Recordings That You Are Considering

[Brahmsian]

Have this box! Came as a present for one of my Birthdays, and found it in general a very satisfying experience! the recordings are somewhat older, but not less in quality. So if the price is right, go for it.

Thanks Harry.  Which box, the red Warner one?

[Harry]

Thanks Harry.  Which box, the red Warner one?

The Red Warner Box, although I have both boxes

[Brahmsian]

The Red Warner Box, although I have both boxes

What a wonderful birthday present, I must say! 

[Florestan]

Anyone familiar with these relatively recent ballet boxes?    As if I need another one, though I love ballet music. 

@Harry
@Pohjolas Daughter
@Karl Tirebiter Henning
@Florestan 



Couldn't find the contents snapshot, but here is a link to what is in there.

Ballets Russes - Warner Box Set

I don't know any of them.

I wonder, though, what have Giselle and Schumann's Carnaval go to do with Ballets Russes. 

[Pohjolas Daughter]

Anyone familiar with these relatively recent ballet boxes?    As if I need another one, though I love ballet music. 

@Harry
@Pohjolas Daughter
@Karl Tirebiter Henning
@Florestan 



Couldn't find the contents snapshot, but here is a link to what is in there.

Ballets Russes - Warner Box Set

I haven't yet run across a listing of the contents for the top (red) one, but it you click on "videos" in the link that you provided, there are some fascinating commentaries (including photos) about Diaghilev!  I've watched about half of the first one (out of three).  I'll see whether or not I can find a more substantial list (as in who is playing what) in a bit. 

PD

EDIT:  It looks like there are even more parts on youtube!

[Pohjolas Daughter]

Googling a bit further, Dave H. has done a review of it.  Also ran across one in Gramophone (though they do not give much information re contents).  Europadisc lists who's in the recordings overall but no actual listing of which conductor and orchestra are playing what, etc.  I tried Amazon (a few reviews there); no one has provided detailed info there--so far anyway.

Sounds pretty cool though (comes with, apparently, a very nice booklet).  Will try and catch DH's video later.   

PD

[Brahmsian]

Googling a bit further, Dave H. has done a review of it.  Also ran across one in Gramophone (though they do not give much information re contents).  Europadisc lists who's in the recordings overall but no actual listing of which conductor and orchestra are playing what, etc.  I tried Amazon (a few reviews there); no one has provided detailed info there--so far anyway.

Sounds pretty cool though (comes with, apparently, a very nice booklet).  Will try and catch DH's video later.   

PD

Yes, that is how I discovered it (via David Hurwitz video).  I have to give him credit (love or hate him)....he has introduced and led me to a lot of discoveries.

[Karl Henning]

I don't know any of them.

I wonder, though, what have Giselle and Schumann's Carnaval go to do with Ballets Russes. 

Giselle was standard rep at the Mariinsky, and Diagilev programmed a few numbers which were keyboard music arranged by modern composers.

[Papy Oli]

The red box was in part discussed from there onwards by @Brian @Madiel etc... , in the Box Blather thread:

https://www.good-music-guide.com/community/index.php/topic,23088.msg1458084.html#msg1458084

[Brian]

I have the Warner box! Yes, it does have some "bloat" in terms of previously-existing works that the Ballets Russes repurposed and choreographed. For another example, I didn't need another copy of the Previn Tchaikovsky ballets, because I already have the Previn/Warner box.

But they did a studious job tracking down lots of rarities, including licensing at least two recordings from Naxos to present a more complete vision of the Ballets Russes. That was one of the reasons I chose it over the SWR box - completeness. Another bonus is the regular presence of conductor Igor Markevitch, one of my personal favorites and a guy who preferred to tackle rare music with excitement, rather than nuance, as his primary goal. A third bonus is a very nice long booklet essay about the history of Diaghilev and his company, with lots of photos.

Here is a post I wrote last year specifically comparing the full tracklists. (EDIT: And Olivier beat me to it with a link to some more previous discussion. Thanks Oli!)

Some obvious differences in programming vs. Warner:
- Warner's tracklist is in strict order by year of the original Ballet performance, with the first ballet on CD1 etc., rather than the SWR box, which appears to value natural/interesting couplings
- Warner is missing Auric's Pastorale (SWR CD 7) and Prokofiev's Scythian Suite (which Diaghilev actually rejected so it never became part of the Ballets Russes)
- SWR is missing Ballets Russes original commissions Le Pavillon d'Armide (N. Tcherepnin), Narcisse et Echo (N. Tcherepnin), Parade (Satie), Le Rossignol (Stravinsky, sung version), La Boutique Fantasque (Respighi), Renard (Stravinsky), Les Noces (Stravinsky), Jack in the Box (Satie), Mercure (Satie), The Steel Step (Prokofiev), The Prodigal Son (Prokofiev), and The Gods Go A-Begging (Beecham/Handel)
- SWR is missing some works the Ballets Russes repurposed as ballets by past composers (e.g. the Polovtsian Dances, R. Schumann Carnaval newly orchestrated, R. Strauss's Josephslegende arrangement)
- BOTH are missing the following original new commissions: Le Dieu bleu (Reynaldo Hahn), Midas (Maximilian Steinberg), Cimarosiana (Respighi), Mavra (Stravinsky), Zephyr et Flore (Vernon Duke), Les matelots (Auric), Barabau (Vittorio Rieti), Romeo and Juliet (Constant Lambert), The Triumph of Neptune (Lord Berners), Ode (Nikolai Nabokov), and Le Bal (Rieti again)

[Florestan]

Giselle was standard rep at the Mariinsky, and Diagilev programmed a few numbers which were keyboard music arranged by modern composers.

Thanks. I thought the box was devoted to works composed specifically for Les ballets Russes, hence my question.

Coincidentally, today I listened to an orchestral arrangement of Carnaval, nicely done by Theodor Rogalski.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theodor_Rogalski

[Karl Henning]

Thanks. I thought the box was devoted to works composed specifically for Les ballets Russes, hence my question.

Coincidentally, today I listened to an orchestral arrangement of Carnaval, nicely done by Theodor Rogalski.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theodor_Rogalski

The arrangements (you may have surmised) were indeed commissions. Dyagilev commissioned Stravinsky to arrange Chopin, IIRC

[Brahmsian]

Thanks everyone (especially Olivier and Brian) for the feedback! 

[Brahmsian]

I have the Warner box! Yes, it does have some "bloat" in terms of previously-existing works that the Ballets Russes repurposed and choreographed. For another example, I didn't need another copy of the Previn Tchaikovsky ballets, because I already have the Previn/Warner box.

But they did a studious job tracking down lots of rarities, including licensing at least two recordings from Naxos to present a more complete vision of the Ballets Russes. That was one of the reasons I chose it over the SWR box - completeness. Another bonus is the regular presence of conductor Igor Markevitch, one of my personal favorites and a guy who preferred to tackle rare music with excitement, rather than nuance, as his primary goal. A third bonus is a very nice long booklet essay about the history of Diaghilev and his company, with lots of photos.

Here is a post I wrote last year specifically comparing the full tracklists. (EDIT: And Olivier beat me to it with a link to some more previous discussion. Thanks Oli!)

Brian et al,

There are needs, and there are wants.  And sometimes both.  This is one of those situations. 

[Madiel]

I don't own either of the boxes but did a bunch of sampling listening and... I've put the Warner one on the shopping list.

I've done the dreadful thing of agreeing with reviewers like Hurwitz that some of the SWR performances aren't that good.

And yes, the Warner does a better job of documenting the history of the ballet company, not just in having more music but in the presentation and documentation, which matters to me personally given my history with this stuff.

[Brahmsian]

And yes, the Warner does a better job of documenting the history of the ballet company, not just in having more music but in the presentation and documentation, which matters to me personally given my history with this stuff.

May I ask you to elaborate on this, if you are willing to share?

[Madiel]

May I ask you to elaborate on this, if you are willing to share?

Sure. The Australian National Gallery owns some of the costumes and sets from the Ballets Russes, and put on an exhibition some years ago that I found utterly enchanting. Hearing Petrushka or Daphnis and Chloe playing over speakers while also being able to SEE parts of the original production was quite an experience.

The exhibition catalogue is still online and I've linked to it before. I'll try to find it again. I bought the book at the time.

[Karl Henning]

I've done the dreadful thing of agreeing with reviewers like Hurwitz that some of the SWR performances aren't that good

There's what they say about a stopped clock ; )

And, not to push it off onto your shoulders, I didn't think this conversation would prove dangerous, yet now I've ordered the Warner box .... so thanks!

[Brahmsian]

And, not to push it off onto your shoulders, I didn't think this conversation would prove dangerous, yet now I've ordered the Warner box .... so thanks!

Looks like the three of us did then. At a minimum. 

[Brahmsian]

Sure. The Australian National Gallery owns some of the costumes and sets from the Ballets Russes, and put on an exhibition some years ago that I found utterly enchanting. Hearing Petrushka or Daphnis and Chloe playing over speakers while also being able to SEE parts of the original production was quite an experience.

The exhibition catalogue is still online and I've linked to it before. I'll try to find it again. I bought the book at the time.

Very interesting!