Erik Satie

[Dry Brett Kavanaugh]

I agree these are superb. Have you heard Pascal Roge with Mie Kobayashi in Faure's Violin Sonatas?

I will look for the recording! Have a great week amigo!

[Atriod]

I will look for the recording! Have a great week amigo!

Oh I'm not recommending them, I haven't heard them lol. I was wondering if you had. So far I haven't heard anyone remotely as good as Arthur Grumiaux/Sebok in Faure's Violin Sonata.

Enjoy your week as well

[brewski]

On April 24-25, pianist Igor Levit will perform Satie's Vexations at the Southbank Centre, for 840 times as indicated in the score. (Alas, no livestream, at least at the moment.) The performance will be directed by the artist Marina Abramović.

More information here.

[Mandryka]

On April 24-25, pianist Igor Levit will perform Satie's Vexations at the Southbank Centre, for 840 times as indicated in the score. (Alas, no livestream, at least at the moment.) The performance will be directed by the artist Marina Abramović.

More information here.

It feels like a freak show, I don't want to do it.

I want to ask: what value can a performance have?

[ultralinear]

It feels like a freak show, I don't want to do it.

I want to ask: what value can a performance have?

I see it as being like Warhol's Empire - no-one's expected actually to sit and watch it for 8 hours, it's just something that's on, that you can look at or not as you go by - basically, it's decor.  I see the Satie piece as aural decor.  If I were in town anyway I might drop by and take in a few minutes of it, but I'm not going to make a special trip for it, however much I might admire Levit.  Why he sees this as an appropriate use for his talents is a whole other question.

[Florestan]

It feels like a freak show, I don't want to do it.

I want to ask: what value can a performance have?

The problem with irony is that many people don't get it at all --- and that's exactly what the greatest and obviously the most successful of Satie's pranks makes abundantly clear.

[brewski]

It feels like a freak show, I don't want to do it.

I want to ask: what value can a performance have?

Your points are perfectly well-taken, and any kind of marathon is worth questioning. The only comparison I can draw is with, say, Morton Feldman's Second String Quartet, which I've never heard live. At six hours, it is comparatively shorter, and like the Satie, listeners are encouraged to come and go. I will say, having experienced some three-hour Feldman works, after awhile the music creates an engrossing, meditative effect.

FWIW, I did find the stream of his 2020 pandemic performance in Berlin — all 12 hours of it — below.

[Mandryka]

I've been to a complete Vexations, with many different pianists in relays.

@Florestan What does irony mean in this context?

@brewski There are ethical problems about the Feldman quartet, because it may put the performers at risk. Even more so for this.

[Florestan]

Florestan What does irony mean in this context?

Imho, Satie never seriously meant Vexations to be performed according to his indications; he was eccentric, not insane. It's simply a huge prank on the bloated Late Romantic music, whose esoteric longueurs were (and still are) often equated with profundity. That some people take it seriously and perform them as written is evidence that they simply don't get Satie's irony and wit. I'm sure that every time they play them, Satie's and God's laughter resound through heaven. 

[brewski]

I've been to a complete Vexations, with many different pianists in relays.

@brewski There are ethical problems about the Feldman quartet, because it may put the performers at risk. Even more so for this.

The pianists in relays sounds like a great way to navigate the piece, actually. (And I have read of the hand and wrist challenges in performing the Feldman.) I can only assume that Levit knows his hands and his body (e.g., stamina) and is up for the task.

But all of that said, there is a bit of "stunt" about it. I haven't even dipped into the 12-hour video on YouTube yet, to assess whether 16+ hours would be worth the investment!

[San Antone]

I'm am not convinced that Satie ever intended for the work to be performed as he instructed. I have always assumed it was a conceptual statement of Satie's aesthetic philosophy and a critique of the musical conceits of his time.  Satie often poked fun at his contemporaries and the presumptions of the academic music conservatory class.

I know I would not wish to hear it in its entirety. I can only barely tolerate those recorded examples that last five minutes. 

Erik Satie is among my favorite composers, but this work is not one on which that statement is based.  However, I leave it to Igor Levit to decide for himself the value of performing this work in this kind of athletic marathon.

[AnotherSpin]

Your points are perfectly well-taken, and any kind of marathon is worth questioning. The only comparison I can draw is with, say, Morton Feldman's Second String Quartet, which I've never heard live. At six hours, it is comparatively shorter, and like the Satie, listeners are encouraged to come and go. I will say, having experienced some three-hour Feldman works, after awhile the music creates an engrossing, meditative effect.

FWIW, I did find the stream of his 2020 pandemic performance in Berlin — all 12 hours of it — below.

Thank you for the link — it was rather curious to watch. To be honest, the sheer absurdity of the whole thing was quite something. It began with several minutes of silence — ah yes, terribly profound, no doubt — and then Levit, with a sort of polite indifference, started tapping at the keys, occasionally glancing off to the left where a tray of snacks had been strategically placed.

Well, quite understandable, really — a chap can get hungry, especially when there's nothing in the score to distract from life's more immediate needs. Skipping forward a bit, I caught him deftly reaching for a bite, or giving the back of his head a good scratch — perhaps it had gone numb, or perhaps the shampoo simply wasn't up to the task. His trainers, I noted, looked rather expensive.

At one point, he stood up and wandered offstage, leisurely as you like — nature, as ever, taking its course. I didn't wait for him to return, though there was still a fair stretch of time remaining.

[Florestan]

More information here.

From the above source:

In 2015, Abramović and Levit collaborated in a performance of Bach's Goldberg Variations, where the audience prepared for the music by locking their mobile phones away and sitting in silence for 30 minutes before the performance began.[/b]

This is a perfect example of that pretentious nonsense disguised as seriousness-cum-profundity which Satie opposed and derided all his life... 

[Mandryka]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WJThCxvUf4I

Above is about Marina Abramovic.

[brewski]

From the above source:

In 2015, Abramović and Levit collaborated in a performance of Bach's Goldberg Variations, where the audience prepared for the music by locking their mobile phones away and sitting in silence for 30 minutes before the performance began.

This is a perfect example of that pretentious nonsense disguised as seriousness-cum-profundity which Satie opposed and derided all his life... 

Ah well, to each his own. I do think her point about a mobile-free period is well taken, and would give it a try, but that's just me. 

[AnotherSpin]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WJThCxvUf4I

Above is about Marina Abramovic.

Thank you for the video. There are several full-length documentaries about her, as well as a handful of books. Marina Abramović is quite an extraordinary figure, not merely in the realm of art, but well beyond it. Responses to her work span the full breadth of human emotion, from reverence and adoration to outright repulsion and rejection.

I find her frequent references to Gandhi particularly intriguing, as seen again in this video.

Even more so, I'm drawn to that curious phase of her work that steps beyond object-based art, leaving only the subject behind. Her now-iconic 2010 exhibition at MoMA, where thousands of visitors took turns sitting silently across from her, feels like a direct invocation of mauna, the ancient Indian practice of silent transmission of absolute truth. No, I wouldn't go so far as to compare Abramović to Sri Ramana Maharshi, but one can't help but notice a few rather uncanny parallels.

Naturally, she's also drawn the interest of conspiracy theorists — most infamously through the Spirit Cooking episode. I shan't delve into names or details, but for those inclined toward rabbit holes, a simple online search will open the door.

[AnotherSpin]

The Abramović Method for Music, which was used during Igor Levit's 2015 Goldberg Variations concert, is Marina Abramović's attempt to turn classical music listening into something truly special — a ritual of silence and sensory isolation meant to clear the mind and bring the audience into full presence. The idea is that by entering a meditative state beforehand, listeners can connect more deeply with the music.

And it makes me wonder — does meditation really enhance the way we experience music? I've been meditating for many years now, including practicing Transcendental Meditation (TM) in the early days. Honestly, I'm not sure there's a direct connection or enhancement. During longer stays in India, I actually felt less drawn to Western music.

So I'm curious — has anyone here found that meditation truly deepens their listening, or does it sometimes shift your attention away from music altogether?

[Florestan]

Ah well, to each his own. I do think her point about a mobile-free period is well taken, and would give it a try, but that's just me. 

Oh, it's not the locking/turning off of mobile phones that I find objectionable, after all it has rightly become standard concert etiquette/policy. But that whole "sit-stiff-and-still-for-half-an-hour-before-the-concert-even-begins" strikes me as pseudo-mystical nonsense, as if listening to the Goldberg Variations in a state of forced trance is going to reveal the audience a supremely transcendental truth, otherwise inaccessible.

[ultralinear]

The Abramović Method for Music, which was used during Igor Levit's 2015 Goldberg Variations concert, is Marina Abramović's attempt to turn classical music listening into something truly special — a ritual of silence and sensory isolation meant to clear the mind and bring the audience into full presence. The idea is that by entering a meditative state beforehand, listeners can connect more deeply with the music.

And it makes me wonder — does meditation really enhance the way we experience music? I've been meditating for many years now, including practicing Transcendental Meditation (TM) in the early days. Honestly, I'm not sure there's a direct connection or enhancement. During longer stays in India, I actually felt less drawn to Western music.

So I'm curious — has anyone here found that meditation truly deepens their listening, or does it sometimes shift your attention away from music altogether?

I've practised TM for a great many years, and I've no doubt it's affected my relationship with music as with everything else.  In a concert I do tend to close my eyes and try to draw the music into my consciousness, letting it take over rather than focussing my attention upon it, which is very much the TM way.  Not all music lends itself equally to this, and I probably tend to favour the music that does.

[AnotherSpin]

I've practised TM for a great many years, and I've no doubt it's affected my relationship with music as with everything else.  In a concert I do tend to close my eyes and try to draw the music into my consciousness, letting it take over rather than focussing my attention upon it, which is very much the TM way.  Not all music lends itself equally to this, and I probably tend to favour the music that does.

Interesting, thank you. My years with TM are long behind me, but I understand what you mean. That said, the practices I took up later are comparable in that regard.