Alfred Schnittke (1934-1998)

[karlhenning]

At the moment my favorite pieces of Schnittke are the piano concerti.

Mine, as well.  Really love this disc of Ewa Kupiec (and Mari Lettberg) playing three concerti.

[karlhenning]

Yes, that comment was a bit of straw-mannery. One doesn't have to be among the "World's Brilliant Composers" to be worth hearing. And "granny" is hardly relevant here.

I'll accept that; but then, of course, it's bad form when all that one posts in a given composer's thread is, Pfff, this composer is overrated.

[DavidW]

I'll accept that; but then, of course, it's bad form when all that one posts in a given composer's thread is, Pfff, this composer is overrated.

But MI explains exactly what he doesn't like about the music, and even makes it clear who he thinks has overrated the composer.  You might disagree with the post (as I do) but there is really nothing shallow about MI's response.

[Mirror Image]

But MI explains exactly what he doesn't like about the music, and even makes it clear who he thinks has overrated the composer.  You might disagree with the post (as I do) but there is really nothing shallow about MI's response.

If Karl didn't read my post then that's his problem. It still doesn't change how I feel about Schnittke's music. I explained that I thought his polystylism method of composition wasn't very well conceived. It lacked cohesion. What his first symphony sounded like to me was a kid in the candy store who stuffs their face with as much candy as humanly possible.

[karlhenning]

If Karl didn't read my post then that's his problem. It still doesn't change how I feel about Schnittke's music. I explained that I thought his polystylism method of composition wasn't very well conceived. It lacked cohesion. What his first symphony sounded like to me was a kid in the candy store who stuffs their face with as much candy as humanly possible.

Well, and if you don't listen to other pieces, but still claim that this is a problem with Schnittke's music in general, that's your problem, MI.  It may well be that I would not like the First Symphony any better than you.  But (a) I know a number of pieces which cohere very well, with compelling musical result; and (b) you cannot throw a dead cat in this forum without hitting a dozen composers whose first symphony is not well representative of all their music.

[DavidW]

Like Mozart or Haydn.  Well Haydn's 1st symphony is pretty good but it's no London symphony.

[Scarpia]

Mine, as well.  Really love this disc of Ewa Kupiec (and Mari Lettberg) playing three concerti.

I have to my amend my previous post to say my favorite Schnittke is the piano concerto (no plural).  Looking back, it was the concerto for piano and strings (BIS recording) that I was so taken by.  I have the cpo disc but have not found time to listen yet.

[karlhenning]

I do need at last to investigate Peer Gynt . . . .

[Mirror Image]

Well, and if you don't listen to other pieces, but still claim that this is a problem with Schnittke's music in general, that's your problem, MI.  It may well be that I would not like the First Symphony any better than you.  But (a) I know a number of pieces which cohere very well, with compelling musical result; and (b) you cannot throw a dead cat in this forum without hitting a dozen composers whose first symphony is not well representative of all their music.

Yes, I agree, which why I said I haven't given up hope with Schnittke. What are some of these works which "cohere" so well in your opinion?

By the way, I was just using the first symphony as example. What's interesting is it took him several years to write it. Don't really understand what took him so long as it just sounds like an endless stream of random thought.

[karlhenning]

Yes, I agree, which why I said I haven't given up hope with Schnittke. What are some of these works which "cohere" so well in your opinion?

I don't find a misplaced note in all of either of these discs (admittedly, there is one piece in common between them):

[asin]B001BLR74E[/asin]

[asin]B0013V9RWC[/asin]

[Mirror Image]

I don't find a misplaced note in all of either of these discs (admittedly, there is one piece in common between them):

[asin]B001BLR74E[/asin]

[asin]B0013V9RWC[/asin]

Thanks Karl. I own the BIS set of symphonies. I'll just stick with these for now. I don't feel compelled to buy any other recordings of his music right now.

[karlhenning]

Well, but it may be that with Schnittke (as with Pärt in my limited experience) that the symphonies are not where the composer's best work resides.  The fact that they both have "symphony cycles" may be a false lure.

That said, I completely understand if, having shelled for the symphony box and finding that unsatisfactory, you feel no great enthusiasm for further purchases.

[karlhenning]

(And I feel sure I have the Piano Quintet sitting around here somewhere . . . .)

[Mirror Image]

Well, but it may be that with Schnittke (as with Pärt in my limited experience) that the symphonies are not where the composer's best work resides.  The fact that they both have "symphony cycles" may be a false lure.

That said, I completely understand if, having shelled for the symphony box and finding that unsatisfactory, you feel no great enthusiasm for further purchases.

Actually, your logic does make sense. I mean I guess I should try some other works. I'd like to hear that Peer Gynt ballet as the audio samples sounded very interesting. I would also like to try some of his other orchestral works and maybe even the string quartets, which I heard are quite good.

[karlhenning]

(For the record: It is quite strange, really, that I find myself in the position of a Schnittke apologist. More than one piece left a negative impression early on. OTOH, I did remember seeing much of Konzert zu Dritt on the telly in St Petersburg, and it is an inarguably strong piece.  Can't help thinking of Billy Wilder's "You're as good as the best thing you've done.")

[Mirror Image]

(For the record: It is quite strange, really, that I find myself in the position of a Schnittke apologist. More than one piece left a negative impression early on. OTOH, I did remember seeing much of Konzert zu Dritt on the telly in St Petersburg, and it is an inarguably strong piece.  Can't help thinking of Billy Wilder's "You're as good as the best thing you've done.")

What work by Schnittke made a negative impression on you?

FYI: I think the symphony cycle is important or at least was important to Schnittke or else why would he have composed nine of them (not counting the ninth symphony, but I am including the "0" numbered symphony)? Obviously, he liked the form, so he continued writing in it.

[karlhenning]

What work by Schnittke made a negative impression on you?

The first, I don't know just what piece it was.  Then, I can't say I'm crazy about his cadenza(s) for the Beethoven Violin Concerto.

Kremer also came to Boston to play one or other of the Chamber Concerti, and it did not win me over, either.  Which surprised me a bit, because as a rule I am a great enthusiast for Kremer.

[karlhenning]

I know that clippage can be unreliable, but . . . based on listening to clips, I'd be inclined to give the symphonies n^os. 4, 6-8 a try . . . .

[Scarpia]

(For the record: It is quite strange, really, that I find myself in the position of a Schnittke apologist. More than one piece left a negative impression early on. OTOH, I did remember seeing much of Konzert zu Dritt on the telly in St Petersburg, and it is an inarguably strong piece.  Can't help thinking of Billy Wilder's "You're as good as the best thing you've done.")

I find Schnittke somewhat similar to Brian in that his lunacy is considered an endearing quality by enthusiasts.

[karlhenning]

Does anyone here like the First Symphony (a piece I have not heard, BTW)?

; )