Bach Better Than Handel

[Dr. Dread]

One of my favorite Handel operas:





The work impresses most with its depth, color, and invention, not its fireworks.

Thanks, Don! I appreciate it. Noted and wish-listed.

[max]

I think there are some people who prefer Handel who vote for Bach simply because the latter seems more "intellectual", who suck-up just like those who super-praise Shakespeare - who deserves it btw - just because he's got the longest article in the encyclopedia.

Then again there are those like Haydn and Beethoven who considered Handel "the Master of all" in spite of the great respect they had for Bach. The exception may have been Mozart. I'm not certain on this but if he had a God, I think it was Bach whose influence is all over the C minor Mass.

In any event, in spite of being contemporaries, they are so different from each other that I would not have two of the same but prefer each on his own merits which is a greater diapason than having another clone of the one we consider greater. There is Bach and there is Handel. Though there was the propensity of both to look down on others, I have no doubt they would have faced each other as equals.   

[Josquin des Prez]

I think there are some people who prefer Handel who vote for Bach simply because the latter seems more "intellectual"

What you mean "seems".

[prémont]

It has recently been proven, that Händel was greater than Bach. Anthropological studies have shown, that Händel´s height was 176 cm, Bachs height a mere 173 cm. And estimates made on the basis of contemporary paintings show, that Händel must have weighed almost 110 kg. and Bach only 96 kg.

We met a jubilant group of Händel fans led by the uncompromising Corkster. This is what I always told you, - you Bachsters, he said in an improvised interview, it was you that prompted this investigation, but now you have certainly made a Rod for your own Bach.

Topic exhausted.

[max]

What you mean "seems".

I call your "seems" and raise you my own...or is it the other way around??

[Coopmv]

It has recently been proven, that Händel was greater than Bach. Anthropological studies have shown, that Händel´s height was 176 cm, Bachs height a mere 173 cm. And estimates made on the basis of contemporary paintings show, that Händel must have weighed almost 110 kg. and Bach only 96 kg.

We met a jubilant group of Händel fans led by the uncompromising Corkster. This is what I always told you, - you Bachsters, he said in an improvised interview, it was you that prompted this investigation, but now you have certainly made a Rod for your own Bach.

Topic exhausted.

Finding it convenient to dine at a tavern, Handel ordered dinner for three. The wait became so long, he became impatient and sent for the host. "Why do you keep me so long waiting?" he asked, with the impetuosity of a hungry man. "We are waiting till the company arrives," replied the innkeeper.

"Then bring up the dinner, prestissimo, said Handel, "I am the company."

[Coopmv]

Here is a link with various anecdotes about Handel, enjoy!

http://gfhandel.org/anecdotes.htm#Quotes%20attributed%20to%20Handel

[Lethevich]

Handel does seem to have had a more colourful life - he managed to almost die in a duel as well...

[knight66]

Dave, Handel wrote two sets of organ concerti. They are delightful; perhaps you might give them a try.

He was a great organist and frequent extemporised movements that were woven into some of his larger pieces; these are of course lost to us. But those concerti will keep you nicely entertained if it is something nearer a chamber scale that you want.

Mike

[Coopmv]

Dave, Handel wrote two sets of organ concerti. They are delightful; perhaps you might give them a try.

He was a great organist and frequent extemporised movements that were woven into some of his larger pieces; these are of course lost to us. But those concerti will keep you nicely entertained if it is something nearer a chamber scale that you want.

Mike

I have these works by Chorzempa (4 SACD's) and Simon Preston on DG.  They are lighter than most JS Bach organ works and are quite nice ...

[knight66]

Oh dear, 'quite nice' makes them sound like they are not really worth bothering with. I rate them higher than you suggest, charming, tuneful, memorable.

I also have Preston and would recommend that set; though I have nothing to compare it with.

Mike

[Coopmv]

Oh dear, 'quite nice' makes them sound like they are not really worth bothering with. I rate them higher than you suggest, charming, tuneful, memorable.

I also have Preston and would recommend that set; though I have nothing to compare it with.

Mike

Actually I have a 3-CD set of these works by Ton Koopman as well in addition to Chorzempa's and Preston's.  Handel is one of my all-time favorite composers in addition to JS Bach.  This explains why I have most of the Handel's oratorios ever recorded ...

[Dr. Dread]

Dave, Handel wrote two sets of organ concerti. They are delightful; perhaps you might give them a try.

He was a great organist and frequent extemporised movements that were woven into some of his larger pieces; these are of course lost to us. But those concerti will keep you nicely entertained if it is something nearer a chamber scale that you want.

Mike

Thanks. Recording?

[knight66]

Dave, I have Simon Preston; Coopmv has several different recordings and may be able to explain their different merits. I like the Preston, though it is now over 30 years old.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Handel-Complete-Organ-Concertos-Simon-Preston/dp/B000065TV0/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&s=music&qid=1237729595&sr=1-2

This is chamber organ music, not from an organ that is tasked with filling a cathedral.

Mike

[Coopmv]

Dave, I have Simon Preston; Coopmv has several different recordings and may be able to explain their different merits. I like the Preston, though it is now over 30 years old.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Handel-Complete-Organ-Concertos-Simon-Preston/dp/B000065TV0/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&s=music&qid=1237729595&sr=1-2

This is chamber organ music, not from an organ that is tasked with filling a cathedral.

Mike

Exactly.  I read some times ago that Handel often played these organ works (personally) to entertain his audiences during intermissions of his oratorio performances ...

[prémont]

I like the Preston, though it is now over 30 years old.

Would you mind to write the exact year of the recording?

[prémont]

 

Exactly.  I read some times ago that Handel often played these organ works (personally) to entertain his audiences during intermissions of his oratorio performances ...

True, and the probably best part of it, his improvisations, have not survived.

[Coopmv]

True, and the probably best part of it, his improvisations, have not survived.

There is no doubt that no two performances of the same organ work were alike ...

[prémont]

 

There is no doubt that no two performances of the same organ work were alike ...

Yes, and this is one of the great problems in a modern recording of Händels organ concertos on CD. You hear the more or less gifted organist´s same "improvisations" over and over. In some way unfair to the music.

This is also why I (e.g.) prefer Beethoven´s piano concertos performed with LvB´s own cadenzas. This has at least got the mark of authenticity.

[knight66]

Would you mind to write the exact year of the recording?

1983....only 26 years ago.

Mike