Coronavirus thread

[prémont]

As it has been described, the virus is expected to survive among non-vaccinated and young people/children, in spite of the high vaccine rate (now 75.9 % of the total population of all ages), and spread from there.

With the vaccines in use to day, the Delta virus is able to survive among vaccinated people too. This may in the long run become the biggest problem.

[prémont]

I might be mistaken, but I believe that although SOME virions can surface on surfaces for up to 72 hours, the number is not considered sufficient to infect anyone after a few hours, and I think it's been demonstrated that fomites are not a significant mode of transmission of SARS-CoV-2. Aerosols, on the other hand, are to my knowledge the single most important mode of transmission for the virus, even more important than large droplets.

Yes, you are right. It's important to add, that masks don't protect against aerosols, only against droplets. Similarly with visors. And aerosols can stay in the air for several hours in contrast to droplets, which fall to the ground within minutes. Hence the importance of ventilation, and the importance of avoiding crowded rooms.

[71 dB]

Why is there a push for ivermectin?

"The Intercept has obtained hundreds of thousands of records from two companies, CadenceHealth.us and Ravkoo. The data indicate patients spent at least $15 million on consultations and medications combined. America's Frontline Doctors (AFLDS), has been spreading highly politicized misinformation about Covid-19 since the summer of 2020. AFLDS's founder, physician Simone Gold, was arrested and charged after the deadly attack on the U.S. Capitol on January 6. She and other doctors have appeared in widely shared videos arguing that the drugs hydroxychloroquine and ivermectin are effective treatments for Covid-19. The extremely partisan group also misleads people about Covid-19 vaccines, which they refer to as "experimental biological agents," and against public health measures like vaccine mandates, masking, social distancing, and restrictions on businesses."

"The foundation for America's Frontline Doctors was laid in a May 11, 2020, conference call between a senior staffer in Trump's reelection campaign and the Republican activist group CNP Action. They reportedly discussed finding "extremely pro-Trump" doctors to go on TV and defend Trump's plan to rapidly reopen the economy despite the more cautious safety guidance coming from the CDC. Then, on June 24 of last year, Gold started an Arizona nonprofit called the Free Speech Foundation with a million-dollar annual budget and fiscal sponsorship from the Tea Party Patriots Foundation. America's Frontline Doctors, which is a project of this nonprofit, launched on July 27, 2020."

https://theintercept.com/2021/09/28/covid-telehealth-hydroxychloroquine-ivermectin-hacked/

So, we have people taking dewormers instead of the vaccine because Trump wanted to stay in the White House. 

[Karl Henning]

So, we have people taking dewormers instead of the vaccine because Trump wanted to stay in the White House. 

That's it exactly, but we've dewormed the White House.

[krummholz]

That's it exactly, but we've dewormed the White House.

Thank goodness!

[Pohjolas Daughter]

That's it exactly, but we've dewormed the White House.

I hope to God that we don't have to do a repeat--like you normally have to do with kittens in order to make sure that they are now worm-free (several applications are required I believe).

PD

[71 dB]

That's it exactly, but we've dewormed the White House.

Hah, yeah, but there are tons of worms left in Congress... ...starting from senators Kyrsten Sinema and Joe Manchin. Thanks to these greedy corrupt assholes it will be hard for Biden to materially improve the lives of regular Americans and everybody knows the more disappointed the voters are at Dems, the more likely it is for the worm to return to the White House in 2025. 

[71 dB]

Corona restrictions have been lifted or loosened in Finland. Cases will probably go up at least temporarily, but the burden to the healthcare system should stay low thanks to the protection given by vaccines. Of all Finns 73.8 % have got at least one vaccine dose and 62.2 % two doses. People older than 45 are really well vaccinated by now, but age group 20-40 should get better vaccinated. Those young adults have a mentality that Covid-19 isn't their concern, but with delta variant it is! 

[Artem]

Concern in terms of passing it onto others or dying from it?

[MusicTurner]

Concern in terms of passing it onto others or dying from it?

Probably 2), then followed by 1) ...

[Artem]

I haven't heard that there was an unusually high number of deaths in Finland among that age group.

[SimonNZ]

Covid antiviral pill halves hospitalisations and deaths, maker says
If approved, Merck's drug would be first simple oral medication shown to be effective against coronavirus

[Holden]

Probably 2), then followed by 1) ...

If you are a fit, healthy 20-40 year old you know that unless you have an underlying medical condition then even if you get Covid you will not be adversely affected. Based on that this group is probably thinking "why get the jab, I don't need it, even if I get Covid I'll be fine." While they are correct this is a very selfish approach because they will be coming into contact with people who are far more vulnerable than them and can easily pass it on.

[MusicTurner]

If you are a fit, healthy 20-40 year old you know that unless you have an underlying medical condition then even if you get Covid you will not be adversely affected. Based on that this group is probably thinking "why get the jab, I don't need it, even if I get Covid I'll be fine." While they are correct this is a very selfish approach because they will be coming into contact with people who are far more vulnerable than them and can easily pass it on.

They're the group getting the virus mainly now here, and there's a possibility for long term health effects when getting the virus, besides the obvious humanism by helping to protect elderly or fragile groups that ought to be a factor.

BTW, development slightly improved here in DK, compared to the worries and prospects earlier in the week, hopefully it will hold.

[71 dB]

I haven't heard that there was an unusually high number of deaths in Finland among that age group.

There isn't, but this is not about deaths.

[Pohjolas Daughter]

Covid antiviral pill halves hospitalisations and deaths, maker says
If approved, Merck's drug would be first simple oral medication shown to be effective against coronavirus

Thank you for that link Simon.  Reading it, I'm rather sceptical as it has been tested on such a small number of people.  Fingers crossed here though.  If it does work, it could make a huge difference!

Just ran across this article this morning:

https://www.cnn.com/2021/10/01/politics/alabama-covid-relief-prison-bills-signed-governor-kay-ivey/index.html

PD

[Mandryka]

With the vaccines in use to day, the Delta virus is able to survive among vaccinated people too. This may in the long run become the biggest problem.

I thought this was quite interesting on what endemicity will look like -- generally I think James Ward has useful things to say

https://twitter.com/JamesWard73/status/1444234690597113859?s=20

[Mandryka]

I thought this was quite interesting on what endemicity will look like -- generally I think James Ward has useful things to say

https://twitter.com/JamesWard73/status/1444234690597113859?s=20

My reading of that is that it shows the importance of vaccination for control. And that's potentially a real problem. I read somewhere that the history of vaccination here shows that the British tend to really want vaccines when they're scared, and be pretty disinterested in them when they're not. You can see that in rates for covid vaccine by age, and the takeup of flu and probably other things like shingles. The covid fear factor is diminishing I think, in all cohorts.

As far as NPIs are concerned, the modelling shows that they don't have a great overall impact unless they're permanent. I just think that most permanent NPIs are a no hoper in most cases, they're either too hard to enforce because no one likes them, or they're too socially damaging. Yes you could put better ventilation everywhere (but where's the cost/benefit analysis?) And yes, you could pay better sick pay (but no chance in the UK without a political opposition)


I'm hoping myself that vaccines and therapies will improve significantly, or there will be a more benign dominant virus mutation. But failing that, I think that there's a good chance vaccine passports will become a permanent feature of society -- especially given that the politicians have a real interest in increasing social surveillance and control anyway.

Brave new totalitarian capitalist world, here we come.

[Mandryka]

[Pohjolas Daughter]

Yes, that made the news around here---maybe a week or so ago?  Hard to keep track of time these days.  By the way, in case anyone here doesn't know, the ad campaign was created by someone else (I forget who).  That's a fake funeral home.  Wonder how many people got the point and then got the jab?

PD