Coronavirus thread

[André]

Soon in your plate: coronavirus infected steak, bacon.

Trump signs executive order to keep meat-processing plants open. Giant plants have been closed in the past few days because of infection. 20 workers dead, 6500 infected so far.


https://www.washingtonpost.com/video/national/trump-orders-meat-processing-plants-to-stay-open-despite-coronavirus-fears/2020/04/29/f219ff05-24c6-49c3-8aa3-fa186a2d4ce6_video.html
2 minute video clip worth watching.

[milk]

'The notion of a quick vaccine or a quick cure has largely evaporated. The Atlantic's Yascha Mounk writes that "our hopes for the pandemic's quick resolution should clearly be shelved. ... COVID-19 is too deadly to let it rip through the population. An effective cure is not in sight. And the federal government is incapable of formulating a coherent pandemic response."'

This leads me to think the next election in the States will be carried out amidst confusion, acrimony and a shocking lack of confidence. It's mayhem to a world system that perceives a pole of power to have sunk, meaning a loss of balance.
I really fear for the mood of things around the world as fatigue sets in and countries and societies lurch forwards and backwards towards more political and medical crises.

[Irons]

I can't imagine what the stress must have been like.  Being the medical director of an ER alone would certainly be rough, I'd think, but then to see people coming in in ambulances that were already dying before they could even be removed?!  She became infected herself, but went back to help.  What a wonderful person and a true hero.  Such a sad ending.

We don't know the half of it, P. You are right "wonderful person".

[André]

More on the subject of the meat processing plants and their workers.

What's really important is to keep that meat coming.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2020/04/29/trumps-latest-executive-order-highlights-our-inequality-crisis/

[Ratliff]

'The notion of a quick vaccine or a quick cure has largely evaporated. The Atlantic's Yascha Mounk writes that "our hopes for the pandemic's quick resolution should clearly be shelved. ... COVID-19 is too deadly to let it rip through the population. An effective cure is not in sight. And the federal government is incapable of formulating a coherent pandemic response."'

Indeed, I grow fatigued of gushing posts about "a vaccine already in clinical trials" or "such and such a drug used to treat toenail fungus showed promising result in Dr. Sousa's clinic in Portugal."

Dr. Fauci's estimate that a vaccine could be available in 18-24 months is optimistic. That would be the fastest effective vaccine development ever, as far as I know. There may never be a vaccine, there may never be herd immunity. This could be normal now, a version of the common cold that has a 0.5% chance of killing you...

[Florestan]

Indeed, I grow fatigued of gushing posts about "a vaccine already in clinical trials" or "such and such a drug used to treat toenail fungus showed promising result in Dr. Sousa's clinic in Portugal."

Dr. Fauci's estimate that a vaccine could be available in 18-24 months is optimistic. That would be the fastest effective vaccine development ever, as far as I know. There may never be a vaccine, there may never be herd immunity. This could be normal now, a version of the common cold that has a 0.5% chance of killing you...

Wisdom.

[Mandryka]

Something to monitor here I think


Covid-19: Patient 26's higher infection rate could be due to virus mutation

https://www.thestar.com.my/news/nation/2020/04/29/covid-19-patient-26039s-higher-infection-rate-could-be-due-to-virus-mutation

[Ratliff]

Something to monitor here I think


Covid-19: Patient 26's higher infection rate could be due to virus mutation

https://www.thestar.com.my/news/nation/2020/04/29/covid-19-patient-26039s-higher-infection-rate-could-be-due-to-virus-mutation

Sounds like they have basically zero evidence to support that conjecture. From what I have read there are a dozen or so strains of the virus in circulation, typically differing from each other by one or two mutated nucleotides. This was described as on the low end of the range of typical mutation rates. You need more than an anecdotal story about a guy who gave it to a bunch of people to justify a claim that the strain is more aggressive.

[Mandryka]

Sounds like they have basically zero evidence to support that conjecture. From what I have read there are a dozen or so strains of the virus in circulation, typically differing from each other by one or two mutated nucleotides. This was described as on the low end of the range of typical mutation rates. You need more than an anecdotal story about a guy who gave it to a bunch of people to justify a claim that the strain is more aggressive.

Yes, I was pleased to find no more on the web about it!

[vandermolen]

Maybe wishful thinking, but I wonder if I've already had the virus. The school where I work includes a pupil whose family were allegedly one of the first to bring the virus over here (UK - from a skiing holiday in Italy). Just before Christmas I developed a persistent dry cough, became very fatigued and suffered from some mental confusion (although my wife tells me that this is my normal state). For example a friend came round unexpectedly to see me, when I was having a nap, and I didn't know whether it was 5.00pm or 5.00am. I told him to leave as I might be infectious. It then went to my chest and eventually I phoned the local surgery who told me to come in to see the prescribing nurse. She listened to my chest and said she could hear the infection very clearly and prescribed me anti-biotics to 'knock it on the head'. I'm aware that anti-biotics are not much use against a virus but, over the next week I got better. I've always assumed that it was just a bad chest infection but it was not like one I'd ever had before. I've assumed that it was too early to be Coronavirus but I was reading yesterday that the disease could have been in Europe as early as November which made me wonder. Having said that I never had a fever or a high temperature but otherwise felt pretty ill. Just a thought.

[Pohjolas Daughter]

Maybe wishful thinking, but I wonder if I've already had the virus. The school where I work includes a pupil whose family were allegedly one of the first to bring the virus over here (UK - from a skiing holiday in Italy). Just before Christmas I developed a persistent dry cough, became very fatigued and suffered from some mental confusion (although my wife tells me that this is my normal state). For example a friend came round unexpectedly to see me, when I was having a nap, and I didn't know whether it was 5.00pm or 5.00am. I told him to leave as I might be infectious. It then went to my chest and eventually I phoned the local surgery who told me to come in to see the prescribing nurse. She listened to my chest and said she could hear the infection very clearly and prescribed me anti-biotics to 'knock it on the head'. I'm aware that anti-biotics are not much use against a virus but, over the next week I got better. I've always assumed that it was just a bad chest infection but it was not like one I'd ever had before. I've assumed that it was too early to be Coronavirus but I was reading yesterday that the disease could have been in Europe as early as November which made me wonder. Having said that I never had a fever or a high temperature but otherwise felt pretty ill. Just a thought.

Interesting Jeffrey.  Do you know when they came back from Italy (was it at the end of a school vacation break?)....and also when you started to feel ill?  And is there any test that you could take that would indicate at this point in time as to whether or not you had had the virus?

Best,

PD

[André]

I experienced something similar around mid-January. I didn't have a fever during the day, but when I got to bed I had shivers, teeth rattling and I couldn't get warm even with a heavy bathrobe on top of my pajamas. That lasted 3 days, then only cough, sore throat and running nose remained. I consulted a doctor and she told me it was the common cold, only a bad one. Symptoms could last 3-4 weeks, she said. I got better, but coughed for 6 weeks. I, too, figured it was way too early for the covid. I wonder.

[Karl Henning]

Indeed, I grow fatigued of gushing posts about "a vaccine already in clinical trials" or "such and such a drug used to treat toenail fungus showed promising result in Dr. Sousa's clinic in Portugal."

Dr. Fauci's estimate that a vaccine could be available in 18-24 months is optimistic. That would be the fastest effective vaccine development ever, as far as I know. There may never be a vaccine, there may never be herd immunity. This could be normal now, a version of the common cold that has a 0.5% chance of killing you...

Solid, Jackson!

[JBS]

There were several large conventions and shows in Las Vegas in December, some of them with participants from China,  and consistent reports afterwards of more than a few attendees coming down with a flu-like illness. Therefore some people are speculating that that was actually an initial wave of COVID19 infections.  As far as know, no deaths were associated with that outbreak, whatever it was.

[Herman]

It's too bad so little testing is done, because one does wonder about these sick spells.

On the other hand there are increasing reports that having had a version of corona doesn't grant immunity.

You could get infected either way, unfortunately.

[Ratliff]

Maybe wishful thinking, but I wonder if I've already had the virus. The school where I work includes a pupil whose family were allegedly one of the first to bring the virus over here (UK - from a skiing holiday in Italy). Just before Christmas I developed a persistent dry cough, became very fatigued and suffered from some mental confusion (although my wife tells me that this is my normal state). For example a friend came round unexpectedly to see me, when I was having a nap, and I didn't know whether it was 5.00pm or 5.00am. I told him to leave as I might be infectious. It then went to my chest and eventually I phoned the local surgery who told me to come in to see the prescribing nurse. She listened to my chest and said she could hear the infection very clearly and prescribed me anti-biotics to 'knock it on the head'. I'm aware that anti-biotics are not much use against a virus but, over the next week I got better. I've always assumed that it was just a bad chest infection but it was not like one I'd ever had before. I've assumed that it was too early to be Coronavirus but I was reading yesterday that the disease could have been in Europe as early as November which made me wonder. Having said that I never had a fever or a high temperature but otherwise felt pretty ill. Just a thought.

Seems like it could be Covid-19, but could be something else. Unfortunately, I gather the antibody tests are in short supply and are of variable reliability. Impossible to know. Hopefully someone is collecting this sort of data.

New York state has done some randomized testing. 13.9% infected, 0.1% have died, 0.7% of people infected have died. Consistent with other sources of data.

[MusicTurner]

Maybe wishful thinking, but I wonder if I've already had the virus. The school where I work includes a pupil whose family were allegedly one of the first to bring the virus over here (UK - from a skiing holiday in Italy). Just before Christmas I developed a persistent dry cough, became very fatigued and suffered from some mental confusion (although my wife tells me that this is my normal state). For example a friend came round unexpectedly to see me, when I was having a nap, and I didn't know whether it was 5.00pm or 5.00am. I told him to leave as I might be infectious. It then went to my chest and eventually I phoned the local surgery who told me to come in to see the prescribing nurse. She listened to my chest and said she could hear the infection very clearly and prescribed me anti-biotics to 'knock it on the head'. I'm aware that anti-biotics are not much use against a virus but, over the next week I got better. I've always assumed that it was just a bad chest infection but it was not like one I'd ever had before. I've assumed that it was too early to be Coronavirus but I was reading yesterday that the disease could have been in Europe as early as November which made me wonder. Having said that I never had a fever or a high temperature but otherwise felt pretty ill. Just a thought.

There were several large conventions and shows in Las Vegas in December, some of them with participants from China,  and consistent reports afterwards of more than a few attendees coming down with a flu-like illness. Therefore some people are speculating that that was actually an initial wave of COVID19 infections.  As far as know, no deaths were associated with that outbreak, whatever it was.

   I was in the Rome region in early December & also had a cold or flu for about 5-6 days, some dry coughing and a very light fever, but no wet nose, which is unusual for me, yet also no breathing problems, besides my very mild asthma, where I'd dropped the medicine for quite some time. I almost never get a flu otherwise, but it must be said that I had taken a very long day-hike without suitably wintery clothes. I did frequent some Chinese shops & a Chinese restaurant some days before getting sick, and I didn't infect anyone else. But though it's probably exaggerated associations, I have been checking regularly, whether information comes up about perhaps earlier (and maybe milder?) outbreaks in Italy ... still, such a thing would also overthrow the established Chinese chronology itself, so it's not very likely, I think.

[Pohjolas Daughter]

Twoyears ago, I had a horrible cold/virus which lasted for several months.  I didn't have a fever but coughing was crazy (I found out that taking an expectorant helped a lot (think that I also took antihistamines and maybe decongestant at one point?).  A number of other people in my town came down with the same thing.  I'm bringing this up just to say that it can be hard to figure out what one has (or had) or didn't have.  First time that I recall getting something like that though.  It just had to run its course.

Feel for the people working in the meat packing industry.  One thought that has crossed my mind lately:  how are things with the smaller (think local and/or free range, etc.) companies?  Anyone here read Upton Sinclair's The Jungle before?  Interesting story on now on Dr. Oz Show about the food chain.  Meat sales are up 43 percent but with (I think that he said) 18% less workers.  From what I understand, at the big plants, there's no way currently that workers can keep 6 feet apart.  I'll put a link to the show when it's over and available.  It's quite interesting!

[Florestan]

As of late January 2020 I had the following symptoms:

--- 38/39 C fever, for 4 days in a row;

--- sore throat (as in, a razor was glued on my throat; each and every swallowing was a torture --- for two days in a row);

--- loss of appetite (for a week I barely ate);

--- extreme physical weakness;

--- I was cured of all this mess with 7-day treatment of antibiotics.

Was it Covid-19?

[ritter]

Well, if antibiotics cured you, it wasn't Covid-19, that's for sure. If you were cured regardless of having taken antibiotics, then perhaps it was...

And good evening to you, good Sir!