Mahler Mania, Rebooted

[Ken B]

I have been listening to Mahler heavily for nearly the past year. I started with 4, then, per suggestions here, I took my time listening to the others nearly in order (with most of the song cycles mixed in early on). I'm happy with that approach as most of the symphonies took multiple listens to really appreciate. I'm still not quite there with 8 and DLVDE. But this afternoon I think I will listen to 9 for the first time.

It has been a wonderful journey. I can't help but feel a twinge of sadness.

I know what you mean. To forget all of Mozart, or Die Schoene Muellerin, and discover it all afresh ...

[Moonfish]

I won't be able to recreate the sense of discovery. There is tons of other music to discover, but it's rare to find things that have a similar effect on me.

1 or 4 would have been the best gateways for me. The weird thing about my first listen of 1 was how many times I was reminded of other works (3 of Beethoven, 2 of pieces composed after M1). That might have been a bigger distraction if I hadn't already gotten into the 4th. The others are just too long and at times brash to have made a good introduction, even though I now love most of them.

Hmm, yes, the sense of discovery is a precious commodity. At least you found time in your life to walk that path which is a gift in itself. I guess classical music has so many moments of discovery which perhaps explains our obsession with exploring music?  Fortunately, I still have Mahler gems to dwell on.. 

[Cato]

I won't be able to recreate the sense of discovery. There is tons of other music to discover, but it's rare to find things that have a similar effect on me.

True: one way to approach a kind of "first-time" discovery would be to hear different conductors handling the works.

The other is to discover composers who can be seen as his heirs, at least in part: e.g. Schoenberg, Krenek, Hartmann, Shostakovich, Britten,

[EigenUser]

I have been listening to Mahler heavily for nearly the past year. I started with 4, then, per suggestions here, I took my time listening to the others nearly in order (with most of the song cycles mixed in early on). I'm happy with that approach as most of the symphonies took multiple listens to really appreciate. I'm still not quite there with 8 and DLVDE. But this afternoon I think I will listen to 9 for the first time.

It has been a wonderful journey. I can't help but feel a twinge of sadness.

The adagio finale of 9 is amazing and amazingly sad. Some of the saddest music I've ever heard.

I haven't yet heard 3 or 8. The only one I didn't like so far was 6. I think my top three Mahler would be 7, 1, and either 2 or "Das Lied van der Erde" (which I'm listening to now). I love DLVDE, which I didn't expect.

[Ken B]

True: one way to approach a kind of "first-time" discovery would be to hear different conductors handling the works.

The other is to discover composers who can be seen as his heirs, at least in part: e.g. Schoenberg, Krenek, Hartmann, Shostakovich, Britten,

I keep finding wonderful music, and new music. 2014 has been a good year so far, with a few previously neglected composers found,  Lou Harrison for example, and above all one short piece, Feast of Love, by Virgil Thomson. So I'm not complaining 

[Ken B]

The adagio finale of 9 is amazing and amazingly sad. Some of the saddest music I've ever heard.

I haven't yet heard 3 or 8. The only one I didn't like so far was 6. I think my top three Mahler would be 7, 1, and either 2 or "Das Lied van der Erde" (which I'm listening to now). I love DLVDE, which I didn't expect.

DLVDE divides even Mahlerians, which surprised me, as I think it is gorgoeous. Have you heard Schonberg's arrangement for 9 instruments? If not, do so. This is the one I have, and can recommend.
[asin]B000FDFO30[/asin]

My choices would be 7, 6, 2 and 9. I hope you did not listen to a Bernstein 6 ...
Or maybe I hope you did, because then your dislike might be easily reversed 

[not edward]

DLVDE divides even Mahlerians, which surprised me, as I think it is gorgoeous.

I don't think I know too many people who don't rate the work.

Having said that, I don't listen to it all that often, perhaps because Janet Baker in Der Abschied is rather too intense an experience for everyday listening.

[Pat B]

I haven't yet heard 3 or 8. The only one I didn't like so far was 6. I think my top three Mahler would be 7, 1, and either 2 or "Das Lied van der Erde" (which I'm listening to now). I love DLVDE, which I didn't expect.

Interesting. How many times have you listened to them? For me, 6 was a relatively tough nut to crack, but 7 was tougher still. Even most of the earlier ones required multiple listens.

I like 3 a lot but it is loooong.

Thanks to all for the responses and suggestions.

[Jay F]

For me, 6 was a relatively tough nut to crack, but 7 was tougher still. Even most of the earlier ones required multiple listens.

I don't understand what is difficult about giving a work "multiple listens." I expect to listen to a piece of music many times if I like it, or suspect I will like it. I want to have "multiple listens." I liked 6 and 7 immediately and they are still my two of my four favorites hundreds of listens later (the others being 2 and 3). Mahler was not a "tough nut to crack" for me.

[Cato]

I keep finding wonderful music, and new music. 2014 has been a good year so far, with a few previously neglected composers found,  Lou Harrison for example, and above all one short piece, Feast of Love, by Virgil Thomson. So I'm not complaining 

And if you like Mahler, one way to re-create that "first time" experience is to hear the only symphony by Mahler's friend and classmate at the Vienna Conservatory:

Hans Rott!

Here is a taste, if you do not know the work:

https://www.youtube.com/v/RR5mJM4b1XE

[EigenUser]

Interesting. How many times have you listened to them? For me, 6 was a relatively tough nut to crack, but 7 was tougher still. Even most of the earlier ones required multiple listens.

I've heard #2 twice, at least, maybe three times (I've heard the scherzo of this many times). I've heard #6 only once. I wasn't in any hurry to hear it again, but I plan on it. I have heard #7 at least five times -- not necessarily because I'm trying to figure it out, but because I love it. Same with #9.

[Jay F]

And if you like Mahler, one way to re-create that "first time" experience is to hear the only symphony by Mahler's friend and classmate at the Vienna Conservatory:

Hans Rott!

Here is a taste, if you do not know the work:

https://www.youtube.com/v/RR5mJM4b1XE

Thank you, Cato. It gets Mahlery to the max in places. It may be the Mahleriest music Mahler didn't make. Thanks as well for the most good grumble on superlatives and comparatives.

[bwv 1080]

/quote]
Even more than Shostakovich?

[Ken B]

And if you like Mahler, one way to re-create that "first time" experience is to hear the only symphony by Mahler's friend and classmate at the Vienna Conservatory:

Hans Rott!

Here is a taste, if you do not know the work:

https://www.youtube.com/v/RR5mJM4b1XE

Ever since Nate brought shame upon himself and his descendants unto the 7th generation for prefering 1 to several other symphonies, I have been urging him to listen to Rott's symphony; he already likes it.   

[Jay F]

/quote]

Have you listened to it? It's Mahlerier in places than anything I know by Shostakovich, though I invite you to prove me wrong. I am new to Shostakovich, particularly the symphonies, and because I bought them all in one 2010s chunk (Barshai's Super Big Super Cheap Super Box), I don't have much sense of differentiation among them.

[Pat B]

I don't understand what is difficult about giving a work "multiple listens." I expect to listen to a piece of music many times if I like it, or suspect I will like it. I want to have "multiple listens." I liked 6 and 7 immediately and they are still my two of my four favorites hundreds of listens later (the others being 2 and 3). Mahler was not a "tough nut to crack" for me.

Apparently I wasn't clear. By "require multiple listens" I meant I didn't start to appreciate those works until after several listens.

4 is the only one I immediately took to. Next I listened to 1, which was love on second or third listen. The remainder (with the possibly surprising exception of 3) took longer, but at each point I liked the previous ones enough that I expected the current one to be worth the effort -- and that always turned out to be true. I nearly gave up on 7, then it finally clicked. The jury is still out on 8, DLVDE, and 9, but I like their chances.

Before this recent listening spree I had heard some Mahler, but that was years ago. I don't remember which ones.

ETA: usually my listening is not this regimented. But it worked.

[Ken B]

Apparently I wasn't clear. By "require multiple listens" I meant I didn't start to appreciate those works until after several listens.

4 is the only one I immediately took to. Next I listened to 1, which was love on second or third listen. The remainder (with the possibly surprising exception of 3) took longer, but at each point I liked the previous ones enough that I expected the current one to be worth the effort -- and that always turned out to be true. I nearly gave up on 7, then it finally clicked. The jury is still out on 8, DLVDE, and 9, but I like their chances.

Before this recent listening spree I had heard some Mahler, but that was years ago. I don't remember which ones.

ETA: usually my listening is not this regimented. But it worked.

I took to all but 8 immediately, 6 and 7 in particular, 1 less than the others. Over the years Mahler has dropped a lot for me, but periodically rebounds. I have developed a permanent aversion to the Bernstein approach. He's not the only one of those of course. Long ago I would want any Bach recording Grammophone dismissed as "pedantic". Now I seek out cold, passionless, clinical Mahler. Not that those are good things, but they are scode for "puts the structure and flow above indulgence and bombast". I like the Boulez I have heard. Chailly is still my top pick. Klemps  might be the best 7.

[Madiel]

There was a blind listening going on with No.2, and it seems to have ground to a halt. Which is a great pity, because it could have provided me with a lot of information about which conductors would suit my own personal tastes.

[snyprrr]

It was Szell that I had in 6 on the cheap SONY. I can't remember the performance but I'm pretty sure it was acquired through Penguin Guide strong arm tactics (their top recommends). But a lot of reviews find Szell to zippy or something, not smelling the dying roses?


I did get Abbado/Berlin for 7 (only 5 cents, can't blame me there, haha!), but I'm stuck on 6. I really want something horribly terrifying or shocking or something- maybe it IS Lenny SONY? (though his DG gets the "one of a kind" sticker)


I'm sorry I'm being such a pain, but economic collapse is right around the corner and I NEED soundtrack material! NOW!!!






But seriously- I get soooo tired of endless amazon review pages just saying BernsteinBernsteinBernstein- but maybe once I get over this mental block I'll fall right in line.




Segerstam 6 Jarvi (the strangest and the fastest?)

How many weeks later Abbado/Berlin 7 arrives! Half way through...

Mvmt 1- Sounds like  boat ride down the Rhine... turbulence at @7mins (is Abbado MOR here? I could see Lenny overdoing this part!!).... very flowing boat ride... Wagner chords...

Mvmt 2- 'Fantasy Variations on the Valkyre Theme'- Mahler seems obsessed with Wagner?


After so much Shosty, Mahler seems so much like 'normal' music, but this 7th has an opulent richness to it, as if you're travelling a scenic path and all this incidental detail comes and goes, whilst the pulse remains steady. The 7th sounds to me like a High Society Bash, a Party Night on the Rhine- at least in Abbado/Berlin I'm not hearing 'Psychological' as much as 'Ecological'? Still, it sounds like a looot of cholesterol!!

As far as this Abbado/Berlin- mm- it sounds like a real good band playing, that much is clear!- The actual SOUNDS hitting the ear are very tickling and juicy. Perhaps I sense a lack of danger, but why would I want danger at a Beach Party for the Elite?

I did get a feeling that everything was just... slightly... 'perfect'... meaning, there could be something missing, but frankly, the sheer lushness going on here will keep your attention from moment to moment. I have no idea what the Reviewers meant by their comments about the 'atmosphere'- I didn't feel any 'misterioso'- things were pretty much here-they-are-in-all-their-glory, though, the actual 'ambience/atmosphere' does have a perfect aura to it. There is almost a New Yyears Gala feel to the proceedings-

Well, I guess if Beethoven ate mushrooms, this is what would happen?



So, this is "one" of the very best, eh?   Well, it sounds great! Not knowing the music, there was only a moment or two where I would have asked about what I was hearing, such must be the credit to Abbado for steering well. Above all else, this music comes off as a Large Viennese Symphonic Travelling Montage Landscape with Dancing! and some Gnomes thrown in for good measure! Hippy Mendelssohn

[Brahmsian]

Well, I guess if Beethoven ate mushrooms, this is what would happen?