Author Topic: Handel...The Harmonious Blacksmith Of Music  (Read 18156 times)

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Offline Bogey

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Re: Handel...The Harmonious Blacksmith Of Music
« Reply #40 on: March 28, 2014, 10:31:37 AM »
I believe I have some Gardiner Handel around here somewhere with an OK postmark on it .  8)
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Offline Bogey

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Re: Handel...The Harmonious Blacksmith Of Music
« Reply #41 on: March 28, 2014, 10:36:43 AM »
Point of the last post is some big names have taken on Handel, but seem
to stop short of in depth explorations.
Except for maybe Hogwood, who wrote a book on him.
There will never be another era like the Golden Age of Hollywood.  We didn't know how to blow up buildings then so we had no choice but to tell great stories with great characters.-Ben Mankiewicz

DavidW

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Re: Handel...The Harmonious Blacksmith Of Music
« Reply #42 on: March 28, 2014, 10:55:26 AM »
I believe I have some Gardiner Handel around here somewhere with an OK postmark on it .  8)

And I some Italian Cantatas... ;D

Offline Bogey

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Re: Handel...The Harmonious Blacksmith Of Music
« Reply #43 on: March 28, 2014, 11:24:02 AM »
And I some Italian Cantatas... ;D

Jacobs anyone?

Just got finished with this recording:



Always fun to read the notes on the history of both pieces.  I have to say that this Water Music definitely has a different sound than my Pinnock recording.  One reason why many of us enjoy multiple efforts on this board.  As I was looking through the notes on the period instrumentation (which they did a cruddy job of listing the musicians' weapons of choice), I noted for the Fireworks an instrument known as the "serpent" played by Douglas Yeo.  Pretty cool:





The American Serpent Players
Douglas Yeo, Craig Kridel, and Steven Silverstein



This one is known as the Anaconda!


Got to get Dave's (Sonic's) take on this bad boy....though I am sure he has already addressed it in another thread. ;D  Not sure which made it onto this recording, but Yeo wrote a whole book on it and has a great page on the instrument!



http://www.yeodoug.com/serpent.html
« Last Edit: March 28, 2014, 12:45:58 PM by Bogey »
There will never be another era like the Golden Age of Hollywood.  We didn't know how to blow up buildings then so we had no choice but to tell great stories with great characters.-Ben Mankiewicz

Offline (: premont :)

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Re: Handel...The Harmonious Blacksmith Of Music
« Reply #44 on: March 28, 2014, 11:52:54 AM »
Paul Lang writes in his introduction of his Handel bio (1963):

The regrettable and incredible fact is that the magnitude of Handel's genius and the avalanche of great music he wrote is scarcely suspected today.  True, he always is bracketed with Bach, but once the we remove the brackets and omit Messiah and two or three other works, we have precious little left.

Makes me think of Vivaldi a bit.   That is, once you dig past the "one hit" you find a lot of music worth having on the shelf. 

I'd love to know of some excellent recordings of Handel's non-vocal music, as so much of what I have is vocal.  Some things I have discovered within the past year or two that I have liked very much:

1. Water/Fireworks Music by Jordi Savall (Alia Vox, sacd)
2. three discs of orchestral music (including Water/Fireworks) by Tafelmusik dir. Jeanne Lamon (in that Vivarte/Sony 6cd w/music also by Vivaldi, Purcell, Geminiani) [two of the editors of GFHandel.org picked these three to be among their 'desert island discs', fwiw]
3. chamber music box (CRD or Brilliant or Passionato...I think they are all the same program)
4. violin sonatas by Manze/Egarr (I need to look at some more recordings of these)
5. orchestral music by Pinnock (Archiv)
6. one of the Warner Handel Edition boxes with organ concertos by Koopman and keyboard music by Scott Ross and Olivier Baumont
7. keyboard suites 1720 by Ludger Remy (CPO, 2cd)

These CDs - I know almost all of them - are IMO some of the best of the available recordings of Händel´s instrumental music. Particularly I appreciate the Pinnock recordings and Remy´s harpsichord recordings. But they do not completely hide the fact, that Händels´s scores aren´t but drafts, upon which the performer was supposd to add stylish variations, passing notes and ornamentation. It must be assumed, that Händel himself was able to do that, but very few performers of to day are. They are just in the initial process of learning how to do, and I think this is the reason why Händel performances often have fallen to the ground. This is also a problem with Vivaldi e.g., but not with Bach, who notated almost everything he wanted the musician to play. So it is a bit unfair to judge Händels instrumental music by Bach´s standard, because Bach´s music is finished, while Händel´s music is unfinished.
Tiden læger alle sår,
heldigt nok at tiden går.

Offline Bogey

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Re: Handel...The Harmonious Blacksmith Of Music
« Reply #45 on: March 28, 2014, 11:57:56 AM »
These CDs - I know almost all of them - are IMO some of the best of the available recordings of Händel´s instrumental music. Particularly I appreciate the Pinnock recordings and Remy´s harpsichord recordings. But they do not completely hide the fact, that Händels´s scores aren´t but drafts, upon which the performer was supposd to add stylish variations, passing notes and ornamentation. It must be assumed, that Händel himself was able to do that, but very few performers of to day are. They are just in the initial process of learning how to do, and I think this is the reason why Händel performances often have fallen to the ground. This is also a problem with Vivaldi e.g., but not with Bach, who notated almost everything he wanted the musician to play. So it is a bit unfair to judge Händels instrumental music by Bach´s standard, because Bach´s music is finished, while Händel´s music is unfinished.

Post of the day.  Love this kind of insight!
There will never be another era like the Golden Age of Hollywood.  We didn't know how to blow up buildings then so we had no choice but to tell great stories with great characters.-Ben Mankiewicz

Offline Octave

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Re: Handel...The Harmonious Blacksmith Of Music
« Reply #46 on: March 28, 2014, 10:38:30 PM »
[...]So it is a bit unfair to judge Händels instrumental music by Bach´s standard, because Bach´s music is finished, while Händel´s music is unfinished.

Thanks for this interesting response.  I'd certainly like to find some unusual performances of the keyboard music where such risks are taken.  I wonder if Blandine Rannou would fulfill the music in this regard?  I say this with memories of her GOLDBERG VARIATIONS [where I have heard so many other performances, hers seems to shine through as remarkable in a sense that I relate to what you are saying], though the comparison is probably unsuitable.

I am also interested in this music on anachronistic instruments, modern pianos etc.

Among all instruments and in addition to Scott Ross and Ludger Remy, I've tried Paul Wolfe, Keith Jarrett, Sviatoslav Richter (EMI/Yedang), Glenn Gould, Paul Nicholson.
I am keen to hear Lisa Smirnova, Borgstede, Egarr's brand new set, and especially Ottavio Dantone.

Aside on the serpent:
I am psyched to try out that Telarc Water/Fire disc with the serpent, Bogey.  I think my only experience with that strange instrument is from the improvising tubist (?) Michel Godard, who has made a number of recordings with the serpent as a primary or double, including some with the jazz oudist Rabih Abou-Khalil.  In fact, a GMGer once posted mention of a Godard record, some kind of Monteverdi experiment.  I am curious about it:


« Last Edit: March 28, 2014, 10:47:33 PM by Octave »
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Offline HIPster

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Re: Handel...The Harmonious Blacksmith Of Music
« Reply #47 on: March 29, 2014, 07:09:29 AM »
Cross-posted from the Recordings You are Considering thread:


Hear are a few Handel recordings I've been eyeing as of late:

Lautten Compagney




La Divina Armonia/Ghielmi


*Is the Pascaille label defunct?  Their recordings seems to be a) expensive in the States and b) go out of print in the blink of an eye. . .


Parley of Instruments/Holman




La Risonanza/Bonizzoni



*Ace amazon reviewer Mike Birman makes a very compelling case for this release and the entire series in general.  Our own Octave engages him in some most excellent and informative Handelian dialogue too (well worth the read for further recommendations).
Aside on the serpent:
I am psyched to try out that Telarc Water/Fire disc with the serpent, Bogey.  I think my only experience with that strange instrument is from the improvising tubist (?) Michel Godard, who has made a number of recordings with the serpent as a primary or double, including some with the jazz oudist Rabih Abou-Khalil.  In fact, a GMGer once posted mention of a Godard record, some kind of Monteverdi experiment.  I am curious about it:




Bows in Octave's direction. ;)

I posted that a while back in the Monteverdi thread. . .  I also have that high on my wish list, but have held off in favor of other Monteverdi releases (of which there have been many  :)).

I believe that Karl Henning posted some info on the serpent as a part of a museum collection he is affiliated with?  Karl, please help me out here!  Thanks.


Offline North Star

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Re: Handel...The Harmonious Blacksmith Of Music
« Reply #48 on: March 29, 2014, 07:37:53 AM »
I know it was a lack of coordination between brain and hand. I was thinking of my previous post and the Op. 1 and I wrote "recorder". I usually make this mistake because in Spanish both instruments have the same name.

That said, I was thinking of Preston.
No wonder I didn't find his recorder sonata recordings :)

Cross-posted from the Recordings You are Considering thread:

Hear are a few Handel recordings I've been eyeing as of late:

La Risonanza/Bonizzoni

*Ace amazon reviewer Mike Birman makes a very compelling case for this release and the entire series in general.  Our own Octave engages him in some most excellent and informative Handelian dialogue too (well worth the read for further recommendations).
Bows in Octave's direction. ;)
And Giordano Bruno doesn't help our wallets, either.
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Offline Gordo

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Re: Handel...The Harmonious Blacksmith Of Music
« Reply #49 on: March 29, 2014, 08:06:56 AM »
No wonder I didn't find his recorder sonata recordings :)

... c'mon, after all I didn't say he was playing the ukelele...  ;)
Musica lætitiæ comes medicina dolorum
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Offline North Star

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Re: Handel...The Harmonious Blacksmith Of Music
« Reply #50 on: March 29, 2014, 08:14:16 AM »
... c'mon, after all I didn't say he was playing the ukulele...  ;)
How about those concertos Vivaldi wrote for it.  0:)
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Offline Gordo

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Re: Handel...The Harmonious Blacksmith Of Music
« Reply #51 on: March 29, 2014, 08:26:52 AM »
How about those concertos Vivaldi wrote for it.  0:)
... yes, those concertos for mandolin are nice.

Also are fine those pieces for mandolin and piano composed by Beethoven. I have a HIP version played by Duilio Galfetti and Diego Fasolis (*).

Anyway, I ignore the specific differences between ukelele and mandolin.

(*) Available on Spotify.

« Last Edit: March 29, 2014, 08:36:55 AM by Gordo »
Musica lætitiæ comes medicina dolorum
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Offline North Star

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Re: Handel...The Harmonious Blacksmith Of Music
« Reply #52 on: March 29, 2014, 08:47:27 AM »
... yes, those concertos for mandolin are nice.
Also are fine those pieces for mandolin and piano composed by Beethoven. I have a HIP version played by Duilio Galfetti and Diego Fasolis (*).
Anyway, I ignore the specific differences between ukelele and mandolin.
(*) Available on Spotify.
The Beethoven pieces I haven't heard, I should try them later (listening to guitar, theorbo, gamba, basse de viol and clavecin now :) )
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Offline Bogey

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Re: Handel...The Harmonious Blacksmith Of Music
« Reply #53 on: March 29, 2014, 08:12:36 PM »
I am a sucker for winds, so this cd found its way onto my shelf today:



OOP, but there are a few of these discs here and there. Not sure if these are the same as on the Regis disc that is also OOP.  From the net:

On returning to Halle Handel became a pupil of Zachau, the cathedral organist, who gave him a thorough training as a composer and as a performer on keyed instruments, the oboe and the violin. Six very good trios for two oboes and bass, which Handel wrote at the age of ten, are extant; and when he himself was shown them by an English admirer who had discovered them, he was much amused and remarked, "I wrote like the devil in those days, and chiefly for the oboe, which was my favorite instrument."
There will never be another era like the Golden Age of Hollywood.  We didn't know how to blow up buildings then so we had no choice but to tell great stories with great characters.-Ben Mankiewicz

Ken B

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Re: Handel...The Harmonious Blacksmith Of Music
« Reply #54 on: March 29, 2014, 08:20:59 PM »
I am a sucker for winds, so this cd found its way onto my shelf today:



OOP, but there are a few of these discs here and there. Not sure if these are the same as on the Regis disc that is also OOP.  From the net:

On returning to Halle Handel became a pupil of Zachau, the cathedral organist, who gave him a thorough training as a composer and as a performer on keyed instruments, the oboe and the violin. Six very good trios for two oboes and bass, which Handel wrote at the age of ten, are extant; and when he himself was shown them by an English admirer who had discovered them, he was much amused and remarked, "I wrote like the devil in those days, and chiefly for the oboe, which was my favorite instrument."
I highly recommend Rota's quintet with flute. Not all winds. Carbotta.

Offline Octave

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Re: Handel...The Harmonious Blacksmith Of Music
« Reply #55 on: March 30, 2014, 05:31:47 PM »
*Ace amazon reviewer Mike Birman makes a very compelling case for this release and the entire series in general.  Our own Octave engages him in some most excellent Handelian dialogue too (well worth the read for further recommendations).

Well, on my end it was more Handelian badgering, but Mike was kind to offer me some suggestions.  I am still getting mileage out of those early (for me) discoveries, a couple of years on.   :)
I remember at least one or two GMGers recommending that HANDEL IN HAMBURG (Helios)....it's on my definite 'to acquire' list.

The Italian Cantatas series from Glossa is fantastic.  Unfortunately I can't remember if I liked that disc more than the others in the series.  I regret that the prices seem to have gotten even higher.  It is exquisite singing and playing.  I don't know if you are a fan of the Emma Kirkby + Chris Hogwood collaboration, but they have a disc of Italian cantatas that is also quite nice, reissued by Eloquence. 
I have heard only samples from Brilliant's recent Italian Cantatas series; they sounded very good, but for the moment that is not on the front burner for me.
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Offline Bogey

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Re: Handel...The Harmonious Blacksmith Of Music
« Reply #56 on: March 30, 2014, 06:11:53 PM »
  I don't know if you are a fan of the Emma Kirkby + Chris Hogwood collaboration, but they have a disc of Italian cantatas that is also quite nice, reissued by Eloquence. 


Truth.
There will never be another era like the Golden Age of Hollywood.  We didn't know how to blow up buildings then so we had no choice but to tell great stories with great characters.-Ben Mankiewicz

DavidW

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Re: Handel...The Harmonious Blacksmith Of Music
« Reply #57 on: March 30, 2014, 07:26:13 PM »
Truth.

That was the cd you shipped me!  That was you right?  Sharing the love for Kirkby?

Offline Octave

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Re: Handel...The Harmonious Blacksmith Of Music
« Reply #58 on: March 30, 2014, 10:19:03 PM »
1.
Bogey got rid of his Kirkby/Hogwood Handel disc!   ???
I support gifting as among the greatest of acts, but WTH.

2.
Bows in Octave's direction. ;)
Yes, thanks for mentioning that one!  Godard seems to be a versatile and adventurous musician, and I don't know that side of his work (the Monteverdi record) at all.  I wonder if it would make a good double-feature with that allegedly really cool ~jazzy Monteverdi record by Christina Pluhar & co. (the one on Virgin).
« Last Edit: March 30, 2014, 10:36:24 PM by Octave »
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Offline HIPster

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Re: Handel...The Harmonious Blacksmith Of Music
« Reply #59 on: March 31, 2014, 04:26:16 PM »
This relatively recent Handel release by Alan Curtis and Il Complesso Barocco is a total joy!



Has just the right blend of vocal and instrumental material.  Sound is vivid and lively in the best possible sense.

A disc I regularly return to.