Beethoven's Piano Sonatas

[Florestan]

Serkin brings an effective, unique style to this music. I prefer his incomplete set to all others.

Unscientific therefore not valid approach.

[kapsweiss2021]

I didn't forget about it; I didn't know about it.  A few minutes of internet snooping shows that Damerini was a real deal pianist, with recordings on multiple labels.  His LvB set was released in total only last year around the time of his death and appears unavailable for any type of purchase.  Eric Zivian's YouTube cycle aside, streaming only cycles are a bit suspect.  I'll try to remember to dig a bit deeper at a later time to see if it is a legit cycle.

Massimiliano Damerini is definitely a real pianist. There are some special Schubert's volumes on Arts label. Very beautiful performances. Beethoven sonatas suffer from an uneven engineering sound. Some cds sound good, other some awful, like an old and out of tune piano. Same sonatas on cds " Wiener Atmosphäre" sound better.

Sorry for my poor english.

[(poco) Sforzando]

esp wrt repeats that annoy me, e.g. he plays the 1s mvmt of op.2/1 pretty fast and without any repeat, so it becomes the shortest movement of the sonata and the whole thing seems even more off balance than usual.

That's another repeat I "restored," but only the exposition since the development/recap ends with too much of a ritard to make a repeat credible.

[Brian]

Serkin brings an effective, unique style to this music. I prefer his incomplete set to all others.

How would you describe his style compared to others? Any traits he especially stresses or strengthens? The last time I dabbled through the Serkin almost-cycle I thought it was fairly middle-of-the-road so I'd like to recalibrate my ears. 

[kapsweiss2021]

How would you describe his style compared to others? Any traits he especially stresses or strengthens? The last time I dabbled through the Serkin almost-cycle I thought it was fairly middle-of-the-road so I'd like to recalibrate my ears. 

Serkin's sonatas I think suffer from a very hard sound and dry acoustics. It is more evident in the lyric movements. For example, I like his Hammerklavier but its sound is very harsh. My favourites are his Waldstein (1975) and nº 31 (1960).

[kapsweiss2021]

And one cycle I forgot: Mordecai Shehori in his own label " Cembal d'amour". It sounds really awful in some sonatas (Hammerklavier), a bit amateur sound and play, but with a huge curriculum. He has dozens of recordings, some live in "Alice Tully Hall" and 92nd street NY.

For example, 1st movement Hammeklavier : 14 min 45 sec and so on....

[Todd]

And one cycle I forgot: Mordecai Shehori in his own label " Cembal d'amour". It sounds really strange, a bit amateur, but with a huge curriculum. He has dozens of recordings, some live in "Alice Tully Hall" and 92nd street NY.

Shehori is another of the pianists I find potentially suspect.  The breadth of his repertoire gives off Hatto/Colombo vibes, all the more so since there are few YouTube videos of him playing live but a lot of the studio recordings. 

[kapsweiss2021]

Shehori is another of the pianists I find potentially suspect.  The breadth of his repertoire gives off Hatto/Colombo vibes, all the more so since there are few YouTube videos of him playing live but a lot of the studio recordings.

Listen to his Hammerklavier. This is definitely a real pianist, but like he is sight reading the work. Slow movements and other sonatas are better, with some expressiveness. Nevertheless, he has curriculum:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mordecai_Shehori

[Todd]

Listen to his Hammerklavier. This is definitely a real pianist, but like he is sight-reading the work. Nevertheless, he has curriculum:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mordecai_Shehori

I know he's a real pianist.  So is Claudio Colombo.  I need more information to determine if the complete cycle is essentially recorded the old-fashioned way - live with patching sessions, or multiple in-studio takes edited together - or if they are more like Colombo's entirely manipulated cycle, where tempi, pitch, etc are altered start to finish.  Not even a pianist like Artur Rubinstein could master every composer he recorded, and I very highly doubt Mr Shehori can, either.  David Ezra Okonsar is another pianist who falls into this category.

Not everything available online is real.

[kapsweiss2021]

I know he's a real pianist.  So is Claudio Colombo.  I need more information to determine if the complete cycle is essentially recorded the old-fashioned way - live with patching sessions, or multiple in-studio takes edited together - or if they are more like Colombo's entirely manipulated cycle, where tempi, pitch, etc are altered start to finish.  Not even a pianist like Artur Rubinstein could master every composer he recorded, and I very highly doubt Mr Shehori can, either.  David Ezra Okonsar is another pianist who falls into this category.

Not everything available online is real.

Of course, but if he has edited the recordings , there are still some sloppy moments.     .

[George]

How would you describe his style compared to others? Any traits he especially stresses or strengthens? The last time I dabbled through the Serkin almost-cycle I thought it was fairly middle-of-the-road so I'd like to recalibrate my ears. 

Were you listening to the mono recordings, where available? In most cases, early Serkin beats later Serkin.

I would describe his style as being raw, direct and stark. Not beautiful, not mannered. I've heard Serkin's style descibed as being ascetic. I fully agree with this.

[kapsweiss2021]

Yep.  I can stream the Brawn cycle and may do that as a first. 

I have put together the list of the legit or potentially legit cycles that I do not currently own.  (Claudio Colombo's cycle and its like are excluded.) There are only fourteen total.  Two are dodgy.  One is YouTube only.  Many are OOP.  A couple have not been released in full.  Of the two LP only, cited because I can conceivably buy them that way, only the Riefling can conceivably be reissued since Bernard Roberts I is a direct to disc LP release.  That leaves James Brawn and Yurina Tetsu as the two currently purchasable cycles I do not own.  Alfredo Perl's second set should be available in full by end of year.

....

Russian Collective - OOP

.......

Is that the one HIP by Martynov, Pashchenko.... from Moscow Conservatory? I have it in .flac audio format, if you are interested.

[prémont]

Is that the one HIP by Martynov, Pashchenko.... from Moscow Conservatory? I have it in .flac audio format, if you are interested.

It seems Todd refers to the collection on Audiophile Classics, performed by a collective of pianists predominantly from St. Petersburg, including Valery Vishnevsky, Igor Lebedev, and Sergey Uryvayev. This weighty and robust compilation evokes memories of Maria Yudina.

[kapsweiss2021]

It seems Todd refers to the collection on Audiophile Classics, performed by a collective of pianists predominantly from St. Petersburg, including Valery Vishnevsky, Igor Lebedev, and Sergey Uryvayev. This weighty and robust compilation evokes memories of Maria Yudina.

Ok. The one I refer I don't see it in the Todd's list.

[kapsweiss2021]

This:

[prémont]

I would describe his style as being raw, direct and stark. Not beautiful, not mannered. I've heard Serkin's style descibed as being ascetic. I fully agree with this.

A good description which may explain why his op. 106 is among the best, while the more lyrical sonatas fare less well in his hands.

[Todd]

This:

Adding that to my list of cycles.  Like the Russian Collective cycle, I have no interest in it.  I am interested in how individual pianists approach all the sonatas.  That's literally the entire point of buying the cycles.  I did get the Bilson, et al cycle as a cheap download, and that merely reinforced why I don't really care about how groups of pianists approach the sonatas.

[kapsweiss2021]

Adding that to my list of cycles.  Like the Russian Collective cycle, I have no interest in it.  I am interested in how individual pianists approach all the sonatas.  That's literally the entire point of buying the cycles.  I did get the Bilson, et al cycle as a cheap download, and that merely reinforced why I don't really care about how groups of pianists approach the sonatas.

I totally share that opinion. In this case, the leitmotiv seems Mcnulty pianofortes copies.

[prémont]

This:

Where can this be purchased? Only in Russia?

[Madiel]

Or maybe even Italian with smattering of Teutonic seriousness. 

No, really and with all due respect, sometimes I feel that whoever said that

Talking about music is like dancing about architecture

was absolutely right.

This is often misunderstood as meaning you shouldn't try to talk about music. That isn't what it meant.