Saul's Music Space

[Florestan]

Oh thank you! that you are saying that my music is " ear-pleasing " THANK YOU!

You're welcome.

Now there are many differences between me and every other composer in the world, not just Mendelssohn. When I write a piece of music, I try to the best of my abilities to translate my feelings into sounds. I do this in a very genuine and heartfelt and passionate way. I also want very much that people will be moved and touched by my music,

Oh my God! In all this you are similar, nay, identical, to each and every composer who ever lived on Earth. I ask you once again: show me one single major difference between Mendelssohn's piano music and your own.

I never say that I want to be like one particular composer, but to have my own distinctive voice within music. I draw many good points from a number of composers that I like, but I never try to sound like them, I mean what would be the purpose of writing music if you sound like just someone else, right?

Then how come that none of us here is able to distinguish your personal voice? Are we all deaf?

[Florestan]

I'd just like to point out that I don't think "everything that can be expressed has already been expressed" in every musical style. It is certainly possible for a deeply intelligent contemporary composer to revisit styles, or ideas, or forms of older eras and write music that is highly complex, original, and emotionally engaging but at the same time fundamentally backward-looking in the academic sense. In other words, reseeding a prior century's fields does not always preclude greatness - it is just that you need to add the greatness. Or more radically, being "backward-looking" can often be a way of being "forward-looking."

For example.

Oh I certainly do agree with that. Schoenberg himself said that there was much music left to be composed in C major. But Shostakovich never uttered such contempt for contemporary developments as Saul did, neither do his preludes and fugues sound like they could have been composed a hundred years back.

[greg]

Greg, you're not making any sense, there is no reason not to listen to classical music, especially if you dislike certain composers or can't really get them.

No, not if you dislike certain composers- but if you just listen casually. Though this probably doesn't apply to you or anyone here, so never mind.

[Saul]

I'm listening to the live Kagan confirmation hearing, this is just too interesting, I promise to come back and reply to your comments and Luke's.

Best Wishes,

Saul

[Brian]

Oh I certainly do agree with that. Schoenberg himself said that there was much music left to be composed in C major. But Shostakovich never uttered such contempt for contemporary developments as Saul did, neither do his preludes and fugues sound like they could have been composed a hundred years back.

Yep, we're in agreement after all. If you're going to write a new baroque piece, the goal is not to compose music as if trapped in amber in the year 1720, the goal is to compose music as if you're looking back at 1720 and taking in everything that's happened since and using it all in service of your own voice and your own artistic goals.

[Florestan]

Yep, we're in agreement after all. If you're going to write a new baroque piece, the goal is not to compose music as if trapped in amber in the year 1720, the goal is to compose music as if you're looking back at 1720 and taking in everything that's happened since and using it all in service of your own voice and your own artistic goals.

Precisely. But if you programmatically reject everything that came after 1900 and your idea of music is stuck in mid-19th century you're not going to make any positive  impression and that's my whole point.

[knight66]

After discussion with the other Mods, I have amalgamated all of Saul's composition threads and I have renamed the thread. If you feel inclined to discuss these topics with Saul, it needs to be done from this single topic.

I am mystified at the lengths some of you are going to in this dialogue with the deaf. It is up to you, but remember folks, the normal rules about the way we deal with one another pertain; so no hair pulling or eye gouging.

Knight

[karlhenning]

Oh I certainly do agree with that. Schoenberg himself said that there was much music left to be composed in C major. But Shostakovich never uttered such contempt for contemporary developments as Saul did . . . .

True, in fact (apart from younger days, when he was agog over Petrushka, and prepared his own arrangement of the Symphony of Psalms for piano four hands) Shostakovich continued to expand his pallette in his last compositions.

The only perorations Shostakovich spoke against modernism in music, were arguably public political obligations.

[(poco) Sforzando]

I am mystified at the lengths some of you are going to in this dialogue with the deaf. It is up to you, but remember folks, the normal rules about the way we deal with one another pertain; so no hair pulling or eye gouging.

Understood, and my only answer to your mystification is the sheer sport of seeing how Saul manages invariably to miss the point, skirt the issues, and otherwise interpret every comment made here as proof of his unassailable genius. It is a rare talent. But I promise, no hair pulling or eye gouging; otherwise, we would be left not only with the deaf, but with the deaf, blind, and bald.

[Franco]

Now there are many differences between me [Saul] and every other composer in the world, not just Mendelssohn.

A true fact that is beyond dispute. 

I will put forward an analogy that will possibly clarify this fact even more: I'm assuming that Saul, as well as most of us at GMG can ride a bicycle, now there are many differences between Saul and every other bicycle rider in the world, not just Lance Armstrong.

[knight66]

A true fact that is beyond dispute. 

I will put forward an analogy that will possibly clarify this fact even more: I'm assuming that Saul, as well as most of us at GMG can ride a bicycle, now there are many differences between Saul and every other bicycle rider in the world, not just Lance Armstrong.

This looks like it is going to be worked up into a syllogism; good luck.

SF, Yes, bald and deaf and blind....not good.

Mike

[karlhenning]

The Who didn't even do that to Tommy . . . .

[(poco) Sforzando]

The Who didn't even do that to Tommy . . . .

Even Helen Keller had hair. . . .

[karlhenning]

I saw The Miracle Worker when I was in grade school. It was one long Bad Hair Day before the term had been coined.

[Brian]

True, in fact (apart from younger days, when he was agog over Petrushka, and prepared his own arrangement of the Symphony of Psalms for piano four hands) Shostakovich continued to expand his pallette in his last compositions.

The only perorations Shostakovich spoke against modernism in music, were arguably public political obligations.

I think what makes Shostakovich so great - for me he ranks alongside Bach, Mozart and Beethoven - is that he could write intensely personal, intensely Shostakovian music in a multitude of styles. The Tenth Symphony, in which he introduces DSCH, is arguably the culmination of the Russian Romantic symphonic tradition of Balakirev, Rimsky, and Rachmaninov; the Preludes and Fugues were written fueled on inspiration of Bach; throw in the Fourth and Fifteenth Symphonies and you've got four pieces right there that sound like they were written by people who maybe met each other at a party one time and exchanged polite words but secretly aren't too fond of each other's music.

[Saul]

To Florestan,

You said that my music sounds almost the same as Mendelssohn and you can't see the difference.

Please if you can explain  how this Prelude sounds like Mendelssohn...

Thanks,

Saul
http://www.youtube.com/v/RulebBhsJlw

[karlhenning]

I think what makes Shostakovich so great - for me he ranks alongside Bach, Mozart and Beethoven - is that he could write intensely personal, intensely Shostakovian music in a multitude of styles. The Tenth Symphony, in which he introduces DSCH, is arguably the culmination of the Russian Romantic symphonic tradition of Balakirev, Rimsky, and Rachmaninov; the Preludes and Fugues were written fueled on inspiration of Bach; throw in the Fourth and Fifteenth Symphonies and you've got four pieces right there that sound like they were written by people who maybe met each other at a party one time and exchanged polite words but secretly aren't too fond of each other's music.

Nice post, Brian.

[(poco) Sforzando]

To Florestan,

You said that my music sounds almost the same as Mendelssohn and you can't see the difference.

Please if you can explain  how this Prelude sounds like Mendelssohn...

Thanks,

Saul
http://www.youtube.com/v/RulebBhsJlw

Actually, I think it does somewhat, a kind of recently discovered Song without Words. But I'll go out on a limb this time and say I think this is a pretty good piece, Saul. It has direction and resolution, and you do some nice things distributing the figurations between the hands and varying the bass line between dotted halves and dotted quarters.

Since this is evidently a computer performance, one thing I would strongly urge is converting the 16ths to triplets. At this tempo, I truly doubt a living pianist could handle all those repeated 16ths, and triplet figurations would make this much more playable while keeping the agitated effect you want.

[Florestan]

You said that my music sounds almost the same as Mendelssohn and you can't see the difference.

Please if you can explain  how this Prelude sounds like Mendelssohn...

That's almost a copy-paste from Beethoven. You still don't get the idea, do you? I'll restate it: You, Saul Dzorelashvili, living in 2010, cannot pretend to be taken seriously as a composer if you compose in the style of infinitely superior composers who lived 200 to 100 years ago. Their music sounds genuine and heartfelt even on the thousandth listening. Your music, ear-pleasing at a very basic level as it is, sounds on a second listening contrived and false, because out of its time. It conveys the urgent feeling of "been there, done that".

Now with regard to the poll you added: I think neither Karl nor Luke nor Greg want to reflect the Classical Era. The Classical Era is gone and the only one here who dreams of reviving it is you Their music aims at reflecting their (and our) era and their own feelings and reflections about it. The poll is meaningless.

[Saul]

That's almost a copy-paste from Beethoven. You still don't get the idea, do you? I'll restate it: You, Saul Dzorelashvili, living in 2010, cannot pretend to be taken seriously as a composer if you compose in the style of infinitely superior composers who lived 200 to 100 years ago. Their music sounds genuine and heartfelt even on the thousandth listening. Your music, ear-pleasing at a very basic level as it is, sounds on a second listening contrived and false, because out of its time. It conveys the urgent feeling of "been there, done that".

Now with regard to the poll you added: I think neither Karl nor Luke nor Greg want to reflect the Classical Era. The Classical Era is gone and the only one here who dreams of reviving it is you Their music aims at reflecting their (and our) era and their own feelings and reflections about it. The poll is meaningless.

The last composer in the whole world I was thinking about while writing this work was Beethoven.
Probably this Beethoven thing is a fragment of your imagination, which you are entitled to.