Havergal Brian.

[J.Z. Herrenberg]

Just listened to the Whitmore Groves Part 1 Mov. 1.  I think it's swings and roundabouts. The material you have to work with is difficult to improve dramatically. Still, I'd like you to do the other two, too, just as an additional aural perspective.


STOP PRESS The Hyperion Gothic has arrived!!!

[Dundonnell]

Delft is ablaze with sound

You can drown out the "music" from that club/bar opposite to your apartment

[J.Z. Herrenberg]

Delft is ablaze with sound

You can drown out the "music" from that club/bar opposite to your apartment

I just did!! Listened to Part 1 - exhilarated, moved, overwhelmed. As for the Vivace and the climax with the three astonishing bars: no, Brabbins doesn't slow down, the central chord isn't center stage here, but more of a tunnel through which the music surges to D minor. I think this means that Brabbins sees that D minor as the ultimate goal. When I heard that climactic moment again just now it felt as if I were lifted by a big hand from one equally high plateau to the next. In short: for Brabbins that second chord is not central. It's somehow typical for him not to 'fetishise' the chord...

[Sergeant Rock]

I think this means that Brabbins sees that D minor as the ultimate goal. When I heard it that climactic moment again just now it felt as if I were lifted by a big hand from one equally high plateau to the next. In short: for Brabbins that second chord is not central.

I'll try to listen to it from that perspective. It may help alleviate my (minor) disappointment with Brabbin's Gothic.

Sarge

[J.Z. Herrenberg]

I'll try to listen to it from that perspective. It may help alleviate my (minor) disappointment with Brabbin's Gothic.

Sarge

Well, Brabbins has changed my perspective on the passage. For me the final D minor stretch always felt almost as an afterthought. Now it doesn't. If you let yourself be carried along, you'll notice it does make musical sense to see that central F sharp minor chord as transitional, however sensational it may be.


P.S. As I have to go out, I'll save Part 2 for later tonight...

[Karl Henning]

It's Brian's early unpublished version with snakes playing a very prominent part throughout. Ruins it in my opinion.

The trouble has been when Copperheads are substituted for the more authentic Adder, I heard.

[Karl Henning]

The serpent is a ridiculous looking thing. Just like a clarinet that has been roughly handled by the Royal Mail with a brass mouthpiece instead of a reed. I wonder why you never come across it very often nowadays?

They're museum pieces, really. This album (by the Boston Symphony's bass trombonist, Douglas Yeo) is great fun.

[cilgwyn]

I've often wondered what that instrument sounded like! I think it's a bit of a beauty myself (the one in Johan's photograph). There's something very Heath Robinson about it.
  Glad to see that file issue sorted out. No (the defunct) Radio 3 Message Board style squabbling here. We're gentlemen!

[Sergeant Rock]

They're museum pieces, really. This album (by the Boston Symphony's bass trombonist, Douglas Yeo) is great fun.

Thanks for the link, Karl. Although I knew what a serpent looked like (and have heard them before in Norrington's LCP recording of the Symphonie fantastique) I could never figure out how they were held. Now I know. Looks quite awkward squeezed between the knees!

Sarge

[snyprrr]

I just did!! Listened to Part 1 - exhilarated, moved, overwhelmed. As for the Vivace and the climax with the three astonishing bars: no, Brabbins doesn't slow down, the central chord isn't center stage here, but more of a tunnel through which the music surges to D minor. I think this means that Brabbins sees that D minor as the ultimate goal. When I heard that climactic moment again just now it felt as if I were lifted by a big hand from one equally high plateau to the next. In short: for Brabbins that second chord is not central. It's somehow typical for him not to 'fetishise' the chord...

mm mm mm

So this is what all the fuss is about? A two hour Symphony,... for one chord , haha,... forgive me, but now I know how I must sound when I go on about how so-and-so just doesn't get the "_____" right, haha!!

ahh,... the Brian Thread!


btw- listened to some HB recently, after my last visit. You were discussing No.22, and it was on YT. I don't know, reminds me of that late Malipiero cranky roughness,... nice, short and sweet. I'm sure I like later Brian. But anyway, I did like No.22 (as opposed to petrarch, I believe), and, I've heard No.10. I didn't find No.31. Anyhow, I figured I could just catch up with Brian on YT, but it's not quite clear how many Symphonies are up.

[J.Z. Herrenberg]

I know for certain that symphonies 28 and 31 are on YouTube. If you really like late Brian I can give you a link to no. 27, too. But later - I'm watching my daughter on horseback...

[Sergeant Rock]

mm mm mm

So this is what all the fuss is about? A two hour Symphony,... for one chord , haha,... forgive me, but now I know how I must sound when I go on about how so-and-so just doesn't get the "_____" right, haha!!

Along with the A minor explosion at the end of Mahler's Sixth, it's the single most important chord in 1000 years of classical music. I wish I were kidding 

Sarge

[snyprrr]

Along with the A minor explosion at the end of Mahler's Sixth, it's the single most important chord in 1000 years of classical music. I wish I were kidding 

Sarge

haha!!

[John Whitmore]

I know for certain that symphonies 28 and 31 are on YouTube. If you really like late Brian I can give you a link to no. 27, too. But later - I'm watching my daughter on horseback...

21 is on Youtube as well.

[Dundonnell]

I just did!! Listened to Part 1 - exhilarated, moved, overwhelmed. As for the Vivace and the climax with the three astonishing bars: no, Brabbins doesn't slow down, the central chord isn't center stage here, but more of a tunnel through which the music surges to D minor. I think this means that Brabbins sees that D minor as the ultimate goal. When I heard that climactic moment again just now it felt as if I were lifted by a big hand from one equally high plateau to the next. In short: for Brabbins that second chord is not central. It's somehow typical for him not to 'fetishise' the chord...

I shall listen again to that passage from your suggested perspective and see what I make of it

At the Albert Hall it just seemed to rush past in a second and before one had time to absorb the impact the massed choirs were being bathed in golden light and rising in unison. Because my breath was quite taken away by that spectacle I seemed to have lost the full force of the Vivace passage. Now..without that (admittedly wonderful) distraction I can more properly concentrate on how Brabbins actually does it

[J.Z. Herrenberg]

I shall listen again to that passage from your suggested perspective and see what I make of it

At the Albert Hall it just seemed to rush past in a second and before one had time to absorb the impact the massed choirs were being bathed in golden light and rising in unison. Because my breath was quite taken away by that spectacle I seemed to have lost the full force of the Vivace passage. Now..without that (admittedly wonderful) distraction I can more properly concentrate on how Brabbins actually does it

I think the first two movements in Brabbins' reading are easily the best ever. I got an interesting (fanciful?) association, hearing the opening: it sounds like a written-out rumble of thunder, capped by a flash of lightning - the sound of Brian's flash of inspiration?

Yes, in the RAH things moved extremely quickly, and the spectacle at the climactic passage did distract a bit from the music. But what an unforgettable sight it was, those rising walls of singers!

[Dundonnell]

I think the first two movements in Brabbins' reading are easily the best ever. I got an interesting (fanciful?) association, hearing the opening: it sounds like a written-out rumble of thunder, capped by a flash of lightning - the sound of Brian's flash of inspiration?

Yes, in the RAH things moved extremely quickly, and the spectacle at the climactic passage did distract a bit from the music. But what an unforgettable sight it was, those rising walls of singers!

Literally Breathtaking

[J.Z. Herrenberg]

I agree with one observation made by, I think, the Musicweb reviewer, that in future performances (! when?) the choirs should always rise at the F sharp minor chord, but that the soloists should already be on stage, standing up, too (instead of slowly walking to the front).

[Dundonnell]

Agreed.

Btw my Christmas present to my nephew was the Hyperion Gothic. It arrived the day before he departed for Christmas in Thailand but too late for him to transfer from his laptop to his Ipod Otherwise he would have been listening to it on holiday

[mahler10th]

It's Brian's early unpublished version with snakes playing a very prominent part throughout. Ruins it in my opinion.

John, where is your sound edit copy?  I would be interested to hear it, and of course add it to my Johan "J. Z. Herrenberg" inspired collection!  I haven't listened to Brian for a wee while, which is surprising as I wrote to the RSNO about him and raved like hell hath no enemy when I heard Brian for the first time in 2008 thanks to Johan.