Five great performances of Tchaikovsky's 'Pathetique' Symphony

[Karl Henning]

He just disappeared, loved his Chopin then one day was no more a GMG-er...

Sorry to see him go.  He was a bit split-screen with me, but that was an inarguable improvement on some whole-screen personalities we've had 

[Brian]

He just disappeared, loved his Chopin then one day was no more a GMG-er...

I have a very vague memory of him running into legal trouble. Not sure if that is true.

[Karl Henning]

Koussevitsky (RCA)
Stupka (Supraphon)
Mravinsky (Erato)
Fricsay (DGG)
Ancerl (DGG)

Does Koussevitsky conduct the BSO in that one?

[Drasko]

Kondrashin / Moscow PO (Altus, live '67)

Kondrashin's became my favourite after being introduced to it by Tony "Sidoze"...any old timers remember Sidoze?

Nowadays he's got very interesting youtube channel, including above mentioned Kondrashin Pathetique:

https://www.youtube.com/v/qPAxt_YqflU

[Brahmsian]

I only have the Muti/New Philharmonia set of Tchaikovsky symphonies, but greatly enjoy them and one of my most often listened to symphony sets!

I think Brian, if I recall some years ago, had some lukewarm reviews on the Muti set, but I believe he had high prise for Muti's Pathetique.  Please correct me if I'm wrong, Brian. 

[Karl Henning]

I only have the Muti/New Philharmonia set of Tchaikovsky symphonies, but greatly enjoy them and one of my most often listened to symphony sets!

Another recording I need to go back to!  Cheers, Ray!

[Brian]

I only have the Muti/New Philharmonia set of Tchaikovsky symphonies, but greatly enjoy them and one of my most often listened to symphony sets!

I think Brian, if I recall some years ago, had some lukewarm reviews on the Muti set, but I believe he had high prise for Muti's Pathetique.  Please correct me if I'm wrong, Brian. 

I can't remember.
What I do remember is the 5th being dispassionate but the 4th being really really good.

[mc ukrneal]

Not quite but almost 

KARAJAN BERLIN
ORMANDY PHILADELPHIA
SOLTI CHICAGO
ASHKENAZY PHILH
BERNSTEIN NEW YORK
FRANCK SWEDISH RADIO SO
MRAVINSKY LENINGRAD PHIL
ABENDROTH RSO LEIPZIG
GOLOVANOV USSR RADIO SO
PLETNEV RUSSIAN NATIONAL O
MARKEVITCH LSO
JUROWSKI LPO
GIULINI LOS ANGELES
CELIBIDACHE MUNICH PHIL
SINOPOLI PHILHARMONIA


Sarge

You better get cracking! There are like 150 more!

[Karl Henning]

Not quite but almost 

KARAJAN BERLIN
ORMANDY PHILADELPHIA
SOLTI CHICAGO
ASHKENAZY PHILH
BERNSTEIN NEW YORK
FRANCK SWEDISH RADIO SO
MRAVINSKY LENINGRAD PHIL
ABENDROTH RSO LEIPZIG
GOLOVANOV USSR RADIO SO
PLETNEV RUSSIAN NATIONAL O
MARKEVITCH LSO
JUROWSKI LPO
GIULINI LOS ANGELES
CELIBIDACHE MUNICH PHIL
SINOPOLI PHILHARMONIA


Sarge

What, favorites not indicated? 

How is Lenny there?  (I know, I could listen myself ** . . . you know I am interested in your opinion.)

** except that this CD player, which started out cheap, seems to have become entirely useless, skipperiffic.  (Well, I had a year or two of use, no huge complaints for a $20 appliance from Radio Shack.)

[mc ukrneal]

What, favorites not indicated? 

How is Lenny there?  (I know, I could listen myself ** . . . you know I am interested in your opinion.)

** except that this CD player, which started out cheap, seems to have become entirely useless, skipperiffic.  (Well, I had a year or two of use, no huge complaints for a $20 appliance from Radio Shack.)

Sarge listed it as a favorite earlier.

I like it too. Lenny is himself. SO by that you might adore it or hate it. He's slow, but the idea is great and the NYPO execute brilliantly. Unless, of course, you hate it!

[Karl Henning]

Sarge listed it as a favorite earlier.

I like it too. Lenny is himself. SO by that you might adore it or hate it. He's slow, but the idea is great and the NYPO execute brilliantly. Unless, of course, you hate it!

Interesting!  Must bring the CDs home to listen to.

Larry specifically criticized the DG recording, but I see that is the NY Phil, too!  Do you gents mean the 1964 recording or the 1987?  TIA.

[Karl Henning]

. . . and I see that the Monteux box includes the Fourth, Fifth & Sixth with the BSO . . . could be a Tchaikovsky weekend . . . .

[Brian]

Larry specifically criticized the DG recording, but I see that is the NY Phil, too!  Do you gents mean the 1964 recording or the 1987?  TIA.

The DG recording is one of the most, uh, eccentric things Lenny ever did. And that's saying a lot!

[Karl Henning]

The DG recording is one of the most, uh, eccentric things Lenny ever did. And that's saying a lot!

Beating a field, perhaps not crowded, but . . . ample 

[Brahmsian]

. . . could be a Tchaikovsky weekend . . . .

Not a bad idea! 

[(poco) Sforzando]

Interesting!  Must bring the CDs home to listen to.

Larry specifically criticized the DG recording, but I see that is the NY Phil, too!  Do you gents mean the 1964 recording or the 1987?  TIA.

I am referring to the NY Phil DG 1987. The idea may or may not be "great," but it's not Tchaikovsky's idea; instead it's all about Lenny emoting and suffering and bearing the weight of the world on his shoulders. I keep the CD as a party record, the only problem being that I don't give parties. But the symphony Tchaikovsky wrote has more dignity than that.

[Sergeant Rock]

How is Lenny there?

Lenny being Lenny. Brilliant and, yes, eccentric. For years I hated the Symphony's last movement. Hollywood kitsch to my ears. I seldom went beyond the first three movements. Bernstein DG convinced me otherwise. He prolongs that movement to Mahlerian length (17+), convincing me his way is right. I'm sure Pyotr Ilyich (and at least one member here  ) would disagree. The first movement he conducts as though it's Le sacre...barbaric and thrilling.

Sarge

[(poco) Sforzando]

Lenny being Lenny. Brilliant and, yes, eccentric. For years I hated the Symphony's last movement. Hollywood kitsch to my ears. I seldom went beyond the first three movements. Bernstein DG convinced me otherwise. He prolongs that movement to Mahlerian length (17+), convincing me his way is right. I'm sure Pyotr Ilyich (and at least one member here  ) would disagree. The first movement he conducts as though it's Le sacre...barbaric and thrilling.

Sarge

I fail to see how Bernstein makes the last movement sound less like Hollywood kitsch.

(Though the reference to Mahler is not out of place, the structure of this symphony having clearly influenced the structure of the Mahler 9th.)

[Sergeant Rock]

I fail to see how Bernstein makes the last movement sound less like Hollywood kitsch.

His tempo turns the sentimental into profound tragedy. I can't say others will hear it that way but it works for me. I'm grateful Bernstein chose his own path.

Sarge

[vandermolen]

Mravinsky.

Your list is very interesting. I have to get the Koussevitsky (love his Brahms and Sibelius), Fricsay's Tchaikovsky I never liked, to me feels rushed and breathless in all the wrong places, I didn't know there is an Ancerl recording (where to find it?) and have no idea who is Stupka (can you tell a bit more about it).

Sorry, I made a boo-boo with the Ancerl, having confused it with his Shostakovich Symphony 10  it doesn't exist. I will change my initial post and add the fine DGG Mravinsky. The Stupka, does however exist it is on a wonderful Supraphon CD coupled with an excellent performance of Novak's tone poem 'In the Tatras' (which was my original reason for buying the CD) and Dvorak's 'Carnival Overture'. The performance of the Tchaikovsky dates from 1949. The number is SU 1909 - 2 001:
[asin]B000003589[/asin]
The CD is now ridiculously priced but you can get a download.
Frantisek Stupka (1879-1965). He was still conducting in 1965. He conducted 1,400 concerts featuring the work of 300 composers but he did not leave many recordings which, on the strength of the above disc, is a great pity. He was initially apprenticed as a blacksmith. He was rather in the shadow of Vaclav Talich.