Prokofiev's Paddy Wagon

[Mirror Image]

Can you do a Jarvi 5 comparison with another version? How do you feel about the much maligned acoustics? (I never seemed to have a problem with Jarvi/Chandos sound)


All I've been doing is listening to this Dutoit 5- which I'm highly critical of (every tempo should be either faster OR slower)- and I'm getting slightly obsessed... just saw that Bernstein is even slower than Levi?!!

If you want raw, impassioned Prokofiev, then check out Rozhdestvensky's cycle on Melodiya, snyprrr. May very well change your view of the composer's symphonies.

[asin]B004FSJPG8[/asin]

[snyprrr]

I find I've got the Ashkenazy;  will give it a spin this evening.

sweeeet!! yes, do get back

If you want raw, impassioned Prokofiev, then check out Rozhdestvensky's cycle on Melodiya, snyprrr. May very well change your view of the composer's symphonies.

[asin]B004FSJPG8[/asin]

If I could get the 5th or 7th as a single. Somehow I've kept myself to about 96 cents per Prokofiev cd on this binge (not incl. the flippin $4 shipping, accckkk!!). Levi is available for one cent! Rozhy- he's apparently got some clout left!! (ugh, how I'd like to get some of those Japanese issues of his)

anyhoo, whilst I haaave you here,..hmm, ... do have Masur/Teldec in the 5th? Tennstedt 5/7? MTT in 5?


Exactly how much does everyone like that Prodigal Son/Chandos disc?

[TheGSMoeller]

Exactly how much does everyone like that Prodigal Son/Chandos disc?

The Prodigal Son is a great piece, one of my favorite from SP, and the Chandos/Jarvi is worth the price. Look for the Michail Jurowski version on CPO as well.

[Karl Henning]

The Prodigal Son is a great piece, one of my favorite from SP, and the Chandos/Jarvi is worth the price. Look for the Michail Jurowski version on CPO as well.

Greg is giving you pearls here, snypsss!

[Ken B]

Greg is giving you pearls here, snypsss!

That Greg, he doesn't Monkey around.

[TheGSMoeller]

That Greg, he doesn't Monkey around.

Never have. Never w...oh look, banana!

[Karl Henning]

"Easy as taking pearls from a monkey...."

[Karl Henning]

Сергей Сергеевич [ Sergei Sergeyevich (Prokofiev) ]
Симфония № 1 ре мажор «Классическая», соч. 25 [ Symphony № 1 in D, Opus 25 “Classical”]
Большой симфонический оркестр Всесоюзного радио и Центрального телевидения
Геннадий Николаевич [ Gennady Nikolayevich (Rozhdestvensky) ]

The Allegro perhaps just a trifle on the fast side, but never driven. Very good.

The Larghetto beautifully paced, and beautifully phrased.

The Gavotta: Non troppo allegro is (as it ought to be) graceful and dance-like.

The Finale:  Molto vivace is excellent, cheerfully paced, never exasperated.  Ebullient!

[Karl Henning]

Сергей Сергеевич [ Sergei Sergeyevich (Prokofiev) ]
Симфония № 4 до мажор, соч. 112 [ Symphony № 4 in C (revised version), Opus 112 ]
Большой симфонический оркестр Всесоюзного радио и Центрального телевидения
Геннадий Николаевич [ Gennady Nikolayevich (Rozhdestvensky) ]

In general, what I find myself dissatisfied with in this set is solely a matter of the recording, a lack of clarity, a muffled quality in the tutti sections, a bit too much noise in the softer sections.  Setting that (to whatever degree I can) aside, the character of the performances/interpretation is overall very good.  My personal take (YMMV) is, that Slava is no less good an interpreter, his orchestra is stronger, and the sound of his recordings is clear as a bell.

There:  I've said it.

I hope we can all still be friends.

[Karl Henning]

Mmyes, far too much noise (to my taste) at the end of the first movement of the great B^b symphony.

[Karl Henning]

[trivial]

When I was in upstate New York, I owned the Yoel Levi/Atlanta Symphony recording of the Op.100.  I do not have any particular recollection of it.

[/trivial]

[Karl Henning]

Mmyes, far too much noise (to my taste) at the end of the first movement of the great B^b symphony.

Much of the Adagio is, by contrast, less "noisy."  I like to celebrate the good, you know . . . .

[snyprrr]

Much of the Adagio is, by contrast, less "noisy."  I like to celebrate the good, you know . . . .

All things must be taken into consideration, after all! Keep up the good work!

No one has arrived yet for the party,... oh wait, Rostropvich/Erato in No.6, per SantaFe's recommendation,... and, since I have nothing to compare it to (he says it's in a class of its own)- I think, if he's right, then this is a pretty incredibly idiomatic performance and perfectly suited recording- with slurpy french winds,... it sounds to me like a poem to a forgotten, fallen Vietman? It's very 'Oriental' sounding to me, in the way that some Russians are. Anyhow, read SantaFeListener's take on it, but, I wouldn't want to hear another version right now and spoil it all. For the 6th, in excellent sound, and maybe beyond, this is 100% commitment- even when the music seems to getting wayward, it all gels together. The bass(ic) instruments, including piano, sound like the mountains, and the strings and such on top are the skies of change. It's soooo paranoid!! The "Looko Over Your Shoulder" Symphony- which a devastated ending, again turning sour at the very end just like the 5th, but here it's Schnittke-like. Still very ballet-like.

e-flat minor!! (the 5th in E Flat Major)

[Mirror Image]

In general, what I find myself dissatisfied with in this set is solely a matter of the recording, a lack of clarity, a muffled quality in the tutti sections, a bit too much noise in the softer sections.  Setting that (to whatever degree I can) aside, the character of the performances/interpretation is overall very good.  My personal take (YMMV) is, that Slava is no less good an interpreter, his orchestra is stronger, and the sound of his recordings is clear as a bell.

There:  I've said it.

I hope we can all still be friends.

Sometimes it's the imperfections of a performance that I enjoy. I like Prokofiev with a certain rawness and, although, I do agree with you about the audio quality, but even as much of an audiophile I claim to be, I can put aside all my gripes and complaints about this Rozhdestvensky set because the performances are just simply riveting from start to finish. I NEVER heard Prokofiev played with as much fire as I have heard here. But, at the end of the day, it's all about personal preferences. I do like Rostropovich's cycle, but my tastes are more aligned to the Rozhdestvensky.

[snyprrr]

but even as much of an audiophile I claim to be,

I struggle here. With some Composers, it's easy to learn to deal with earlier recordings- I still think the '60s Xenakis is boffo good- but with others,- say Prokofiev, I tend to EXPECT that these roads have been ploughed so many times that I actually become offended when a new modern digital recording falls flat on its face. With Prokofiev 5, for instance, there should be no excuse for not having a modern version that, SIMPLY, "has.it.all." Period. There should be

1) one conductor who is in service to the history of the music, and won't do stupid shit

2) an orchestra that can play like a dream

3) a label/engineer/producer who can capture everything we expect them to- totally invisible- we won't stand for ANY mistakes in 2014-

and how is that asking ANYTHING???



MI- I certainly thought you'd be 'one of those' but lately you're on something of a 'Melodiya' kick- meaning, you must now be a connesoor of Russian coughing along with the occasional decent Rozh. recording. i just wonder exaaactly where your line in the sand is- where do you compromise "seeing" God", to "hearing Him clearly"? Surely it's all vanity/subjective- "something I heard when I was young"- or mysterious things like that?

That Suske set of LvB SQs (Berlin) has this particular sound,- old, yet fresh-,--- just "there"....----

Those Mercury recordings... still unmatched...

Apparently that Malko 7th...


Like, I made that compromise when I picked My First 7th.- I wanted to try Tennstedt, but Ozawa's sound was by far the most dramatic (in that DG way, who can resist?). I probably would have gone for Malko except for the 'happy ending' dealbreaker. Philips seemed to whack Gergiev with (imo) horrible Philips sound (a very unique and unsuccessful sound for that set imo). And, on top of that, no one was really lambasting Ozawa in the 7th. He was also $2! But seriously, I would have ALSO gotten Tennstedt had I not a backlog of slavish BuyItNow lined up!


Like, who would like the Jarvi as much if he didn't have that dream inducing Chandos sound? Why couldn't we have a Martinon recorded on Mercury instead of Vox? And so on...

WHAT IF??


Oh, what if??



Penguin Guide 1995

Prokofiev Symphonies 5-7

Royal Concertgebouw Orchestra
Bernard Haitink

London 264-318

This new London issue of the glorious Concertgebouw under Haitink may be their finest hour yet. The Decca engineers also have outdone themselves to deliver what surely must be Record of the Year, though it is yet only May!

Haintink's reading of Prokofiev's greatest Symphonies is literally revelatory, giving in to some of the longest timings on record, and delivering an experience of such boundless power and imagination as to stagger the senses. One is unsure of whom is caressing whom, Haitink, or the engineers. One feels as those music is being born at the very moment it comes into being, and every strand stands sure against every other one to the cumulative effect of unbridled, wild pleasure exploding in one's head, climax after devastating climax sending one deeper into uncontrolled shivers of ecstasy bordering on the profane!

One may find the impulse to play these discs (two-for-one no less! has London gone mad?) over and over again, to the detriment of work, loved ones, and one's very survival! Rush out immediately and snap these up before the gods of Decca come to their senses and quickly take a chainsaw to the lot. This may be the single greatest recording achievement of the modern era, and surely will be an instant classic and standard for years to come. Prepare yourselves.

                                                                                                                                                                     Robert Layton

[Karl Henning]

.



(Just kidding..)

[snyprrr]

Coincidently, you've "bolded" my favorite Sevenths.

What I have:

Kosler/Czech Phil               10:19  7:54  6:56  9:09 (original end)
Weller/LPO                        10:12  7:41  6:49  8:43
Ozawa/Berlin Phil                 9:52  7:58  5:48  9:00 (original end)
Gergiev/LSO                       9:52  7:34  5:50  8:33 (original end)
Kitajenko/Gürzenich            9:50  9:01  5:57  8:37 (original end)
Rostropovich/O France         9:36  7:45  6:26  9:24 (original end)
Tennstedt/SOBR                 9:15  7:55  6:43  8:49 (original end)
Rozhdestvensky/Moscow      8:41  8:02  5:45  8:23 (original end)
Järvi/Scottish National          8:39  7:52  6:15  8:15 
Malko/Philharmonia              8:30  7:48   5:22  8:15

Sarge

I'm listening to Ozawa now- and, mm, the music's not doing anything for me. It doesn't seem to e Ozawa.  I don't know, if you told me it was Rimsky I might like it better. It just sounds like Cinderella music to me, fairy ballet, but without all the fun toy sounds. Mm... I'll give it some time, but I just don't think - it's like- ack- I wanted MORE!!

:'(I waaanted mooore

The slow movement reminds me a little of Honegger,... but... that's... not enough.

...you could tell me this was Glazunov or Miaskovsky and i miiight like it better... it just comes off as DSCH PC2 to me- light. And I know we have dark undercurrents, but... well, I'll let it marinate.

eh...uh...

[snyprrr]

Symphony No.2

Currently reacquainting with Ozawa

I NEED music like that first movement! Once I get into the whole hustle and bustle I immediately think of old newsreel styled TV, and industrial... Soviet... you know. Why does it remind me of Nielsen?

The second movement- I'm not quite sure what it's supposed to be- but I like it. I know it's not DSCH4, but I wonder what would be some other extreme works like this. I like the waywardness of the second movement.

I'm certainly enjoying this- viscerally- unlike the 7th. Maybe I need to hear the 7th AFTER the 2nd?

How does this Ozawa 2 compare? I can't imagine too much more power, impact, or intensity- maybe just a bit moreMoreMORE!, but Ozawa sets it off nicely.

[Karl Henning]

How does this Ozawa 2 compare? I can't imagine too much more power, impact, or intensity- maybe just a bit moreMoreMORE!, but Ozawa sets it off nicely.

The only other Second I need, is the Leinsdorf/BSO reissue.

(That said . . . I should revisit the Polyansky . . . .)

[not edward]

The only other Second I need, is the Leinsdorf/BSO reissue.

(That said . . . I should revisit the Polyansky . . . .)

Polyansky might be my favourite Second. Given that it has Ivashkin's excellent Symphony-Concerto on the disc too, I'm inclined to regard it as a no-brainer purchase.