Mahler's Das Lied von der Erde

[M forever]

Levine will be conducting Das Lied von der Erde next week here in Boston, with Anne Sofie von Otter and Johan Botha (no idea though who that is). I will probably go, if I am in town.

[Sean]

Just as an aside here, don't people think that the writing in many parts of this important work is congested? This shortcoming, together with the intellectualism of the Eighth symphony's construction and polyphony, was only properly resolved in the Ninth...

[M forever]

Sean - since the writing is in German (which you don't understand), you can not judge that.

[HARPER_JT]

It is well known that Mahler would frequently subject the orchestration of every new orchestral work to detailed revision over several years: though the musical material itself was hardly ever changed, the complex instrumental 'clothing' would be altered and refined in the light of experience gained in performance. In the case of Das Lied von der Erde , however, this process did not occur: the work's publication and first performance occurred posthumously. A fascinating compromise was presented in a chamber transcription for thirteen players by Arnold Schoenberg/Riehn. The great beauty and effectiveness of this transcription for a small orchestra is its ability to convey the same passions and feelings as the original orchestral score did, but in a more quiet, intense, intimate manner.

[FideLeo]

A fascinating compromise was presented in a chamber transcription for thirteen players by Arnold Schoenberg/Riehn. The great beauty and effectiveness of this transcription for a small orchestra is its ability to convey the same passions and feelings as the original orchestral score did, but in a more quiet, intense, intimate manner.

I agree - I listen to the original and to the transcribed version about 50:50 of the time.

[(poco) Sforzando]

Levine will be conducting Das Lied von der Erde next week here in Boston, with Anne Sofie von Otter and Johan Botha (no idea though who that is).

A very good Wagnerian tenor from South Africa. I've heard him as Lohengrin and Walther von Stolzing at the Met. I don't think you'll be disappointed.

[not edward]

Just as an aside here, don't people think that the writing in many parts of this important work is congested?

No.

I find the orchestral writing to be (at least in all the recordings I like) of the utmost clarity.

Unfortunately I've never heard this work live. It probably ranks #1 on the list of "works to hear live at least once before I die."

[The new erato]

I find the orchestral writing to be (at least in all the recordings I like) of the utmost clarity.

Me too. Few people had the gift to write clearly for large forces like Mahler (broad generalization I know).

[Sean]

Hi John, how's it going? I'm out of England at present.

Folks, take the very opening of this work- it's like Mahler's already half way through a particularly tangled and unhappy musical argument- what a noisy start; by the time of the more serene Abscheid (or whatever the last movement's called) we need a break anyway- there's tension in this work of the wrong kind...

[BorisG]

Hi John, how's it going? I'm out of England at present.

Folks, take the very opening of this work- it's like Mahler's already half way through a particularly tangled and unhappy musical argument- what a noisy start; by the time of the more serene Abscheid (or whatever the last movement's called) we need a break anyway- there's tension in this work of the wrong kind...

Think Chinese, then it will make sense.

[(poco) Sforzando]

No.

I find the orchestral writing to be (at least in all the recordings I like) of the utmost clarity.

Unfortunately I've never heard this work live. It probably ranks #1 on the list of "works to hear live at least once before I die."

In a couple of performances I've heard, the tenor was overpowered particularly in the opening song. I can't remember where I read this, but I recall one writer giving his opinion that Mahler might have thinned out the orchestration for this section had he lived to hear the work.

[Lilas Pastia]

Botha is a favourite of some of today's most important operatic productions. I can't say I'm that impressed. But singing part-time in a one hour-long work is distinctly less challenging than featuring as a leading verdian, wagnerian or straussian tenor. I hope he manages to stay vocally healthy. I don't think he should venture past that kind of vocal range and tessitura, though. But since he thought he could make it as Otello at the Met, it does not bode well for the future....

[The new erato]

In a couple of performances I've heard, the tenor was overpowered particularly in the opening song. I can't remember where I read this, but I recall one writer giving his opinion that Mahler might have thinned out the orchestration for this section had he lived to hear the work.

Well - that is one of relatively few parts of Mahler where I think you may be right. But OTOH the impression of strain this gives to the tenor may be intended and makes for a very powerful impression. Without the sense of the tenor fighting desperately to match the orchestra the Drinking song would make quite another impression, so it might be intended.

[Bruckner is God]

I currently have just one version, Karajan/BP with Ludwig/Kollo as soloists. I love this recording to death, but I feel I need one or two more recordings of this wonderful work.
Any recomandations?

[not edward]

For me, there's one Das Lied that stands out from all the others...the live SOBR/Kubelik on Audite with Waldemar Kmentt and Janet Baker. I find that Kubelik's direction is constantly attentive to both the details and the larger structure of the work, Kmentt gets as much as I've heard from the tenor songs, and Baker's simply incomparable. (I think Baker's studio recording with Haitink is also very fine, but I prefer Kubelik's interpretation and choice of tenor.)

[Archaic Torso of Apollo]

I've always loved the Haitink/Baker/King/Conc'bouw recording on Philips, above all for Janet Baker's hypnotic singing in Der Abschied.

And Bruno Walter's last recording with the NYPO, which I much prefer to his "classic" version with Ferrier.

Also, consider an all-male version, it makes an interesting contrast. I like the Kletzki with Fischer-Dieskau, but there are others.

[Ric]

For me the great version of that work, is this one. I like to say that this recording is one of best disc of the history of recorded music.

[Xenophanes]

That's the only one I have on CD (DG Galleria 419 058-2) and I quite enjoy it.  Christa Ludwig is superb, of course, and Rene Kollo did a fine, dramatic performance.

I have a couple of good ones on LP. First is Bruno Walter, NYPO, with Mildred Miller and Ernst Haefliger. Mildred Miller was a fine artist. Haefliger is very good, too, but I think the part is a bit too heavy for his lyric voice.

The other is Eugen Jochum, Amsterdam Concertgebouw, with Nan Merriman, another excellent and reliable soprano, and Haefliger, again.

I can recommend all of these, but the one I really listen to is Karajan, BPO, with Ludwig and Kollo.

Now, if I only understood what the text is really about . . .

[XB-70 Valkyrie]

I have the Walter / Miller / Haefliger as well and like it a great deal.

Can anyone recommend a good chamber version of this work? I've never heard any chamber version, but I am intrigued.

[val]

My favorite version: Klemperer with Ludwig and Wunderlich. The sense of eternity, the deep sadness of Ludwig, the explosive Wunderlich in the first Lied are unforgettable.

In second place the more dramatic version of Walter with Ferrier and Patzak.

In third place, Reiner, because of the sublime Forrester. The tenor has not the same presence.