Author Topic: David Hurwitz  (Read 13279 times)

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Offline Scion7

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David Hurwitz
« on: January 11, 2016, 07:42:39 PM »
NB Original post removed, the following is a message from the moderator:

Scion7

I wake up, open the machine and find your post has been reported. I then read through the thread and despite plenty of members pointing out to you how offensive that specific post is, you just leave it there. It was homophobic. That means it is automatically offensive to those here who are gay and to all those who disapprove of homophobic attitudes being expressed; which, as you see, is a fair few. The offensiveness is also against the ethos of this site.

As you did not take all the comments seriously and amend the post; I am writing publicly to you and have basically removed it. It is not on to post material that makes people feel denigrated or uncomfortable.

PM me if you feel the need to continue a discussion on this issue.


Knight
« Last Edit: July 30, 2020, 06:40:19 AM by Que »
Your barricades lie broken ... your enemies lord.

ComposerOfAvantGarde

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Re: David Hurwitz is an ass .....
« Reply #1 on: January 11, 2016, 07:46:50 PM »
I'm guessing you disagree with his views....but your comments makes you worse than whatever he said!

Offline Mirror Image

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Re: David Hurwitz is an ass .....
« Reply #2 on: January 11, 2016, 07:52:42 PM »
Perhaps the best way to deal with Hurwitz is not to deal with him. Give this a shot.

"Pay no attention to what the critics say. A statue has never been erected in honor of a critic." - Jean Sibelius
“Works of art create rules; rules do not create works of art.” - Claude Debussy

Offline Todd

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Re: David Hurwitz is an ass .....
« Reply #3 on: January 11, 2016, 07:58:41 PM »
"Pay no attention to what the critics say. A statue has never been erected in honor of a critic." - Jean Sibelius



No longer true:

The universe is change; life is opinion. - Marcus Aurelius, Meditations

Everything dies - Alien Bounty Hunter, The X-Files

Everyone dies - William Barr, United States Attorney General

Offline Mirror Image

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Re: David Hurwitz is an ass .....
« Reply #4 on: January 11, 2016, 08:00:17 PM »


No longer true:



Well, it's the intention behind Sibelius' comment that remains important, which to me is pretty simple: forget the critics, they simply don't matter.
“Works of art create rules; rules do not create works of art.” - Claude Debussy

Offline Gordo

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Re: David Hurwitz is an ass .....
« Reply #5 on: January 11, 2016, 08:03:07 PM »
Perhaps the best way to deal with Hurwitz is not to deal with him. Give this a shot.

"Pay no attention to what the critics say. A statue has never been erected in honor of a critic." - Jean Sibelius

Well, the highlighted part is actually inaccurate.
Musica lætitiæ comes medicina dolorum
(Music is a companion to joy and a medicine for pains)

Offline Scion7

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Re: David Hurwitz is an ass .....
« Reply #6 on: January 11, 2016, 08:06:24 PM »
Somewhere along the line, a Brit pee'd in his cereal, apparently.  He's constantly bashing us.
Your barricades lie broken ... your enemies lord.

Offline Mirror Image

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Re: David Hurwitz is an ass .....
« Reply #7 on: January 11, 2016, 08:08:37 PM »
Well, the highlighted part is actually inaccurate.

See Reply #4 in this thread. :)
“Works of art create rules; rules do not create works of art.” - Claude Debussy

Online Brian

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Re: David Hurwitz is an ass .....
« Reply #8 on: January 11, 2016, 08:15:18 PM »
Somewhere along the line, a Brit pee'd in his cereal, apparently.  He's constantly bashing us.

Ignoring your strange homophobic remark about pink and which way Hurwitz "swings" (which was uncalled for and frankly offensive):

British critics do have a well-known "circle the wagons" mentality where they protect British artists and composers. Every nationality does this, to some extent, but - to take one example - when BBC Music Magazine listed the "50 Greatest Recordings of All Time," over 35 involved UK performers, composers, or labels. Plus, they also claimed Murray Perahia was British in order to boost their national pride.

Another element here: there is an (admirable?) eagerness among UK listeners to fall madly in love with their eccentric minor composers. Naxos and other label execs have confirmed that it's possible to make a weird amount of money with Bax chamber music, Moeran, various Irish rhapsodies, etc. As an American, I'm nowhere near as proud of people like John Knowles Paine as the Brits are of people like Rutland Boughton. More power to them.

Another element here: with certain notable exceptions (e.g. fire-breathing Guardian food critic Jay Rayner), British critics tend to be incredibly polite. There are code words and phrases used to say nice things about a recording one does not like. (I tend to ignore any album described as "worthy".)

I am an American who is a music critic for a British publication (MusicWeb). I have been writing for MusicWeb, with a team of 40-50 mostly UK-born colleagues, since 2009. I've seen too much stuff like the stuff Dave Hurwitz mocks to get angry at him for saying it.

Offline Mirror Image

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Re: David Hurwitz is an ass .....
« Reply #9 on: January 11, 2016, 08:15:32 PM »
Somewhere along the line, a Brit pee'd in his cereal, apparently.  He's constantly bashing us.

See Reply #2.
“Works of art create rules; rules do not create works of art.” - Claude Debussy

Offline (poco) Sforzando

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Re: David Hurwitz is an ass .....
« Reply #10 on: January 11, 2016, 08:15:59 PM »
Well, the highlighted part is actually inaccurate.

So what? every one here is a critic by virtue of simply participating.
"I don't know what sforzando means, though it clearly means something."

Offline Gordo

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Re: David Hurwitz is an ass .....
« Reply #11 on: January 11, 2016, 08:18:09 PM »
See Reply #4 in this thread. :)

A fair amount of important composers have been also talented critics, remarkably Schumann. Some critics as Theodor Adorno, for instance, have had a huge cultural importance.  :) 
Musica lætitiæ comes medicina dolorum
(Music is a companion to joy and a medicine for pains)

Offline Gordo

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Re: David Hurwitz is an ass .....
« Reply #12 on: January 11, 2016, 08:23:16 PM »
So what? every one here is a critic by virtue of simply participating.

Well, I guess the adjective "professional" is implicit here; not related to any special qualification, but in the sense of doing something as a paid job rather than as a hobby.  :)
Musica lætitiæ comes medicina dolorum
(Music is a companion to joy and a medicine for pains)

Offline (poco) Sforzando

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Re: David Hurwitz is an ass .....
« Reply #13 on: January 11, 2016, 08:24:52 PM »
Somewhere along the line, a Brit pee'd in his cereal, apparently.  He's constantly bashing us.

Oh, boo-hoo. Read what he actually writes, not what you think he writes. The review is actually a damning with faint praise of symphonies by a second-(or lower) tier American composer: http://www.classicstoday.com/review/review-12140/

There's no question, as Brian confirms, that "British critics do have a well-known 'circle the wagons' mentality where they protect British artists and composers." I've seen this repeatedly in BBC Music Magazine, one reason I no longer subscribe. It is a defensive over-reaction to the famous accusation of Britain as "das Land ohne Musik," as if it were necessary or inevitable that musical gifts must be distributed evenly over all the nations. Be happy you've produced some of the world's greatest literature.

And no reason to believe that anyone peed in his cereal. How do you know he even consumes cereal?
« Last Edit: January 11, 2016, 08:26:40 PM by (poco) Sforzando »
"I don't know what sforzando means, though it clearly means something."

Offline Mirror Image

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Re: David Hurwitz is an ass .....
« Reply #14 on: January 11, 2016, 08:25:00 PM »
A fair amount of important composers have been also talented critics, remarkably Schumann. Some critics as Theodor Adorno, for instance, have had a huge cultural importance.  :)

Oh and don't forget Berlioz and Debussy. ;) Anyway, I don't buy into the whole 'cultural importance' point-of-view about music critics and will continue to ignore them. No offense to Brian or Bruce who I know are no strangers to music criticism. :)
“Works of art create rules; rules do not create works of art.” - Claude Debussy

Online Brian

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Re: David Hurwitz is an ass .....
« Reply #15 on: January 11, 2016, 08:28:09 PM »
And no reason to believe that anyone peed in his cereal. How do you know he even consumes cereal?
Same way he presumably knows that Hurwitz "swings that way" and likes pink?

Offline (poco) Sforzando

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Re: David Hurwitz is an ass .....
« Reply #16 on: January 11, 2016, 08:29:01 PM »
Plus, they also claimed Murray Perahia was British in order to boost their national pride.

Next thing you know, they'll say Henry James was a British novelist.
"I don't know what sforzando means, though it clearly means something."

Offline (poco) Sforzando

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Re: David Hurwitz is an ass .....
« Reply #17 on: January 11, 2016, 08:38:39 PM »
Same way he presumably knows that Hurwitz "swings that way" and likes pink?

Regarding the cereal, I am having some difficulty envisioning the mechanics of the situation, much as I have difficulty grasping the mechanics of Beecham's famous metaphor about the skeletons copulating on the tin roof, the genitalia not being part of the skeletal system. Is the cereal to be brought to Mr. Hurwitz pre-peed, as it were, or does the peeing take place while Mr. Hurwitz is eating his Frosted Flakes? If the latter, the bowl is presumably on Mr. H's breakfast table, and the pee-er would have to climb up the table, unzip, and perform the deed. Unless, of course, he collects a sample in a cup and simply pours it on, perhaps with the subterfuge that he is actually sweetening the cereal with apple juice . . . .
« Last Edit: January 11, 2016, 08:43:02 PM by (poco) Sforzando »
"I don't know what sforzando means, though it clearly means something."

Offline mc ukrneal

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Re: David Hurwitz
« Reply #18 on: January 11, 2016, 08:45:43 PM »
First of all, the OP should delete reference to animals with a certain reputation in relation to another human being (and other putdowns). There is no need for personal attacks behind someone's back, especially when that person is not here to defend themselves. It is really uncalled for and diminishes the poster.

Oh, boo-hoo. Read what he actually writes, not what you think he writes. The review is actually a damning with faint praise of symphonies by a second-(or lower) tier American composer: http://www.classicstoday.com/review/review-12140/

There's no question, as Brian confirms, that "British critics do have a well-known 'circle the wagons' mentality where they protect British artists and composers." I've seen this repeatedly in BBC Music Magazine, one reason I no longer subscribe. It is a defensive over-reaction to the famous accusation of Britain as "das Land ohne Musik," as if it were necessary or inevitable that musical gifts must be distributed evenly over all the nations. Be happy you've produced some of the world's greatest literature.

And no reason to believe that anyone peed in his cereal. How do you know he even consumes cereal?
It's a pet peeve of mine, but I really detest when critics go on and on about whether the music should be of interest to me or not. Dislike it? Say it and move on. The reviewer's job is NOT to provide verbose opinions of the composer, but of the disc/performance at hand. Some reference is good: 'sounds like', 'contemporary of', and other references that help the reader understand what type of music the composer composed. But then I guess history is riddled with music critics who think putting others down raises themselves up.

Finally, a lot of people seem to enjoy taking unsubstantiated potshots at British reviewers. It seems to be a filter many have.
« Last Edit: January 11, 2016, 08:47:24 PM by mc ukrneal »
Be kind to your fellow posters!!

Offline Daverz

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Re: David Hurwitz is an ass .....
« Reply #19 on: January 11, 2016, 08:46:48 PM »
Hurwitz is often an ass, but i find nothing problematic in this review and pretty much agree with all of it.  You do want this excellent set if you are interested in Persichetti or American symphonic music, but it's a step below, say, Piston's best.

Labels like Chandos, Dutton, and Naxos do record a lot of forgettable British music that gets good notices from British critics.  At least they do promote their own composers.
« Last Edit: January 11, 2016, 09:08:51 PM by Daverz »