit in the atmosphere they evoke. Unfortunately they can't be played at the Neujahrskonzert as at that point, the Wiener Philharmoniker might as well perform directly the original waltzes.

I quite like the Kaiserwalzer because there he used real woodwinds instead of harmonium.

I heard the Kaiserwalzer arrangement live in concert (Klangforum Wien under Sylvain Cambreling) and it felt interminable  ::) . Fortunately, the rest of the programme (Stravinsky's Japanese Lyrics, Ravel's Mallarmé Songs, and  Pierrot Lunaire —all with Christine Schäfer) was memorable.

Actually, I don't like the Kaiserwalzer in the original either (or any Strauss waltzes, for that matter), so I apologise to all for posting on a thread where I have no positive contribution to make... :-[

Quote from: Jo498 on December 06, 2023, 11:40:01 AMI quite like the Kaiserwalzer because there he used real woodwinds instead of harmonium.

Kaiser-Walzer is my favourite Schönberg's arrangement for the same reason.

Quote from: ritter on December 06, 2023, 11:59:31 AMI heard the Kaiserwalzer arrangement live in concert (Klangforum Wien under Sylvain Cambreling) and it felt interminable  ::) . Fortunately, the rest of the programme (Stravinsky's Japanese Lyrics, Ravel's Mallarmé Songs, and  Pierrot Lunaire —all with Christine Schäfer— was memorable).

Actually, I don't like the Kaiserwalzer in the original either (or any Strauss waltzes, for that matter), so I apologise to all for posting on a thread where I have no positive contribution to make... :-[

cough*heresy*cough

Joking aside, no problem, any polite contribution is gladly accepted.

Wow, such a spectacular Pierrot Lunaire! Schäfer, with Boulez, recorded my favourite version of that Schönberg's work.

I love the Kaiserwalzer, partly because I played it (badly) with orchestra in high school.
Schönberg adds/highlights an allusion to Haydn's Emperor hymn in the coda, although I still prefer the original. I hadn't really been aware of the Lagunenwalzer arrangement because my recording with the Boston chamber players doesn't have it.

The Viennese New Year's Concert 2024 was enchanting and lively as well as full of lovely surprises, I appreciated a lot that the programm included so many works never played before (Strauss' Figaro-Polka and Ischler-Walzer, Lumbye's Galopp were awe inspiring; Bruckner's Quadrille was so nice, light and graceful, so different from his powerful and impressive symphonies); the Wiener Philharmoniker performed all the pieces amazingly, but in fact they master this kind of music superbly. Thielemann's conducting was quite beautiful and elegant, sometimes very poetical, but unfortunately also a bit too serious and austere, he didn't convey an atmosphere which evoked a great impression of joy and cheerfulness; in this case, Jansons and Prêtre were much better.

Quote from: Lisztianwagner on January 01, 2024, 06:02:21 AMBruckner's Quadrille was so nice, light and graceful

I believe this is to be credited to the orchestration. I'm not sure the original 4-hand piano piece would have had the same effect.

QuoteThielemann's conducting was quite beautiful and elegant, sometimes very poetical, but unfortunately also a bit too serious and austere, he didn't convey an atmosphere which evoked a great impression of joy and cheerfulness

My thoughts exactly. Joy and cheerfulness are not quite Thielemann's thing.

All in all, this year's concert was not among the best but enjoyable nevertheless.

Quote from: Florestan on January 01, 2024, 06:21:05 AMI believe this is to be credited to the orchestration. I'm not sure the original 4-hand piano piece would have had the same effect.

My thoughts exactly. Joy and cheerfulness are not quite Thielemann's thing.

All in all, this year's concert was not among the best but enjoyable nevertheless.

Probably, changings in instrumentation always have an effect on the result, the orchestration could have made Bruckner's Quadrille airier compared to the original 4-hand piano version (but I don't know this latter one).

Yes, the Viennese New Year's Concert doesn't seem exactly Thielemann's cup of tea.

Next year, it is said that Riccardo Muti will be the conductor.

Quote from: Lisztianwagner on January 01, 2024, 06:48:46 AMthe Viennese New Year's Concert doesn't seem exactly Thielemann's cup of tea.

Precisely. He's much more at ease in "serious" repertoire. It's probably a question of personality. Nevertheless, he wasn't dull or disagreeable at all.

Quote from: Lisztianwagner on January 01, 2024, 06:48:46 AMNext year, it is said that Riccardo Muti will be the conductor.

A very different personality with a vastly greater experience in the New Year concert.

Quote from: Florestan on December 04, 2023, 11:14:29 PMOh my God! The Brucknerization is now complete --- and literal. I was afraid of what Thielemann might do ever since he was nominated as conductor for 2024, and I was right.  ;D

I see there's already been a conversation, but I can still add: it is a light dance, of course:

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLnX2GfEScH0FzMOOzFrelip8WIWN7eATu

Happy New Year, Andrei!

Quote from: Karl Henning on January 01, 2024, 07:48:29 AMI see there's already been a conversation, but I can still add: it is a light dance, of course:

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLnX2GfEScH0FzMOOzFrelip8WIWN7eATu

Very enjoyable!

Quote from: Karl Henning on January 01, 2024, 07:48:29 AMI see there's already been a conversation, but I can still add: it is a light dance, of course:

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLnX2GfEScH0FzMOOzFrelip8WIWN7eATu

Happy New Year, Andrei!

Happy New Year, Karl!

2025 will be the 200th anniversary of the birth of Johann Strauss II, one of the greatest and most famous Austrian composers, and more than half of the upcoming New Year's Concert is dedicated to him; besides An der schönen blauen Donau, on the programm there are Demolirer polka. Polka française, op. 269, Lagunen-Walzer, op. 411, Overture to the operetta "Der Zigeunerbaron", Accelerationen. Walzer, op. 234, Annen-Polka, op. 117, Entweder - oder! Polka schnell, op. 403, Tritsch-Tratsch. Polka schnell, op. 214 and Wein, Weib und Gesang. Walzer, op. 333. All of them are undoubtedly fantastic works, but Muti certainly chose to play conservative this time.

Ever since I was a teen Joh. Strauss Jr has enlivened many an otherwise dull or dour evening. I hold him as one of Music's best tunemeisters ever (along with Mozart, Schubert and Bizet). My disc collection will always have a place for his irresistible confections.

Quote from: André on December 31, 2024, 03:34:42 PMEver since I was a teen Joh. Strauss Jr has enlivened many an otherwise dull or dour evening. I hold him as one of Music's best tunemeisters ever (along with Mozart, Schubert and Bizet). My disc collection will always have a place for his irresistible confections.

There's a superb Naxos Complete Orchestral Works series, in case you missed it.  ;D

Quote from: Florestan on December 31, 2024, 03:37:01 PMThere's a superb Naxos Complete Orchestral Works series, in case you missed it.  ;D

Oh my goodness, 52 discs!  :o  ;D  :) Amazingly, it sounds tempting.  ;D

(https://d1iiivw74516uk.cloudfront.net/eyJidWNrZXQiOiJwcmVzdG8tY292ZXItaW1hZ2VzIiwia2V5IjoiNzk5NjI1OS4xLmpwZyIsImVkaXRzIjp7InJlc2l6ZSI6eyJ3aWR0aCI6MzAwfSwid2VicCI6eyJxdWFsaXR5Ijo2NX0sInRvRm9ybWF0Ijoid2VicCJ9LCJ0aW1lc3RhbXAiOjEyOTc4NzI1NTJ9)

Quote from: Florestan on December 31, 2024, 03:37:01 PMThere's a superb Naxos Complete Orchestral Works series, in case you missed it.  ;D

Quote from: Franco_Manitobain on December 31, 2024, 03:49:11 PMOh my goodness, 52 discs!  :o  ;D  :) Amazingly, it sounds tempting.  ;D

(https://d1iiivw74516uk.cloudfront.net/eyJidWNrZXQiOiJwcmVzdG8tY292ZXItaW1hZ2VzIiwia2V5IjoiNzk5NjI1OS4xLmpwZyIsImVkaXRzIjp7InJlc2l6ZSI6eyJ3aWR0aCI6MzAwfSwid2VicCI6eyJxdWFsaXR5Ijo2NX0sInRvRm9ybWF0Ijoid2VicCJ9LCJ0aW1lc3RhbXAiOjEyOTc4NzI1NTJ9)

It really is, that box set is a true gem!

A used copy is for sale on this forum  ;)

Quote from: Lisztianwagner on December 31, 2024, 04:01:04 PMIt really is, that box set is a true gem!

I collected every disc of the Johann Strauss II Edition when they came out originally on Marco Polo. I also have the complete Johann Strauss I and Josef Strauss Editions, together with the 3 Eduard Strauss CDs, the 11 Waldteufel CDs, the 5 Ziehrer CDs and the 6 volumes of Franz von Suppe overtures. This is all simply just great music and eternal gratitude is due to Marco Polo and Naxos for maintaining very high standards of recording and presentation throughout these landmark projects...

Listening to the NYD concert from Vienna, the veteran conductor Riccardo Muti is doing a fantastic job (he's 83 and this is his 7th New Year concert!). The programme is short on novelties but is well-balanced and showcases some of Johann II's finest scores, including the overture to "Der Zigeunerbaron". I would like to see more Ziehrer, Kálmán, Oscar Straus and Lehar being promoted...

I'm so glad that I invested in the VPO box covering the performed NYD repertoire up until 2015 (Sony). Every one of the 23 discs is a delight and I especially love the way in which the engineers have elided applause seamlessly from number to number in spite of the often wide discrepancy in recording dates...

 8)

Quote from: Brian on December 31, 2024, 06:54:39 PMA used copy is for sale on this forum  ;)

 :o

Quote from: Albion on January 01, 2025, 03:26:39 AMListening to the NYD concert from Vienna, the veteran conductor Riccardo Muti is doing a fantastic job (he's 83 and this is his 7th New Year concert!). The programme is short on novelties but is well-balanced and showcases some of Johann II's finest scores, including the overture to "Der Zigeunerbaron". I would like to see more Ziehrer, Kálmán, Oscar Straus and Lehar being promoted...

Very nice concert. I loved Muti's minimal conducting gestures. It's as if he told the whole world: Hey, these guys and girls have the music in their blood, they need me only for fun and fun I will give. Very enjoyable.

Quote from: Albion on January 01, 2025, 03:26:39 AMListening to the NYD concert from Vienna, the veteran conductor Riccardo Muti is doing a fantastic job (he's 83 and this is his 7th New Year concert!). The programme is short on novelties but is well-balanced and showcases some of Johann II's finest scores, including the overture to "Der Zigeunerbaron". I would like to see more Ziehrer, Kálmán, Oscar Straus and Lehar being promoted...

Quote from: Florestan on January 01, 2025, 05:04:04 AMVery nice concert. I loved Muti's minimal conducting gestures. It's as if he told the whole world: Hey, these guys and girls have the music in their blood, they need me only for fun and fun I will give. Very enjoyable.

Agreed, it was surely a very enchanting concert; Muti conducted excellentlly, his gesturality was collected and measured, but he was able to convey the right lively spirit to the orchestra and to the audience anyway. The Wiener Philharmoniker played with high quality as usual. The programme was brilliant and cheerful, although a bit conservative, I would have liked if the 200th anniversary of Johann Strauss II had been celebrated with some new pieces never played before, but certainly nothing can be criticized to splendid works like Lagunen-Walzer, Annen-Polka or Wein, Weib und Gesang.

Next year the conductor will be Yannick Nézet-Séguin, I didn't know he also had the Viennese waltzes in his repertoire; interesting choice.

It was a clever move to frame the programme between Freiheits-Marsch and Radetzky-Marsch (the Marseillaise of the conservatives, as I've seen it dubbed rather witty I don't remember when, where and by whom).  :laugh:

I quite enjoyed the radio broadcast of this year's New Year's Concert. For me the highlight was Josef's Dorfschwalben aus Österreich. Walzer, op. 164, a piece that I wasn't previously aware of.

Quote from: Franco_Manitobain on December 31, 2024, 03:49:11 PMOh my goodness, 52 discs!  :o  ;D  :) Amazingly, it sounds tempting.  ;D

(https://d1iiivw74516uk.cloudfront.net/eyJidWNrZXQiOiJwcmVzdG8tY292ZXItaW1hZ2VzIiwia2V5IjoiNzk5NjI1OS4xLmpwZyIsImVkaXRzIjp7InJlc2l6ZSI6eyJ3aWR0aCI6MzAwfSwid2VicCI6eyJxdWFsaXR5Ijo2NX0sInRvRm9ybWF0Ijoid2VicCJ9LCJ0aW1lc3RhbXAiOjEyOTc4NzI1NTJ9)

@Lisztianwagner

You'll be happy to know this has now made its way into my home.  :)

Quote from: Franco_Manitobain on January 23, 2025, 12:08:36 PM@Lisztianwagner

You'll be happy to know this has now made its way into my home.  :)

Immensely! ;D I didn't know you were a Strauss lover. ;)

I hope you'll like it, it's not exactly like listening to the Wiener Philharmoniker, but the performances in that box set are extremely good anyway.

Quote from: Lisztianwagner on January 23, 2025, 12:12:33 PMImmensely! ;D I didn't know you were a Strauss lover. ;)

I hope you'll like it, it's not exactly like listening to the Wiener Philharmoniker, but the performances in that box set are extremely good anyway.

And the booklets are excellent, like small chunks of Viennese and Austrian cultural history.

Quote from: Lisztianwagner on January 23, 2025, 12:12:33 PMImmensely! ;D I didn't know you were a Strauss lover. ;)

I hope you'll like it, it's not exactly like listening to the Wiener Philharmoniker, but the performances in that box set are extremely good anyway.

Although much of this music will be brand new to me, probably well over 80% of it. But of the music of his I have heard I have enjoyed.

As a huge fan of ballet music, it is certainly close to that sound world. I really look forward to this journey!

Quote from: Franco_Manitobain on January 23, 2025, 12:22:32 PMAlthough much of this music will be brand new to me, probably well over 80% of it. But of the music of his I have heard I have enjoyed.

As a huge fan of ballet music, it is certainly close to that sound world. I really look forward to this journey!

You definitely won't regret acquiring this wonderful series. I have just decanted the 52 original discs, with their individual booklets, into clear plastic wallets as a space-saving measure. A couple of issues are of lesser interest than others (especially volume 40) but the orchestras are fine, the playing is idiomatic (except when the final section of some quadrilles is occasionally taken at a ridiculously fast speed with an unmarked accelerando) and the conductors generally don't get in the way of the music (always a good thing).

I wish that Naxos would also box-up their Johann Strauss I (25 CDs) and Josef Strauss (26 CDs) editions to make them more economically viable rather than having to hunt around for the individual Marco Polo volumes...

Quote from: Albion on January 25, 2025, 01:05:49 AMI wish that Naxos would also box-up their Johann Strauss I (25 CDs) and Josef Strauss (26 CDs) editions to make them more economically viable rather than having to hunt around for the individual Marco Polo volumes...

Agreed, it's rather strange that, although there are all the individual volumes, they haven't been been included into box sets yet.