What audio system do you have, or plan on getting?

[Ken B]

True! True! But a high level single disc player seems to shimmer like a fancy BMW. I was spoiled with my previous multi. I guess it just is a matter of habit. Your multi Onkyo certainly has received mixed reviews on Amazon. It seems as if one either receives a functional item or a lemon. A very bipolar set of reviews! 

Yes, early models had problems. That's a feature not a bug. The price is lower that way!

The Onkyo has a good DAC but my Marantz amp has a better one. So i hook the CD player to the amp with a digital cable. If you have a high end older no DAC amp you might want a CD player with a new DAC. Otherwise you will use the digital out.

[Todd]

Any specific reason behind the Oppo (blu-ray capacity?)?  Also, is the price for the Salk speakers per pair or per speaker?

The Oppo plays CD, BD, DVD Audio, and high res audio discs.  Sound quality is far better than its price point implies.  I own both the BD-83 (bedroom system video, non-CD audio) and BDP-103 (home theater).  Picture quality is also superb, if it is used for video.

Salk prices are per pair.  Salk and Philharmonic have price-to-performance ratios that are off the charts.  The drive units used in the SongTower cost more than the units used in some speakers in the $5K-$8K/pair range.  The Hiquphon tweeter in the Salks has one of the best measured CSD plots of any tweeter on the market, regardless of price, and not surprisingly, the clarity of the speakers is most impressive.  (I own three pairs of Salks, including the SongTower.)  Dennis Murphy designs crossovers for Salk and he owns Philharmonic Audio, so the sound would be quite similar between the brands.  He is also an amateur orchestral musician, so he voices with an ear for classical music specifically.

[Moonfish]

The Oppo plays CD, BD, DVD Audio, and high res audio discs.  Sound quality is far better than its price point implies.  I own both the BD-83 (bedroom system video, non-CD audio) and BDP-103 (home theater).  Picture quality is also superb, if it is used for video.

Salk prices are per pair.  Salk and Philharmonic have price-to-performance ratios that are off the charts.  The drive units used in the SongTower cost more than the units used in some speakers in the $5K-$8K/pair range.  The Hiquphon tweeter in the Salks has one of the best measured CSD plots of any tweeter on the market, regardless of price, and not surprisingly, the clarity of the speakers is most impressive.  (I own three pairs of Salks, including the SongTower.)  Dennis Murphy designs crossovers for Salk and he owns Philharmonic Audio, so the sound would be quite similar between the brands.  He is also an amateur orchestral musician, so he voices with an ear for classical music specifically.

The Oppo certainly seems to be a hot item! Almost a futuristic compilation of functions/abilities!
Isn't the Oppo more geared towards home theater (visual) even though it plays cd/SACD?  Since (in my case) it would be completely devoted towards audio (not connected to a screen at all) wouldn't it be better to invest in a player geared towards just audio (e.g. Marantz SA8005)? I guess Oppo is a lot of bangs for the bucks. What do you think?

Btw I keep looking at those Salk speakers you recommended. They certainly come across well in the reviews as well as visually. Apparently pieces of art at the same time as they an audiophiles dream!

[Moonfish]

Yes, early models had problems. That's a feature not a bug. The price is lower that way!

The Onkyo has a good DAC but my Marantz amp has a better one. So i hook the CD player to the amp with a digital cable. If you have a high end older no DAC amp you might want a CD player with a new DAC. Otherwise you will use the digital out.

I can see how the price can drop! 

So you are bypassing the Onkyo's DAC?

[Todd]

Isn't the Oppo more geared towards home theater (visual) even though it plays cd/SACD?

The Oppo is great for audio.  Since it handles high-res audio and SACD, you get more for the money.  For straight CD playback, better is available, but not really at or near the price. 

[jlaurson]

Hmm, now I am considering a major overhaul of my system [it has been 15 years after all]. Any interesting combinations to recommend in the price range of about 2-3k for an amplifier,  a cdp as well as a pair of speakers?     I need your knowledge and experience! 

...you might want a CD player with a new DAC...

My idea of an old fashioned stereo chain in a modern world would either look like this, or this:

version 1
Digital Source(s)	...	--->	DAC+CD/SACD Player	--->	Amplifier	--->	Speakers
version 2
Digital Source(s)	...	--->	DAC+Pre-Am+Headphone-Amp			--->	Active Speakers
						--->	Headphones

Digital sources in version one being a computer, a streamer, a network player... the like. Same, really with version 2, except there it might also include (multi-format) hardware players... but i.e. a less expensive CD player that can be tapped via digital out to take advantage of a fine dedicated DAC/Pre-Amp.

Of course it's possible to split up Pre-Amp and Headphone Amplifier or simply not bother with the latter, if one doesn't listen that way.

My choice of DAC/CD/SACD Player currently is the Yamaha  CD-S2100, esp. in combination with its Amp-brother A-S2100. A few Marantz-combos are very comparable in functionality.

My choice of speaker is a little specific and perhaps does not merit broad/general recommendation; Thiel SC-4T. (I'd have gotten the Thiel SC4 had it not been for a great price and happenstance and the dark cherry available in one but not the other... in any case a mute point, I think, because the SC-4T, identical except for having what is essentially an integrated stand (at too high a price, I find, if one were to pay list price) is discontinued; the SC4 continues strong.) http://www.thielaudio.com/

[The new erato]

Anybody buying a dedicated CA/SACD player these days should make sure that it has a large and versatile selection of digital inputs (eg that its signal processing elements works independently from its mecanical disc player). That way the most important parts of it are useful even for other formats than CD and other sources than the disc tray.

Ideally I would want a WiFiconnection as well, though I don't this this is generally offered.

Personally I have bought my last CD player and will go the separate DAC route at the next crossroads even if I will continue to buy CDs.

[Fëanor]

My idea of an old fashioned stereo chain in a modern world would either look like this, or this:

version 1
Digital Source(s)	...	--->	DAC+CD/SACD Player	--->	Amplifier	--->	Speakers
version 2
Digital Source(s)	...	--->	DAC+Pre-Am+Headphone-Amp			--->	Active Speakers
						--->	Headphones

Digital sources in version one being a computer, a streamer, a network player... the like. Same, really with version 2, except there it might also include (multi-format) hardware players... but i.e. a less expensive CD player that can be tapped via digital out to take advantage of a fine dedicated DAC/Pre-Amp.

Of course it's possible to split up Pre-Amp and Headphone Amplifier or simply not bother with the latter, if one doesn't listen that way.

In the end there is nothing that beats all-separates for versatility, especially if you ever expect to upgrade, i.e.

[Digital source => DAC] and/or [Turntable + cartridge => phono pre] and/or Tuner =>
Preamp=>
[power amp => speakers] and/or [Headphone amp => headphones]

OTOH money can be saved by combining.  So the long-time standard combo is [phono pre+preamp+amp+headphone amp] which we fondly call an 'integrated amp' or the [phono pre+tuner+preamp+power amp+headphone amp] which we call a 'receiver'.  I'd avoid combining components that are fast evolving such as a DAC with other components.

[Pat B]

How fast are DACs really evolving in 2015?

[Todd]

How fast are DACs really evolving in 2015?

From an engineering or marketing perspective?

[Pat B]

From an engineering or marketing perspective?

Exactly.

[Fëanor]

How fast are DACs really evolving in 2015?

Pretty fast from a technical perspective, I'd say, as are peripheral technologies such as USB and S/PDIF decoders.  The latest devices will usually handle high resolution files, e.g. 24 bit/192 kHz, and some decode DSD, (SACD-style), as well as PCM encoded files;  this is significant with the greater availability of hi-rez downloads from many online sources.  Also, the latest DACs are virtual immune to "jitter" thanks to asynchronous USB inputs and/or reclocking the incoming bit streams.

Pretty fast from a marketing perspective too, not unexpectedly.  Needless to say not everybody considers all the advances to be improvements, but that's the nature of audiophiles.

[Pat B]

Needless to say not everybody considers all the advances to be improvements, but that's the nature of audiophiles.

Yeah, count me among the skeptics. As far as I'm concerned, the DAC problem was solved 25 years ago, and jitter has never been a problem.

ETA: though an outboard DAC might be a good investment when outputting from a PC or TV as those are likely to have poor (extremely cheap) analog sections.

[Fëanor]

Yeah, count me among the skeptics. As far as I'm concerned, the DAC problem was solved 25 years ago, and jitter has never been a problem.

ETA: though an outboard DAC might be a good investment when outputting from a PC or TV as those are likely to have poor (extremely cheap) analog sections.

There are some nice older DACs.  A few pundits insist that the older "ladder" DACs are still the best sounding and there has always been a lot of dissention about oversampling.  Those older DACs won't handle 24 bits, but then again not everyone agrees that hi-rez is significantly better anyway.  In particular I'm skeptical the DSD encoding is really any better that PCM; I'm not rushing out to buy a new DAC just to have the DSD capability.

The de facto standard, Realtek DACs in computers are pretty poor compared to the excellent, standalone DACs available today.

[jlaurson]

The de facto standard, Realtek DACs in computers are pretty poor compared to the excellent, standalone DACs available today.

Oh, they're absolutely nasty!!! Fake reverb makes a total mess out of everything. Absolutely unlistenable, I find, after getting used to how it ought to sound. And entirely useless in the blind-listening Cello Suite thing. Every recording started sounding the same.

[Daverz]

I only have a few DSD downloads, but have yet to be impressed by the format.  It sounds a bit soft compared to the best PCM.

[HIPster]

Anyone have experience with the Marantz CD5004? I need a new CD player and am seeking feedback on this one.

Thanks!
A

I am considering this as a secondary CD player and it might be one for you to look into Allan ~

http://www.musicdirect.com/p-161290-yamaha-cd-n500-network-enabled-cd-player.aspx?source=igodigital&

At its original $800 price, it looked attractive to me, but now, it seems even more so.  Any thoughts on this?

[jlaurson]

I am considering this as a secondary CD player and it might be one for you to look into Allan ~

http://www.musicdirect.com/p-161290-yamaha-cd-n500-network-enabled-cd-player.aspx?source=igodigital&

At its original $800 price, it looked attractive to me, but now, it seems even more so.  Any thoughts on this?

German Audio magazine "Audio" rated it in issue 11/12... (which I have, but at home, so not available for detailed quoting)
It was then listed at 420 Euros, which is considerably lower (certainly at today's exchange rate, though not by as much then) than $800,-
It was listed at the same nominal level as players like Marantz CD-5004 & 6002, NAD C515 BEE, Denon CDC-720 AE, Cambridge 350 C and ahead of Yamaha CD-S300 & CD-S700 and a few others. A little below that they stop listing items... (The list tops out at 140, the Yamaha received 90)
These numerical ratings are nearly meaningless, of course, especially where functionality is concerned.

The Yamaha CD-N301, nominal price 350,- and probably the de-facto successor to the CD-N500 (although a N501 might well be forthcoming), was reviewed in the most recent issue, alongside Onkyo C-N7050 (400,-E) and Arcam CDS27 (1000,-E). Point being that all of them have network functionality and a CD Drive and AirPlay and USB connectors, internet-radio capable et al.

But it has: No on-device playlist capability. It has no FF / Rewind. And most damning for classical music aficionados: It has no gapless playback. None of the three units have that, incidentally... which is where I might have stopped reading. Their sound-rating is, all caveats active, 95, 95 and 108. Not sure that helps at all... except for you to double-check that the model you are looking at HAS gapless playback.  EDIT: Oh, So the N500 does have gapless playback, it says right there on the site.

[marvinbrown]

  Dear all:

  I just upgraded my system.  I sold my Monitor Audio BX5 floorstanding speakers and bought the Monitor Audio Silver 8s:

 

  I also sold my Marantz PM6004 amp and bought the Rega Elex-R amp:

 

  I have kept my Marantz 6004 CD player as it has an ipod  usb connection that I use every now and then.

  The above combination provides a smoother sound than the Bronze range and the Rega amp is quite lovely.

  marvin

[Todd]

Some nice gear there.  I've owned two pairs of Monitor Audio speakers, and three Rega source components over the years.  They have always sounded superb.