Why meditate?

[karlhenning]

A complete and utter tangent, George, but . . . do you know the King Crimson track "Indiscipline"?

[Kuhlau]

... me and drogulus generally tend to disagree more often then not, so i don't see how anybody could lump us under the same hood. He seems to be a strict rationalist, where as i believe true understanding is gained only after an inner creative process, as sort of intuition, if you will.

Broadly speaking, that's how I see you two. And I'll stick my neck on the block by saying I incline more towards your 'intuition' than his 'intellect'.

FK

[bwv 1080]

Buddhism need not involve beliefs, this is one of the reasons it can be practiced by Catholics, Jews, etc.

Are you saying that Buddhism is not a belief system?

[bwv 1080]

I am saying that it is quite possible to practice Buddhism without beliefs.

Perhaps we are just playing semantics here, but Buddhism refers to a set of beliefs in things like karma and the four noble truths

its nonsensical (but perhaps very Zen) to state that you can practice the teachings of Buddhism without having a belief in its merit

It is true that one could say that they are a Christian and a Buddhist in the same way that one can be a Christian and a Freudian

[bwv 1080]

Thanks for sharing, George, and for braving the inevitable attempts at ridicule from small-minded souls trapped in samsara who've yet to begin to suspect how little they really know.

So how do you know you are not "trapped in samsara" (the cycle of birth & rebirth), given that you are alive?  Have you acheived Nirvana and not announced it to the board?

[DavidRoss]

So how do you know you are not "trapped in samsara" (the cycle of birth & rebirth), given that you are alive?  Have you acheived Nirvana and not announced it to the board?

Who says I'm not?  You're usually better at logic, Steve!

[bwv 1080]

No, some forms of Buddhism refer to what you describe, not all.

Now you are just dodging.  The word has to have some meaning that ties to the 5th century BC Indian philosopher.  Otherwise I can simply define Buddhism as gaining enlightenment from laying on the couch drinking beer and eating pizza all day. Hell, I am a Buddhist in the same sense that I am also a mathematical Platonist or a Hayekian

I do understand that no one in the West who calls themselves a Buddhist bears any resemblance in beliefs to the traditional religion as its practiced by Asians,  nor has Asian history demonstrated that the fruits of Buddhism has resulted in societies that were any less violent and cruel than in the West.

[bwv 1080]

Who says I'm not?  You're usually better at logic, Steve!

Just saying, its hard to pick up tone over the internet, but sounded to me like one good Baptist telling another to ignore all those wretched sinners who would question the Word of God

[DavidRoss]

Just saying, its hard to pick up tone over the internet, but sounded to me like one good Baptist telling another to ignore all those wretched sinners who would question the Word of God

Oh--actually my comment was directed at that sort.

[Dr. Dread]

Buddhism is a tool. Use it, or don't use it. The tool doesn't care. It certainly helped me clarify what I knew all along, deep down inside. I don't call myself a "Buddhist" but it's my favorite doctrine.  To me, it makes more sense than a lot of other wisdom teachings out there. Or, maybe it just makes itself clearer than others. Or perhaps I'm just more attuned to it--much more so than, say, Christianity or a Hinduism--although, essentially, maybe these are all saying the same things. Different paths, same goal: The truth.

This is just my two cents, and like most Buddhists, I'm not hear to preach it or to argue it. Just sharing my experience.

[bwv 1080]

Who said practicing Buddhism without beliefs doesn't tie one to Shakyamuni Buddha? I certainly didn't.

So you believe the Indian philosopher Siddhārtha Gautama warrants the titles "Shakyamuni" & "Buddha", why?   

[bwv 1080]

Buddhism is a tool. Use it, or don't use it. The tool doesn't care. It certainly helped me clarify what I knew all along, deep down inside. I don't call myself a "Buddhist" but it's my favorite doctrine.  To me, it makes more sense than a lot of other wisdom teachings out there. Or, maybe it just makes itself clearer than others. Or perhaps I'm just more attuned to it--much more so than, say, Christianity or a Hinduism--although, essentially, maybe these are all saying the same things. Different paths, same goal: The truth.

This is just my two cents, and like most Buddhists, I'm not hear to preach it or to argue it. Just sharing my experience.

Sure, but Buddhism did emerge from Hinduism and was later absorbed by it.  Buddha was a reformer-type like Calvin or Luther, reacting against a rigid priesthood.  Other than by being dogmatic, its difficult to draw hard distinctions between various Indian traditions

[Dr. Dread]

Sure, but Buddhism did emerge from Hinduism and was later absorbed by it.  Buddha was a reformer-type like Calvin or Luther, reacting against a rigid priesthood.  Other than by being dogmatic, its difficult to draw hard distinctions between various Indian traditions

Maybe. Buddhism pretty much strips the god-stuff away. A bonus.

[bwv 1080]

Maybe. Buddhism pretty much strips the god-stuff away. A bonus.

But so does the higher level Hinduism, where all the "gods" are part of an ultimate reality Brahman. 

At it is practiced in Asia, popular Buddhism is full of demons and gods and supernatural phenomena.

[Dr. Dread]

But so does the higher level Hinduism, where all the "gods" are part of an ultimate reality Brahman. 

At it is practiced in Asia, popular Buddhism is full of demons and gods and supernatural phenomena.

Yeah, I've heard about that. Not many books that I've read mention it.