Favorite Moments in a Shostakovich Symphony

[Octo_Russ]

This whole thread makes me want to listen to the 4th and the 11th much more closely again, i have discs of Jarvi [Chandos] and Jansons [EMI] in the 4th, and Bychkov [Philips] in the 11th, anyone have any other recommendations?.

[bhodges]

I haven't heard either of the 4th's you mention, but would imagine Jansons, especially, would be excellent.  The one that has captured me lately is Haitink's live recording with Chicago (below).

And I guess I'm fond of Haitink's way with Shostakovich, since the 11th I still adore is his 1980s recording with the Concertgebouw.  It has fantastic playing and recording--perhaps a little on the cool side--but the orchestra's percussion section has a field day.

--Bruce

[Daverz]

Coming to these works for the first time, I was under the assumption that 11th was one among the most popular of the lot. Apparently not. The Tenth's ending is just too happy for me (similarly, the 5th's too), although I like the work as a whole.

The "happiness" at the very end of 10 is a rather sardonic happiness.

[PaulR]

In the first movement of the 5th symphony, the end with the violin solo over pianissimo bass playing the opening motif.
The last movement of the 5th, after the slow section, where the snare, and brass enter.

The last movement of the 4th, the Climax in sound, with the almost false heroic ending.

The whole 3rd movement of the 7th symphony, especially the middle to late part.

The opening of the first movement of the 10th with the basses.  Also in the first movement, the climax in the middle.
The 2nd mov. of the 10th as a whole.

The 1st movement in the 11th, around the middle of the Rostropovich recording, there's a part that almost sounds very open, almost angelic.  Can't really explain it.
the 2nd movement of the 11th, the wild part in the middle.
The whole last movement of the 11th.

In the 13th, 1st movement, where the chorus re-enters after the brass climax.
The 4th movement opening with bass and i think Tuba

14th, the beginning of the 9th movement "O Delvig, Delvig"  The slow, sweeping strings, after a chaotic end to the previous movement.

[kishnevi]

This whole thread makes me want to listen to the 4th and the 11th much more closely again, i have discs of Jarvi [Chandos] and Jansons [EMI] in the 4th, and Bychkov [Philips] in the 11th, anyone have any other recommendations?.

For the 11th (and the 8th as well), my introduction  was Rostropovich on LSO Live,  and I still consider them top tier performances, although I haven't heard the performances you mention, or several of the other usual suspects.  I do have Mravinksy's 8th, and still rate the Rostropovich better.

For the Fourth, the same comment would apply to Gergiev's recording, which I prefer to the Haitink on CSO Resound.

[karlhenning]

The "happiness" at the very end of 10 is a rather sardonic happiness.

How can we tell? ; )

[Bruckner is God]

Symphony #10, first movement: the piccolo duet at the end. 

Glad I am not the only one who LOVES this moment. It's just exquisite. One of my favorite moments in music.

[Opus106]

The "happiness" at the very end of 10 is a rather sardonic happiness.

Perhaps I'll learn to feel that after listening to it a few more times.

Every time I listen to new piece I take time to try and read about the circumstances under which it was created. With Shostakovich, I really don't know what to believe and what not to.  He would have said things about his ideas to a musician friend, only later to deny it. Much of this coming out of Stalinist or post-Stalinist Russia. Testimony will surely have something to say on this as well. But that book is not far from controversy, if I'm not mistaken. Of course, there are things that the critics have to say as well. 



So, without going very deep into the history of the pieces, I simply let the music guide my emotions.

[Tapio Dmitriyevich]

I think Schnittke once not-entirely-frivolously claimed his entire oeuvre was an attempt to answer that question--an unanswerable one, of course, but the rising celesta does for me add a question mark to the end of a work that would otherwise end in unambiguous tragedy. (And that, to me, is one of the strokes of--pace Josquin--genius in the work.)

The Glockenspiel sounding thing? Yeah, the final note is exactly the sound equivalent of a question mark.

The Allegro of the 11th, the loud passage with all the timpany and snare drums, before the percussion breaks off, is pure DANCE MUSIC, I love it, it rocks, it should be played in dancehalls.

[Tapio Dmitriyevich]

I haven't heard either of the 4th's you mention, but would imagine Jansons, especially, would be excellent.  The one that has captured me lately is Haitink's live recording with Chicago (below).

As for the ending of the Symphony, the Haitink/Chicago is just plain terrible, beause: You can't really hear the trumpet - which is the most genious and important moment for me. You can hear it much better in the Janssons/Concertgebouw(IIRC).
EDIT: Not Concertgebouw. With Bavarian Radio Symphony.

I mean 03:00 here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PF9pt6Zs_F0&NR=1

[Daverz]

Perhaps I'll learn to feel that after listening to it a few more times.

Every time I listen to new piece I take time to try and read about the circumstances under which it was created.

Always interesting, of course, but I'm not referring to any subtextual reading, but simply the very strong emotional impression I get from the music itself.  We get a largely tragic symphony that suddenly ends with giddy, drunken circus music.  This is not the triumphal joy of any symphony I've ever heard.  I hear it as the only response left after so much crushing tragedy: laughter at the cosmic joke played on humanity.

[karlhenning]

As for the ending of the Symphony, the Haitink/Chicago is just plain terrible, beause: You can't really hear the trumpet - which is the most genious and important moment for me.

I hear it.

[karlhenning]

It's certainly important.  It's the 'resolution' of a figure which the horn first plays (after the quiet follows the brass perorations, I mean), and then the flute echoes, transposed a perfect fourth higher.  Both the horn and the flute, though, play the figure (rhythmically varied but) largely as it has appeared numerous times before: a three-note ascent, first a perfect fourth, then a tritone, then spiraling down in a recoiling descent.  The trumpet at the end, though, first plays those ascending three notes, arriving at an F#, then plays it transposed up a half-step, so that he lands at G (a chord tone in c minor, of course.

[Opus106]

Always interesting, of course, but I'm not referring to any subtextual reading, but simply the very strong emotional impression I get from the music itself.  We get a largely tragic symphony that suddenly ends with giddy, drunken circus music.  This is not the triumphal joy of any symphony I've ever heard.  I hear it as the only response left after so much crushing tragedy: laughter at the cosmic joke played on humanity.

That was the kind of what I felt after listening to the 6th, although not that strongly.

[Sergeant Rock]

.... just too happy for me (similarly, the 5th's too)...

Try to listen to the Rostropovich National Symphony version. It is the polar opposite of happy: more like grinning/grimacing through the pain. It will utterly change how you hear that finale.

Sarge

[Sergeant Rock]

This whole thread makes me want to listen to the 4th and the 11th much more closely again, i have discs of Jarvi [Chandos] and Jansons [EMI] in the 4th, and Bychkov [Philips] in the 11th, anyone have any other recommendations?.

For the 11th (and the 8th as well), my introduction  was Rostropovich on LSO Live,  and I still consider them top tier performances

The Rostropovich LSO Live is my favorite 11th too. For the Fourth: Rozhdestvensky and Previn/Chicago...Rattle too (and I'm not normally a fan of Sir Simon).

Sarge

[Opus106]

Try to listen to the Rostropovich National Symphony version. It is the polar opposite of happy: more like grinning/grimacing through the pain. It will utterly change how you hear that finale.

Sarge

Thanks for the rec. Which label is this on?

[Brian]

Thanks for the rec. Which label is this on?

It's on PentaTone, and Sarge made a typo - the conductor's name is Yakov Kreizberg with the Russian National Orchestra.

Actually, it's on Teldec, and I haven't heard Rostropovich, but Kreizberg is another conductor who really "nails" the pain and suffering of the finale. In Dave Hurwitz' apt phrase, "the movement heaves its lacerated carcass through the final bars."

[Opus106]

Try to listen to the Rostropovich National Symphony version. It is the polar opposite of happy: more like grinning/grimacing through the pain. It will utterly change how you hear that finale.

Sarge

It's on PentaTone, and Sarge made a typo - the conductor's name is Yakov Kreizberg with the Russian National Orchestra.

Actually, it's on Teldec, and I haven't heard Rostropovich, but Kreizberg is another conductor who really "nails" the pain and suffering of the finale. In Dave Hurwitz' apt phrase, "the movement heaves its lacerated carcass through the final bars."

Oops! I just realised that Sarge was talking about the 5th, and not about the 10th. I already have a Slava/NSO in the 5th. It is from DG, however. And thanks for your reco-emendation, Brian.

[Sergeant Rock]

I already have a Slava/NSO in the 5th. It is from DG, however.

The DG is the one I was referring to specifically although the Teldec version (recorded ten years later as part of his cycle) is similar in mood and timings.

Sarge